Mill Toolholding question

[Ady WilsonParticipant @adywilson52106]

Hi this is my first post, I have just purchased a clarke CL500M lathe,mill,drill combo machine which is being deleivered this week. I am familiar although an amateur with a lathe but have never done any milling. From what I can deduct I am going to need a milling chuck and collets to be able to use the mill ? All I can find info wise at the moment is that the spindle is MT3 but I do not know the spec of the draw bar.

Can anyone recommend what I need to get me started. I have looked at collets and chucks but it seems confusing with all the different types like ER25, ER32 etc.. and then there is "30 int" and many other names and numbers, my head is spinning.

Any advice would be appreciated or links to reading material etc to help me out.

[Ady WilsonParticipant @adywilson52106]

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Hi Ady,

As you have the larger CL500, I'f suggest getting an ER32 collet set. ER collets work well for holding work and for holding cutters, and as they have an 'Extended Range' of 1mm per collet, you don't need a fortune to buy a full set of collets.

30INT is a type of taper, I suggest you look at an ER32 collet chuck with an MT3 taper.

The drawbar supplied with the drill chuck will probably be M10 or M12 (metric) or might be 3/8" Whitworth (Imperial). Try it with an M10 or M12 nut. It's easy enough to make a new drawbar from studding if the collet chuck comes with a different thread.

You could look at one of these sets as a starter

Neil

[Les Jones 1Participant @lesjones1]

Hi Ady,
The draw bar (For MT3 collets or chucks) will have either 3/8" Whit or M12. You can just measure the thread on the bottom end of the draw bar or look in the manual for your lathe/mill. ER25 anf ER32 are two collet sizes from a range of the same basic design collet systems. ER25 takes collets that hold cutters up to 16 mm ER32 takes collets that hold cutters up to 20 mm. Each collet will hold tools over a 1 mm range. For example a 10 mm collet will hold tools from 9 mm to 10 mm. 30 int is a taper used on some milling machines. (Just as yours has a MT3 taper) You have a few options regarding tool holding. One is to buy MT3 collets. You would need one for each size of cutter you plan to use. (They only hold ONE SIZE. They do not cover a 1 mm range like the ER style collets.) Another option is an ER collet chuck. I think an MT3 ER20 or MT3 ER25 size would suit your machine. Yet another option is MT3 tool holders.These fit into the MT3 taper and hold the cutter with a pinch screw. My preference would be a ER type collet chuck.

Les.

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Hi Ady

I had one of these before upgrading to separate mill / lathe. they a realy solid piece of kid but very hefty weightwise so before you lift it onto your bench I would remove the mill head & just lift the lathe section first, unless you have an engine hoist, remember to balance it out if you lift it all in one. It does have four lifting bars that slide in/out of the lathe bed casting so use these.

If you have got it from Machine Mart then they supply a MT3 milling cutter (indexible type,4 cutters- optional extra) I suggest you get this, it is ideal as a fly cutter. another item I suggest is the cast iron riser block that fastens to the cross slide as this will keep your mill/drill spindle at its shortest extension, otherwise you may have to lower your spindle to reach the vice/job which will reduce rigidity even though there is a spindle lock. M/Mart do sell a collet set – optional extra again but if you can afford it I would go for a ER32 collet system, max' cutter 20mm, the ER 25 max' cutter is 16mm. IIRC the draw bar is 10/12mm but, sometimes comes with a 3/8 BSW bar so double check..

It should come with a 3 jaw chuck, but you will need to purchase a 4 jaw as well (extra again), fixed head & tailstock centres, MT4 & 3 plus a basic kit of carbide tipped brazed lathe tools (Chinese quality… ??? replace these with decent indexible tip tool asap), rotating centre, faceplate,fixed & travelling steadies etc. …all extras! See Machine Marts web site under ‘Metalworking’ for all the extras you may (will eventually) need, plus other buyers reviews.

A good solid starter’s machine which I had for a few years, & you will enjoy using it, just make sure all your fastenings are secure before using it. One point I found, although I had mine mounted on a solid wooden bench, so it was quite rigid, if you get the base, this is made from sheet metal so with all that weight up top, & if you’re milling/drilling, you will get vibration, which won’t do any of your finishes/cutters/drills a lot of good, also I suggest when you do lathe work you swing your mill head around so it lines up axially with the lathe bed & lock it up, not behind, this will help to eliminate any off balance/ vibration problems.

A decent machine that will give you what you ask it to do…, If I can help any further drop me a pm. … enjoy

Regards

George

Edited By mechman48 on 02/09/2013 09:40:08

[Ady WilsonParticipant @adywilson52106]

Thanks for all your replies they are very much appreciated. The machine should be getting delivered tomorrow so I will be able to look at the drawbar thread. I managed to find a page explaiing the ER system and sizing so am beginning to understand a bit better now.  I am glad to have found this forum it seems a great place. When I checked my post a few minutes a go there was one reply and after replying to that there had been more replies so have had to come and edit this lol. Really nice to get so much feedback so thanks to all of you.

cheers,

Ady.

Edited By Ady Wilson on 02/09/2013 09:43:41

[MadMikeParticipant @madmike]

As others have said ER series collets. i would recommend ER32, after all the moment you decide on the ER25 you are certain to have a need for the slightly incresed size available with ER32's……tis sods law at work.

Most appear to have an M12 drawbar as I suspect your mill will have.

[Jim GuthrieParticipant @jimguthrie82658]

Posted by Ady Wilson on 02/09/2013 09:37:34:

Thanks for all your replies they are very much appreciated. The machine should be getting delivered tomorrow so I will be able to look at the drawbar thread. I managed to find a page explaiing the ER system and sizing so am beginning to understand a bit better now. I am glad to have found this forum it seems a great place. When I checked my post a few minutes a go there was one reply and after replying to that there had been more replies so have had to come and edit this lol. Really nice to get so much feedback so thanks to all of you.

Ady,

If you contemplate using small diameter milling cutters (~1mm diameter) which are quite short in length, be prepared to look at something like an ER11 collet holder and collets as well as the larger collet systems. The reason is that these small cutters will only project about 15 – 20mm from the collet face and the diameter of the closer nut on ER25/32 can be a bit of an embarrassment when trying to avoid holding clamps, etc.

Jim.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Jim Guthrie on 02/09/2013 10:20:22

If you contemplate using small diameter milling cutters (~1mm diameter) which are quite short in length, be prepared to look at something like an ER11 collet holder and collets as well as the larger collet systems. The reason is that these small cutters will only project about 15 – 20mm from the collet face and the diameter of the closer nut on ER25/32 can be a bit of an embarrassment when trying to avoid holding clamps, etc.

Jim.

.

Picking-up on Jim's excellent advice:

Plain-shank adapters, like this, look very useful.

MichaelG.

[Daryl AdamsParticipant @daryladams13877]

The Clarke CLM500 drawbar is 12mm x 1.5mm pitch, the compound slide appears to be also 12mm, although 2mm pitch and is of course is a left hand thread on the compound. Both the mill and tailstock are morse taper 3. Don't forget to note the circular ring on the bottom of the mill head which when turned lifts the whole mill – for those like me that rarely study manuals!

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