Smoke box wrapper removal.

This topic has 10 replies, 7 voices, and was last updated 28 April 2026 at 09:30 by noel shelley.

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21 April 2026 at 21:31 #845388
Thomas Clarke
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@thomasclarke78224
Hi, I wonder if anyone could help me with the removal of a smoke box wrapper from a 5in gauge Stirling Single. I am in the process of removing the boiler from the locomotive and to facilitate this, one of the things I need to do is remove this wrapper. As you can see from the photos I have attached in 1, 2 and 3 jpg the countersunk screws have all been removed. Having done this I thought the wrapper would easily come off buy lifting the chimney that is attached to it. I’m reluctant to use brute force in case I damage anything. A set of drawings came with the locomotive and on the drawing in 4jpg there looks to be countersunk rivet used in attaching the wrapper to the smoke box frame. I couldn’t see any evidence that rivets had been used but then if they have would be covered by the paint layer. Another possible reason I thought the wrapper isn’t coming off is that the builder used a heat resistant sealant when they attached the wrapper. There is a small amount of rust inside the smoke box, could the wrapper and frame rusted together. Any suggestions on how I get the wrapper off would be much appreciated.

1 jpg

2 jpg

3 jpg

4 jpg
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22 April 2026 at 06:54 #845420
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Is there any sign of th erivit heads on the inside of the smokebox?
22 April 2026 at 11:41 #845456
Tomfilery
Participant
@tomfilery
Thomas,

I know the drawing doesn’t show it, but I wonder whether the three screws which hold the lower part of the cylinder cladding might also attach the top section too? It would make sense if there was a “tongue” attached to the end of the long cladding, which went under the central portion of the lower cylinder cladding. Without such an arrangement, I suspect the cladding might not hold it’s nice smooth line – despite what the drawing shows.

Regards Tom
22 April 2026 at 12:19 #845463
Thomas Clarke
Participant
@thomasclarke78224
<p style=”text-align: right;”>Thanks Tom. I will remove those screws to see what happens.</p>

<p style=”text-align: right;”>Thomas</p>
26 April 2026 at 23:56 #845940
Thomas Clarke
Participant
@thomasclarke78224
Hi Tom thanks for that advice. I now have the rapper off the smokebox. The next thing I am doing is removing all the boiler fittings but have come to a standstill with removing the water gauge. I have circled the two nuts in question on the photo. Do I turn the nuts anti clockwise or clockwise to take the water gauge off. The top one is lose and turned clockwise as far as it can go. Is it a matter of doing the same with the bottom one and tapping out the water gauge and trying to avoid braking the glass tube.

The final stage will be removing the boiler from the main frame but looking at the loco it is hard to see how the boiler is attached to the main frame. I have circled what I think could be what is holding the boiler on the main frame in the drawing. The blue line I am guessing is the main frame the firebox sits on. Does what I have circled in the drawing correspond to what I have circled in the photos of Expansion Bracket A & B and that the screws need to be unscrewed to lift the boiler off the main frame. Any replies of help would be most appreciated.
27 April 2026 at 00:15 #845941
duncan webster 1
Participant
@duncanwebster1
Why do you need to remove them? If for pressure test can’t it be done with them in place?
27 April 2026 at 00:51 #845942
Paul Kemp
Participant
@paulkemp46892
As per Duncan’s question, why do you want to remove the gauge frame? (Apologies I haven’t read the rest of the thread!). If it must come off then undo both of the nuts around the glass and make sure any seals / packing is free. Take out the blanking plug on the top of the top fitting and then slide the glass up through the nuts, packing or seals and the top fitting to remove it. Then if you disconnect the blow down pipe from the lower fitting, both can be unscrewed from their respective bushes. You should be able to test the boiler with the glass and its fittings in place, technically they are part of the “pressure system” and should be tested as well as the boiler. Same goes for superheaters (if fitted) but if they are downstream of the regulator (stop valve) then that is a moot point perhaps, depends on the inspectors viewpoint!

To lift the boiler I would say the screws circled are holding the frame side expansion brackets so yes removing them should drop the brackets off and free the boiler. Not familiar with the design but there may be enough room to slide the boiler back so the boiler side of the expansion brackets come clear of the frame side if you can’t get the screws undone.

Paul.
27 April 2026 at 01:23 #845946
Nigel Graham 2
Participant
@nigelgraham2
I concur with wondering why you need remove the gauge-glass fittings, but the circled “nuts” are not lock-nuts. Each is an outer bush, or adapator, screwed into a bush in the boiler shell itself. So leave it be.

Instead, having dismantled the rest of the gauge-frame, the T-pieces that form the upper and lower bodies should then unscrew from adaptor-bushes.

Unless there is some over-riding necessity, such as their threads leaking, I’d rather leave them be, too.

Why is the top one “loose”? I can’t see how you can safely turn either of those “nuts” with everything assembled anyway. Especially as we don’t know if their internal and external thread pitches differ, as trying to unscrew the adaptor with everything else all in place would create a thread conflict that if taken too far could end in trouble.
27 April 2026 at 09:35 #845957
Thomas Clarke
Participant
@thomasclarke78224
Thanks for the replies. I am planning on taking my boiler to Western Steam because up at the Steam Workshop it failed the pressure test. I’m hoping that the boiler can be fixed and was told by Helen of Western Boilers that I would have to remove all the boiler fittings.

Thomas
27 April 2026 at 23:21 #845993
Thomas Clarke
Participant
@thomasclarke78224
The replies have been most helpful and I am close to removing the boiler from the main frame. I spoke with Western Steam today regarding my boiler and they have told me all the boiler fittings have to come off which I am doing. There is one last question I have regarding the top water gauge mount circled in red on the images attached. This looks like it does not unscrew and is part of the boiler and has been silver soldered to it. Am I correct in saying this.

Thomas
28 April 2026 at 09:30 #846003
noel shelley
Participant
@noelshelley55608
The water gauge mounting IS part of the boiler and cannot be removed ! If as I suspect Helen is going to resolder parts then ANYthing that is screwed to the boiler will need to be removed including the lower gauge mounting in the picture and ALL the other fittings, regulator, blower valve, any clacks, injector steam feeds Etc. All that will be left is a bare boiler. Good luck. Noel.
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