Keith Wardill 1
@keithwardill1
Hi, Bob W (Tigermoth),
Interesting to read about your new C3 – despite all that has been written about the ‘chinamen’, there are a lot of people out there who use them.
If you are like many owners, you will find out after a time that there are some shortcomings with the C3, depending on the supplier – I know I made loads of modifications and additions to mine. If you are interested, there is tons of info on mods, improvements etc on the web (Google 7 x 12 lathe) – the two sites below have lots of useful info, and might give you a few ideas.
The best improvement I made was (I think), replacing the headstock shaft with better (taper-roller) bearings, but I understand ArcEuroTrade does that anyway with their machines. Another good mod was to put ballbearings in the cross-slide/saddle drive, and also to modify the drive-nut under the cross-slide to take out back-lash – this gets steadily worse on some models, as the nut wears.
Keith
David Clark 13
@davidclark13
Hi There
I use the 100mm version of the precision vice
It is not expensive and seems very accurate.
regards david
Dinosaur Engineer
@dinosaurengineer
Just checked Arc Euro Trade website details :-
P/No. 060 080 00600 M8 x 1.25 £4 for set ! Tel 0116 269 5693
They do seem very cheap !
Robbo
@robbo
re “it’s a nice strap wrench” – this type is available fromArc Euro Trade.
I use the widely available “Boa-Constrictor” strap, it has a rubber belt whcih grips better than leather, and the large size gives terrific leverage.
I noticed the “wrong way round “pic as well, but declined to comment.
Phil
Edited By Robbo on 24/08/2010 15:33:59
NJH
@njh
ARC Eurotrade sell diamond core drills – the smallest is 3mm. I used one of these recently when I broke off a tap in the Stent I am building. The drill was destroyed in the process but it got the broken tap out !
Good luck
Norman
Martin W
@martinw
James
Below is an extract from a post I made in another thread on this site. Both the units I bought were ‘metric’ and there were no problems regarding oddities in dial graduations though I have seen reference to this problem on some other imported machines; I think if my memory serves me correctly they were machines with ‘imperial’ graduations.
Both machines have a small amount of backlash in the lead screws but this is only a thou or so and this is to be expected on any machine; adjusting backlash on either machine is very simple. All the ways that are a ‘bearing surface’ are clean and nicely machined or ground with the lathe bed being hardened which I regard as a bonus.
“I bought a small lathe from Chester, the DB7V, and there was no sign of sand or any other unwanted material/debris, the same applies to the mill I bought from Warco. Both of these machines are of Chinese origin and were delivered in a clean and effectively ready to run state. A clean down of the protective grease and slight adjustment of the gib strips on the lathe after a trial run and they are both performing brilliantly. The chuck on the lathe has minimal run out, well within the test limits, using different diameter ground silver steel bars.
The support from both companies is, imo, second to none with no query seemingly too trivial. If it had not been for these companies offering Chinese produced lathes then I probably would not have bothered to purchase any machine. The thought of buying a second hand machine, which would have been my only option, with no guarantee, no support, no accuracy report and no indication of usage does nothing but fill me with trepidation. What I now have are machines that were affordable, have a full back up and should something go amiss I have recourse to getting it fixed.
Arc Euro offer similar machines but also offer a full pre-delivery service, at a cost admittedly, but still cheaper than Myford. This is not to knock Myford as I would prefer to buy British but at their prices they were totally out of reach. It strikes me that some people are quick to condemn eastern products on the experience of one or two bad press reports.”
Please note that I am a ‘Hobby Engineer’ and have limited experience in this field. The normal personal disclaimers apply re associations with any of the companies etc.
As Alan says ‘get the biggest you can afford or accommodate in your workshop’
Hope the above ramblings help a bit
.
Regards
Martin
Bogstandard
@bogstandard
Tony,
You will find that a 3MT is classed as a self locking taper, that is where if both male and female are in good condition, they will lock up almost solid just by pushing up on the taper.
That is how most MT quills work in milling machines, and so does not require the tang to tighten up, just either a method of locking the quill while you tighten up on the drawbar, or a spanner on your toolholder which will do the same sort of thing.
The tang fitting is also standard in most mills with an MT taper, that is so the mill can be used as a drilling machine using the larger sizes of drills that have an MT taper and tang. That allows you to quickly change drills by using a tapered drift thru the slots in the side of the quill to release the drill rather than having to undo a drawbar.
So you should find that your MT tapered tooling without tangs should work just fine using the drawbar you have.
But you must take care which type of thread is used on your drawbar, because tooling can normally come with two different types, and you will have to get another drawbar turned up with the other thread on, just so that you can mount either type into your machine.
Have a look at the top ones on here, it shows that you can order one of two types for MT3, one with a M12 thread or another with 3/8″ Whitworth. I would suspect your drawbar, as it is continental, to have an M12 thread.
Just a warning, unless you have a self ejector on your drawbar, it can take some serious persuasion to get the MT taper to seperate, and I would suggest you invest in a good dead blow or lead hammer, to prevent damage to the drawbar top.
I hope this helps.
Tigermoth
@tigermoth
I hit the buy button on Friday and my new lathe arrived today from Arceurotrade. It’s a Super C3 and is my first lathe.
I checked that the motor ran both ways – seemed smooth and fairly quiet because of the brushless motor. Frank Hoose in reviewing the smaller brushless C2 suggested it sounded like a sewing machine – I think that’s a good description.
The machiine is now fully stripped down and cleaned. That’s the easy bit. The machine came coated with an oil and not the dreaded red grease which I have read about . I did find some of the red grease though – on the carriage stop – and oh boy, was it messy, even for a very small item!
The rebuild and adjustments start tomorrow and by the time I’m finished, I should be much more familiar with the machine.
Dave Fenner’s book (The Mini Lathe) has been very useful, as has the Arceurotrade download for setting up the machine.
Bob W
Martin W
@martinw
Hi
Apples and oranges YES but I bought a small lathe from Chester, the DB7V, and there was no sign of sand or any other unwanted material/debris, the same applies to the mill I bought from Warco. Both of these machines are of Chinese origin and were delivered in a clean and effectively ready to run state. A clean down of the protective grease and slight adjustment of the gib strips on the lathe after a trial run and they are both performing brilliantly. The chuck on the lathe has minimal run out, well within the test limits, using different diameter ground silver steel bars.
The support from both companies is, imo, second to none with no query seemingly too trivial. If it had not been for these companies offering Chinese produced lathes then I probably would not have bothered to purchase any machine. The thought of buying a second hand machine, which would have been my only option, with no guarantee, no support, no accuracy report and no indication of usage does nothing but fill me with trepidation. What I now have are machines that were affordable, have a full back up and should something go amiss I have recourse to getting it fixed.
Arc Euro offer similar machines but also offer a full pre-delivery service, at a cost admittedly, but still cheaper than Myford. This is not to knock Myford as I would prefer to buy British but at their prices they were totally out of reach. It strikes me that some people are quick to condemn eastern products on the experience of one or two bad press reports.
I would suggest that the comments made, in another thread, by Bogstandard should be read. Unlike me he is an experienced engineer who sets very high standards and yet he finds that eastern machines meet his criteria.
Will end my ramblings now and retire.
Cheers
Martin
Edited By Martin W on 04/08/2010 01:43:21
Ralph Koch
@ralphkoch79118
I have looked on the web and found KIT-Q-CUT from Greenwood and Glanze from Chronos. I have also thought about HSS toolbits, but they seem to be hard to find in medium size.
I would like to hear from someone with experience with theese, because i have only tried the 8mm parting off tool from Arc Eurotrade and it seems to be too small and suffer from rigidity. I have a Sieg C6 lathe.
Bogstandard
@bogstandard
John,
The Arc Euro collets that Jason has shown you fit the collet sets sold by Chester UK.
The first sets shown on this page,
If you have any missing, maybe a call to Chester UK will help
Bogs
JasonB
@jasonb
John there are some collets that are very similar to ERs that some of the imported sets use, sizes are on ARC’s site, you may have these
Jason
Terryd
@terryd72465
Hi Mark,
Why not Chinese? I have a Boxford lathe, which is excellent, a Chinese Small lathe From Arc Eurotrade and a Chinese mill. I have had no issues with my Chinese equipment and find the machines to be good quality and accurate. I wouldn’t use them for production work but for my hobby work they fulfil everything I could ask of them.
Buying obscure machines which have been out of production for years is not always a good idea as spares can be very difficult to obtain and if they are available they will be at such a price as to make your eyes water and wish you had bought Myford.
I have been buying Chinese tools for over 30 years now and have found them to be good value, so far long lasting and of an acceptable quality. (I have been abusing Chinese screwdrivers for over 25 years and they have lasted longer than my Record, British made ones).
My machines will produce high quality accurate work, what more can one ask. By the way my small Chinese lathe will handle items up to 250 mm dia as opposed to my Boxford’s 225 mm but the bed is shorter. and can only handle up to 250mm length which is more than enough for most of my work. The Far eastern machines represent excellent value for money, easily available spares and tooling, combined with generally good quality.
Terry
Edited By Terryd on 24/06/2010 16:25:29
Edited By Terryd on 24/06/2010 16:28:55
Terryd
@terryd72465
As far a companies are concerned you could also look at Arc Eurotrade, They have a similar range of the smaller machines to other companies as I think that they are Sieg machines which have been renamed for the company.
Most of the small milling machines and lathes from all of these companies are either Sieg or Weiss with slight variations as specified by the sellers. Arc are based in Leicester. Most of these companies have very good customer relations and are reliable.
Warco and Axminster are also good I believe but I have never dealt with them.
Terry
Clive Farrar
@clivefarrar90441
Well chaps I have just started to convert mine to belt drive.
I have the drawings and info from John Rudd I will need some carefull thought to mod these to suit my WARCO due to the spped controller box location.
I have stripped it all down today and after extracting the small gear that had broken into about 20 bits and removed 4 teath from the other gear.
The first job was to replace the bearings with taper rollers.
My bottom ball bearing also fell apart when removing the shaft from the head. The inner race was a VERY tight fit on the shaft. If I did not have a No3 broach press I would not have got it apart.
They have been replaced with Nachi H-E30206J bearings from ARC Eurotrade. These are exactly the same as those used in the mini lathe, as mentioned above.
I also needed the press to get them back on. Fitting these has reduced the length of shaft above the bearing by approx 4 mm.
As I have no intention of using gears ever again I have removed the layshaft from the head.
I have left the small bearing in the head and blanked the centres with grommets.
I know the tapers are open at the bottom but so are the ball bearings and the metal fling washer and plastic collar over the bearing obviously do their job as there was NO contamination in the old ball race.
If only the rest of the mod would go as easily.
Regards Clive
pfav
@pfav
Hi all,
I just subscribe the forum, and I am a novice.
I start metalworking in support to my interest on Kites.
2 years ago, I bought a mini lathe (C3 like) and after one years a minimill.
I bought a 2nd hand minimill that is the same as XJ9512 (WARCO — italian version is FERVI T058).
Using slitting saw I broken spindle gear.
I start replace the gears and I’m thinking to use metal gears on spindle and plastic on counter-shaft.
After remove the spindle I found a problem: bottom bearing is damaged (may by some metal or plastic garbage inside the bearing ).
Looking mill head assembly, let me say “It is normal !”.
I try to find a replacement and for an SKF 7206 AC I have to pay Euro 150.00!!!
Now, some considerations.
The bearing position require a sealed version, but the 72xx model doesn’t have sealed version.
The tapered version, more cheap, has the same problem.
There is not space to use sealing ring !
Considering the overall machine precision, SKF customer service suggested me to use 2 6206 2ZR. The maximum axial load is around 200Kg and a skf ball bearing is more precise of a Chinese 7206!
What do you think about my ideas on gears and bearings?
regards
Paolo
pfav
@pfav
Hi all,
I just subscribe the forum, and I am a novice.
I start metalworking in support to my interest on Kite.
2 years ago, I bought a mini lathe (C3 like) and after one years a minimill.
I bought a 2nd hand minimill that is the same model as warco.
Using slitting saw I broken spindle gear.
I start replace the gears and I’m thinking to use metal gears on spindle and plastic on coutershaft.
After remove the spindle i found a problem: bottom bearing is damaged (may by some metal or plastic garbage)
I try to find a replacement and for an SKF 7206 AC I have to pay Euro 150.00!!!
Now some considerations:
the bearing position require a sealed version, but the 72xx model doesn’t have sealed version.
The tapered version, more cheap, has the same problem.
There is not space to use sealing ring.
Considering the overall machine precision, the SKF expert suggested me to use 2 6206 2ZR. The axial load is around 200Kg and a skf ball bearing is more precise of a Chinese 7206!
What do you thinks ?
regards
Paolo
Fred Miller
@fredmiller19582
Hi everybody with a MEW Digital Archive gripes. Is that true it only goes to 146 ? I thought it was just one of the many problems I always get on MEW website. I payed me money but can only get to 146 onward and I’ve got all them on paper issues. When I have a look at the ones you can get, it takes for ever to get a page first its a plain white and you wait ages for it to come up if I wanted to see the whole issue it would take hours. The whole website is like this some times it takes 4-5 minutes just to get started, and trying to go from item to another some times is impossiable. Even this letter is a second attempt , yesterday I hit “Add Posting” the ‘indicator’ went around and around and in the end the the computer window came up “Window Explorer cannot read this website” I do not have these problems with other advertised websites (Chronos, ArcEuroTrading ect ect,). I know Australia is a longway from Orpington and my computer is a bit old but there must be somene out there who can find an answer to these problems. FRED.
Edited By Fred Miller on 01/06/2010 08:20:53
colin rawson
@colinrawson10944
I should be getting my new to me any way myford s7
in about 2 weeks
its a power cross feed version
ive been looking at this toolpost
and ive asked at a few forums about it
the model 100 toolpost will this fit if i make a top hat type adapter 7/16bsf threaded
ive tried the dickson type toolpost and ive not got on very well with it
on my chineese lathe
not sure if it because ive only got the use of 1 arm thought this might be easier
please help me to see if it will fit
so i can purchase ready for when i get the machine
thanks colin
Dunc
@dunc
While I now have larger equipment, I “cut my teeth” on a C3 (aka mini-lathe) equivalent and I still have it ready to use. There is a newer version with a more powerful – and simplified – motor/drive assembly that may address the torque issue at low speeds. Dave Fenner has a look at it in Model Engineers’ Workshop (MEW) #163 (An Improved Mini-Lathe from Sieg). Incidentally, the same author wrote an excellent series of articles in MEW of numerous improvements to the (original) lathe beginning around Dec 2007-Jan 2008 – I think.Visit
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/reviews/C3_Articles.html to read part 1 of the series.
There is also a Yahoo group dedicated to the machine at
Of course, only you can decide what is too big or small. Above this lathe, size/weight begin to increase substantially ( mini = 40 Kg; next up:100 mm center height = 100+ Kg) – tends to restrict mobility.
As I am in Canada I can’t provide any direct comments about where to buy. These forums have a number of advertisers and a copy of MEW should provide many more. The usual disclaimers, please.
Terryd
@terryd72465
Thanks Andy,
I have a Boxford Myself and have done no end of work of all size and shape on that but thought I would treat myself to a second lathe for small, easy to set up components. The C1 looks good value for money (and the tooling seems not a bad price either), especially the latest offer from Arc Eurotrade at £261.00. As you say it’s not a Cowells but…………
I think that after your posting I may well pop up to A E and have a closer look. I’m getting tempted
.
I’ll let you know how I get on.
Terry
Terryd
@terryd72465
hI ramon,
Thanks for sharing your engines with us. It’s been an inspiration watching those little lumps of metal from your first postings grow into such lovely things. Your experiences with anodising have also been interesting, seeing all of those experiments and failures leading to such a success. let us know how the dyes last or if there is any fading over time, I’d be really interested
I don’t mind the occasional dig from Circlip, I enjoy his posts and he’s been really helpful at times.
.
I’ve now cracked the ‘short’ link process.
As I have said, I’m always ready to learn new skills. Nor do I mind taking the rise out of myself. When one has taught for nearly 40 years one learns humility. Unlike some others around on forums
Here’s a (hopefully) ‘short’ link to the C1 lathe at Arc Eurotrade:
Easy Peasy (cross fingers , I hope it works!!!)
Best regards and thanks,
Terry
Edited By Terryd on 22/05/2010 03:34:48
Edited By Terryd on 22/05/2010 03:35:55
Terryd
@terryd72465
I’m sorry if this has been done before but I have tried a search in the forums and had no results.
Is the Seig C1 as sold by Arc Eurotrade any good? I was thinking of purchasing a small lathe to complement my workshop, What do others think of this machine? Is it any good for small, lightweight work? Any other suggestions apart from the Seig. Price is important as I would only use it occasionally
Any comments appreciated as I haven’t seen one myself.
Terry
Terryd
@terryd72465
Hi there,
As you say you are a novice and I’m not quite sure that you understand the concepts here. Excuse me if I speak out of turn but I am trying to be positive. These videos show a computer controlled milling machine being used, not a ‘good quality’ manual one. These cnc machines are very different to a normal manual milling machine. A basic small cnc milling machine will set you back 2 to 3 thousand pounds. See the example KX1 cnc here and check out the size:
A manual machine can be converted to cnc but it will cost. Probably several hundred pounds upwards and then there is the computer and software. You need three ballscrews (about £150 each) a stepper motor for each (say £30 each) and a control board as a minimum, a pc and software (£100 to £300 say). And then some expertise to set it all up and program it. See here for some sample prices:
Of course you then need to buy the tool holding device shown on the video and the necessary tooling. A small to medium sized lathe would cost much less, and if you’re only going to turn small components a mini lathe which is very small, take up little space and is inexpensive (probably less than the tooling shown on the video and not much more than the cost of one ball screw), would be ideal. See here:
I’m sorry if I sound negative but a manual Milling machine is just not equipped for accurate turning, you are making a rod for your own back. I’ve shown Arc Euro trade stuff simply as an example but these components and this equipment are available all over the internet.
Best regards and good luck,
Terry
Keith Wardill 1
David Clark 13
Dinosaur Engineer
Robbo
NJH
Martin W
.
Bogstandard
Tigermoth
Ralph Koch
JasonB
Terryd
Clive Farrar
pfav
Fred Miller
colin rawson
Dunc
. Perhaps I’ll do what she does, put it away for a couple of months then when she sees it I just say nonchalantly ‘Oh I’ve had it ages’
Andrew Skinner
John Haine
Roger Hart
berwick
alecs
Nigel Graham 2
Graham Meek
Dr_GMJN
JasonB
greenhills
not done it yet
jimalm
Bob Worsley
duncan webster 1
Mark Rand
Bill Phinn
Wade Beatty
anoddcog
Blue Heeler
David George 1
Colin Heseltine
troy h
Baz
Tris Summers
Dalboy
Kevan Shaw
Neil Wyatt
Pete Rimmer
Gary Wooding
ksw
Howard Lewis
Michael Gilligan
rikt
Pete
homecat88
Clive Foster
Oily Rag
ega
