Search Results for 'arc euro'

[Joe McKeanParticipant @joemckean81940]

Hi and thanks to everyone for their opinions on my last question.

I have now purchased a Sieg super C3 without any tooling or accessories so that I would not be tempted to cut corners and have a little play, it is now stripped down and cleaned which brings me to my next question(s)

1) What do I use to lap the cross and topsides with and do I use any lubricant with it.

2)What size centre drill should I use to drill the leadscrew bearing with to help with lubrication.

3)What size tooling should I start off with and what is the difference in use between 4, 6, and 8mm sizes.

and finally (well for the moment anyway) is the starter tool set sold by arceurotrade half decent for a total beginner to start off with.

as I have already mentioned I am a total beginner so please go easy on me for asking what you might think is stupid questions.

Regards

Joe

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

What I don't like about this thread is certain critical comments about it from a few people when it has had 80506 views.

The other unfortunate aspect is that it has given rise to comments about Optimum in other threads when in real terms 1 lathe doesn't really say anything at all about the general quality of the brand. The same sort of thing might happen on any brand at any price level. Fact, the initial fault on this lathe was pretty simple and caused others. I suspect that the current one is down to Brian – not noticing that something had changed and then leaping in. There was another similar case on another brand where it sounds like some one leapt in and tried to cure a warped bed by modifying the tail stock. That one wasn't helped by some crackpot tests and fixes that seem to be about on the web. I've no idea where he got them from but it's pretty clear what he should have done before doing anything.

In the UK and the rest of Europe if some one sells something with faults like these they have no option other than to take them back and pay the carriage costs. It's the same on Ebay except on auctions where the buyer has to pay the return costs. If it's the same in Oz chances are in Brian's case they might just send a new lathe – always difficult 'cause some people tell lies. People also return things because they have changed their mind. This makes retailers sob. Sensible ones account for it in what they charge for the items they have a rough idea how often it will happen and will also probably recoup their costs by selling it at a reduced price or throw it away if it's duff.

The relative cost of items comes into it as well. I know of a case of half a dozen chucks going back to a retailer with stripped scrolls. Who ever bought them expected the very best at a fraction of the cost. Maybe they were replaced and some manager somewhere had rather a lot of strong words to say to his workforce. Maybe the retailer refunded and refused to supply replacements. I wouldn't blame him.

John F. If I remember correctly Arc used to charge for cleaning the preservatives off. I don't think they do any more so I assume they come in relatively clean.

John

–

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

Posted by Graeme Barton 1 on 24/03/2016 19:58:16:

Hi,

Budget around the £1000-£1500

.

At the top end of that scale these :- **LINK** are highly regarded by their owners.

Not too big yet large enough to do anything required upon a motorbike.

I have a VM30 and while I am very pleased with it at times the lack of a quill can reduce it's flexability.

Nick

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

I'm impressed with my slit saw. Mainly.

It's actually worked well, cuts smoothly and to a reasonable depth. I got through my 20mm thick piece without much trouble.

Where I did have an issue was with mounting the piece to be cut. The Arbour (link) is quite clunky and I actually came unstuck with a later cut because the nut at the bottom touched part of the web of my bigger vice (a 4 inch drill press vice), came partly unscrewed, led to a jam, which stripped my mill gears. Again. Still, there is no concern about the blade shattering with this mill! I must admit I'm not very clear on why this arbour is so complicated (lots of rings) and more particularly how to mount pieces in future. Maybe I need to make a vice for the purpose(another mini project)! Or use a shorter nut. Hmmmm.

What I made was this

It's a £10 lamp from B&Q with the base cut off and a couple of clamps (one for right-left, one for up-down) formed by splitting the two blocks down the hole of an appropriate diameter for rod to mount on the mill top and the lamp stand..

At the moment it seems to work quite well, though I'm tempted to replace the lock not with a nut-on-a-lever (whatever the right name is) so I can slide the light up and down as well.

Iain

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

Posted by Piero Franchi on 22/03/2016 07:45:15:

Hope this is ok, but here is the flea bay link to the set,

one thing I did note, it does not specify a tollerance

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361358171050?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Makes them just under £4 each. You won't get them any cheaper than that but as you say no mention of run-out. Arc euro do them at £5 each and they seem decent. I'll message you the link to the Swiss made ones I bought.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 20/03/2016 17:00:58:

I don't bother with making the Closing Nut, too complcated, so just buy from Arc EuroTrade.

Don't blame you. My first time I made a closing nut and it took four specially ground toolbits from 1/8" HSS!

 

Next two closing nuts both ball bearing ones – one from Gloucester one from Arc

Also made an 8/82 degree square especially for setting myu top slide to the taper for both ER sockets and making my own 'emergency' collets.

Neil

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 20/03/2016 21:18:49

[Tim StevensParticipant @timstevens64731]

Just 2 comments on earlier parts of this thread:

I think I read somewhere that number drills were arranged to fill in the gaps between the 'standard' imperial drill sizes measured in sixty-fourths of an inch. So, where there is a big jump in size it is likely to be a fractional size (which you are assumed to have got already for Christmas from Grandma). I have not checked this info, and the long winter evenings are behind us, so …

And yes, some taps are made to cut a reduced thread to start with – usually the outer surface is ground off. This makes it easier to tap difficult metals like stainless. The name for these taps is 'Serial Taps' and the taper and second ones have one and two rings around the end next to the square. ArcEuro has some in his catalogue.

Regards, Tim

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

ER25 maximum holding size is 16mm, ER32 is 20mm.

An ER collet Chuck for a lathe will be backplate mounted, and so allow material to pass through into the Headstock. As Roderick says, 15mm for Series 7 Myfords, so ER25, (unless you have one of the later 4MT Super Sigmas in which case ER32, possibly ER40)

An ER Collet chuck for a Mill mounts on an arbor, and is intended to hold cutters, and so has no through bore.

ER collets are very useful, they have a range of 1mm, (except in the smaller sizes, such ER11 or 16) so can be used to hold Metric or Imperial sizes.

You can make up your own holders, for specific purposes. (such as drill grinding) They all use the same 16 degree internal taper (Offset the Topslide by 8 degrees to bore the holder after drilling to the maximum size for the collet size that you are using) for the holder, and the thread pitch is 1.5mm for the closing Nut. Thread size seems to be that of the next size up, ER 25 has a 32 x 1.5mm, ER32 has 40 x 1.5mm ,based on what I have seen. I finish by polishing the bore by wrapping emery round a collet, and running the lathe slowly. DON'T press too hard or it will grab and you could injure yourself. Be content to make haste slowly, after all, you are polishing, not roughing out.

I don't bother with making the Closing Nut, too complcated, so just buy from Arc EuroTrade.

HTH

Howard

[jim’Participant @jim11037]

Thank you for all the comments.

I think I will go with the Arceurotrade version.

Some good points raised.

Thanks again

Jim

[VicParticipant @vic]

Just a thought but there seem to be more fixtures and fittings that take ER32 collets than any other size and they're also cheaper.

Spinindexer for example has a ER32 adaptor:

**LINK**

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

I recently did the same thing. Standardised my Collets. I went for the biggest ER40 size for the simple reason that it can hold up to 30mm. Not particularly useful on the mill but a big bonus on the lathe! I also purchased a Stevenson collet block at the same time so I can now accurately hold a good size of round stock in the mill vise with ease. Ive put my purchase list below because I spent a lot of time finding the best buys so you might find it useful.

 

Er40 lathe collet chuck (arc euro) £48

Boxford backplate (RDG tools) everywhere else was out of stock. £20

Er40 Stevenson's collet block (arc euro) £22

Er40 milling collet chuck (second hand) got lucky. I did find a bison ones on ebay relatively cheap.

Selection of Er40 collets. Swiss made rego-fix (eBay) £7.50 each bargain!

Er40 spanner (eBay) again bargain price. £7

Edited By Hollowpoint on 19/03/2016 09:51:02

[jim’Participant @jim11037]

Hi,

Been thinking about getting spindex thing, (arceurotrade one).**LINK**

Are they solid enough to mill hexagons on bolts, or really just a simple drilling thing?

I only ask because the locking pin does seam a good distance from the action!

I have been using a hex ER collet block, but if these spindexers are ok, I'd be able to check for run out etc easily.

Thank you

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

I did cut a piece of scrapyard steel in half with my angle grinder a while back. I got through 8 inches of 1 inch thick steel of quite uncertain nature.

I started in my workshop but very quickly stopped and as the sparks were melting the window frames. even outside it was a bit daunting! Fear for my neighbours reaction and the difficulty of controlling the grinder has prevented me from trying again (and lack of need, to be honest).

I'd thought to make a stand for it if I needed to do chunky work again (and a thinner disc), but it hasn't come up since.

Order on it's way to ArcEuroTrade! Thanks for the advice from all.

Iain

[Frances IoMParticipant @francesiom58905]

I have a metal cutting Rage chopsaw bought prior to buying the bandsaw and little used after that purchase – it was somewhat cheaper than the H80 bandsaw but tho effective wasn’t easily used in my small cellar workshop as it threw bits of metal quite far but could get though 60mm mild steel easily enough – one option I use for cutting SS rod is a small angle grinder in a stand + fitted with a thin (0.8mm) cutting disc – that combination cost me about ?30 – gets thru 40mm SS rod

I bought the ArcEuro 2MT stub milling arbor + 63mm 16mm bore saws (the largest bore for a 2MT is 80mm dia saw on a 22mm bore thus max depth is a few mm under 28mm wch should be possible I think in soft Al but very much doubt in steel

Edited By Frances IoM on 16/03/2016 23:12:54

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

The Bay have some powered saws but they appear to be either older than me (not necessarily a bad thing) or quite pricey.

The Chester bandsaw looks reasonable value for money and I most certainly would like a powered saw proper – but I really don't have the budget for it. I'm not sure I have the space either.

Apart from the sheer grunt of the cutting, the handsaw on the 50×50 bar wandered rather more than I would like. I haven't reliably mastered dead straight cuts by hand over significant distances . A machine is more controllable. I hope.

Emgee – the CMD10 does have an M10 drawbar and the MT sits nice and tight. I'm a bit tempted to spend 30 quid on the ArcEurotrade setup and go for a powered saw when my ship comes in.

In passing I have a reasonably decent sized wood chop saw – can I do basic cutting off with that with the correct blade? I think it will cut 3 inch by 6 inch wood in it's current configuration.

Iain

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

Having overloaded my CMD 10 I thought I would seek advice before purchasing a slitting saw.

The particular piece I want to slit is 20mm x 50mm aluminium. I've just spent half an hour cutting this 20mm slice off a 50×50 block with a hacksaw and don't fancy a retry.

RDG have got a one inch 2MT arbour for 15 quid with saws for 5 or so.

Arceurotrade have various 2MT arbours for around 20 – 25 quid.

Should I be aiming for smaller diameter bore with a weak mill – or a bigger one to grip? What is a realistic slice I can take with my mill – in a pinch I can go in from both sides. What impact does the width of the saw make?

Oh – and for you hard lads that think I should get the hacksaw out again – nah. Life's too short!

Iain

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Hollowpoints point on the ML10 is very sound, beautiful tidy compact machines with the good old English quality and Myford owners can be be quite proud and look after them, there are plenty of other, often very underrated branded that are equally or better build/equipt but it's a case of taking your pick, my guess would be spares support and general online knowledge of the ML10's is far greater than any others.

I didn't want to buy second hand when I first started because I didn't know the difference between a bad one and a good one or how to tell what can be adjusted and what's just plain old nackered – the newer Chinese machines will probably give you similar issues though sadly – often they need a strip and rebuild by someone who recognises and is able to correct any little roughness or burrs when they see them and is able to reassemble them good and set them true.

I know I'm probably not helping much at this stage, you've pretty much just got to take the plung, if you know lathes, go second hand, if you don't, go new with good support (I think ArcEuro are possibly the best in terms of attitude to support and giving the support but that's just my opinion, I seem to recal there machine were lacking a few bells and whistles but they were branded Sieg rather than "own brand" machine so possible a bit better general quality)

[Iain DownsParticipant @iaindowns78295]

That's really helpful. I was astonished that you could buy these bearings for pennies. I've ended up buying some green ones at £8.60 for 16 which works at a tad over 50p each. There were postings at much less than that!

Ian – I get the basic idea. You will have a stub sticking out of the chuck and you push the mount onto it. What I'm not sure about is how to lathe the recess. I can see how to do this if the mandrel wasn't in the way (it's just extending the bore), but I've not had much luck with cutting recesses on the end of a bar. What's the trick? Or do I just make the mandrel so that it is 7mm short of the depth of the hole (sounds challenging to get that right!).

Mike – I like the idea of doing a casting and have dreams off adding some heat treatment to my workshop, but sadly that lags behind sorting out my current projects and learning to weld (stick). I notice that Arceurotrade have spare bearing blocks for £4.50, which strikes me as similar to the materials cost for casting a new one in aluminium. Hmmm…….

All I was actually thinking of doing was putting a 2mm deep thrust bearing either side of the block. Might need changing every few months as it gets gummed up, but may also do the job (whilst I get round to the more complex bearing replacement!

Iain

[Michael Cox 1Participant @michaelcox1]

Hi Iain,

I have basically the same mill as yours but sourced from ArcEuroTrade. I replace the feedscrew mounts with new ones incorporating ball bearings and the difference is amazing. Very smooth, low torque movement is now possible.

Further information here:

http://mikesworkshop.weebly.com/mill-feedscrew-bearing.html

Mike

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Hi Nyrup,

I believe that you ordered 060-325-22208 from this page.

After reading your post, I carried out some rough and ready tests on SC3 – Brushless Motor – belt drive mini-lathe. Usual disclaimers apply. Sorry in advance for failing to follow certain principals.

– Half Nut locked down on leadscrew – lever set to neutral, made sure the top slide was not loose – taking out any slack by adjusting the gib screws. Used the 000 QCTP and holder as it was already in place from another experiment. Adjust the blade to the centre or perhaps just below. 25mm diameter bars stocks used for steel, aluminium, and cast iron.

Parting off steel: Start off speeds needed to be played about with, and initial sounds we not so good.

Speed reads 340 rpm. Picture taken upside down. Coolant applied at various stages with a small paint brush. Probably didn't need it. After getting about 5mm into the cut, the sounds settled and parting got easier.

At this point I got a bit 'over-confident' and luckily the GTN2 insert just fell out of the blade. Couldn't figure out how to put it back in, so asked JS for advice. 'Hit back in' with nylon/rubber mallet:

Job done, back to parting off the remainder. Figured out that I had not quite got the tip to line up with the center. Still parted off:

Aluminium: After conducting above test, proceeded to part off Aluminium, initially at around 1,300 rpm:

Liked the sounds at this speed, no need for coolant, so increased the speed to max. 2500 rpm just to see what would happen:

Confetti time. Not really recommended unless you also wear a face mask, but looks and feels really nice:

Cast Iron: I must have some really dirty stock of this, or, this stuff really behaves badly, or need to play more with this, perhaps adjusting tip height, speed. Proved to be a pig to deal with at around 300rpm, so increased to around 670rpm:

It was going reasonably at this speed, but very slow feed, and then the tip broke, possibly because I was a little nervous and failed to keep constant feed, resulting is some welding:

Didn't have time or chance to play with brass, but I am sure that it will behave similar to aluminium.

In short, was happy with results from first time experimental tests. Results may be different on different mini-lathes which have hi/low gear drives, and speeds will need to be played around with on such machines. Also, experienced users will have their own methods and get their own results. The guard was taken off for the purpose of taking pictures. Short videos were also taken on the phone for own reference. No time at present to put up on You Tube. If people want, will be happy to do so when I have some time.

Ketan at ARC.

[Nyrup BoeghParticipant @nyrupboegh48678]

Hi

Yesterday I ordered some turning tools from Arceurotrade from the "new" cheep series in the catalog. All with the 8mm shank.

I was a bit hesitant in ordering the parting blade (with the 2mm GTN2 insert) and holder, but finally decided to order it.

But the doubt is still nagging me: Does it work on my small Sieg C3 lathe or will the result be chattering away and biting at me… ?

Nyrup

[JonParticipant @jon]

Theres good, bad and mediocre stuff made in asia, have to be really careful with a bit of trial and error.

In general base it upon the amount of use you will get out of it and price. I wouldn't have 1/4 of what I have if bought new quality tooling though have a fair bit, last count in excess of £30k to replace over 25 years.
Happy medium is the east European stuff ie chucks but having been there draw the line at own shop brand and no brand cutting tools, they don't last false economy.

MSC very expensive when on offer often found substantially cheaper then find have to add the vat. I only buy the FC3 Hertel cutters or sell off items few and far between. Perhaps if they didn't send me three brochures a month they could drop the prices.

In short no substitute for a good well known quality brand along lines of Iscar, Ceratizit, Seco but they are dear comparatively.

Drill chucks usually ok from china, theyre cheap and highly replaceable, MT3 collets ok from Arc, Chester a big no everyone slips but look the same! Lathe tooling much the same from the well known UK shops, you take a gamble.

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Hi Alan

FWIW…The vast majority of my gear is 'Made in China' I have a Warco WM250V-F, a WM16 Mill, don't have the space for anything larger, ER25 collet set + MT2,MT4 arbours, assortment of milling cutters… CTC ( Hong Kong ) 4" Mill Vice, rotab' with 3" & 4" chucks, various drill chucks, Rot' centres, drill sets, 1-2-3 blocks etc. etc. … from ArcEuro, Chronos, RDG, Tracy tools et al… the vast majority of stuff we get in the UK / Europe is from /made in China there's no getting away from it. Yes there are some very good 'British' items on the auction site or in the 'For sale' section of this forum, but unless you have the room to fit it in, time to wait for it appearing, or enough cash to pay 'silly money' for the likes of a 'tidy' Myford then the Chinese equipment is what you're usually going to end up with.

Having said all that I cannot complain with my stuff, it has/ does serve me well & yes I've had a few 'not so good quality' items but to quote the old adages… 'you gets what you pay for' … or 'don't expect a RR for a mini price'. There are members who have posted tales of woe about Chinese stuff & problems encountered, I myself had problems with my WM250 initially, but a couple of e mails, with pics, a couple of 'pleasant' tel. calls resolved the problem quite quickly, that's my experience, others may be not. If you recall many years ago when Britain's auto trade was in full swing there were still the 'Monday morning – Friday tea time' cars coming off the lines so …

Re. the above mentioned Co's the usual disclaimer applies, I reckon you've got a decent bit if kit with your GH1330, hopefully we'll get to see some pics of your kit, what you make with it, enjoy.

George.

[John CParticipant @johnc47954]

Hi Alan,

I have tooling from all the suppliers you mention, All of it has ended up fine, although I have had to return a few items for replacement – which has been done quickly and without quibble. I also have tooling from Arc Eurotrade (UK) and CTC tools (Hong Kong). I have some 'high end' kit purchased second (or more) hand from a certain auction site; some good, some not so good.

If you look back through these forums (fora?) you will find many discussions on such tooling, with opinions varying from 'you get what you pay for' through 'not fit for purpose' to 'it's the only way I could get started', with plenty of brickbats about quality control.

If you accept that this kit is made to a price, and that YOU are the quality controller, all will be well. If you expect Rolls Royce accuracy for Trabant prices, you will be disappointed!

It also depends on what you call 'sensible' tolerances. One man's 'perfectly OK' is another man's scrap bin entry.

If you are happy with your lathe, which was made in the same type of factories as the tooling under discussion, then you should be happy with the tooling.

Arc don't exhibit at shows any more, but Chronos, Warco, Chester and RDG do, so you could see what is on offer in the flesh. Depending on where you are you could also visit the premises of tool sellers to get a feel for what is on offer.

I guess if you are building a lunar lander you may need to save up for top end kit – if you are just enjoying yourself in the workshop, my feeling is that the kit from the sellers mentioned above is fine.

Just my £.02 worth. Opinions may vary, etc etc.

John

[Martin 100Participant @martin100]

This difference in the thread form is what made a shedload of direct nose fitting ER32 chucks unusable. Despite being unfit for purpose that didn't stop someone who shall remain nameless selling them to UK customers for many many months.

Fortunately ER32 chucks from the likes of arceuro are easily fitted to a boxford backplate, a bit bulkier but not really a problem.