Gents waiting-train and Master clocks

[Tony MartyrParticipant @tonymartyr14488]

A couple of years ago I was asked to refurbish and old (1915?) tower clock with a Gents waiting train mechanism – I did that but could no find or afford a master clock to run with it. I have now obtained a master clock (1954) but i'm at a loss as to how to wire the system up – do we have any readers who have experience of these mechanisms?

Tony

[Tony MartyrParticipant @tonymartyr14488]

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Tony,

First, I have to say that I am green with envy … I have three of the Master Clocks, but have abandoned hope of ever finding a Waiting Train mechanism.

I will post a few more links, but; if you can justify membership of the Antiquarian Horological Society then the Electrical Horology Group is a bargain "bolt-on".

MichaelG.

.

Lots of information on this blog

A little more, here

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 11:12:33

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 11:14:59

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

For the benefit of those who have not seen the Waiting Train mechanism in action, here is an excellent video.

You might also like to ponder the reason for the message engraved on the disk.

[don't bother telling me, I know the answer]

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Tony,

If you don't have it already … I recommend this download of Langman and Ball

MichaelG.

.

P.S. Whereabouts are you ?

Edit: Sorry … superfluous question, I've just looked at your profile.

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 11:39:58

[Tony MartyrParticipant @tonymartyr14488]

Thanks to Michael for send more information that I can absorb today!

The full story: 3 years ago my daughter was project managing the redevelopment of the site of an explosives factory in Birmingham and wanted to save the cast iron clock face that was in the tower above the entrance from the skip. She asked me if I could make a dining room table from it by covering if glass etc!

When it was delivered it came with a wooden box of 'bits' which I later found out was the WT mechanism and the Hooks Joint shafts etc. it was all covered in dust a debris. It has no serial number but the factory was built during WW1 so must be at least 96 years old.

I can see why so few of the WT units have survived whereas the transmitter (master) clocks look valuable the WT units, to the untrained eye, look insignificant and like scrap.

to demolition gangs. I have very carefully re-built the unit (see photos in my album) but not touched the coils which all work when powered up. I now need to know exactly how to wire both units together with a suitable 12-20v power supply and without burning out any of the original parts!

Tony

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Tony,

What a fantastic rescue! … Well done Sir.

I will have a look through my references later, and will send you a PM if I can find anything specific.

MichaelG.

[mark costello 1Participant @markcostello1]

Some of us don't know the reason for the message on the dial. Could You inform Us? Not into clock mechanics but that is amazing. Must keep a yearning to start another project stifled.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Mark,

As you asked nicely

The Waiting Train mechanism is effectively an electric motor and, because it's designed to drive big dials, is "heavy engineering" by horological standards. It does operate like a simple electric clock, and has its own Hipp Toggle mechanism, but it is set to run a little fast and then waits for a synchronizing pulse from a Master Clock [hence the name]. … The Pendulum of this "motor" is supported on a substantial ball [or roller] bearing [because it needs to be robust, but needs no timekeeping finesse] … The message is a reminder to rotate the bearing-housing by a few degrees "sometimes" to reduce the risk of Brinelling. Obviously, ball [roller] bearings are designed for rotative applications, but the pendulum only swings a couple of degrees either side of neutral.

I have no idea how many mechanisms actually received this level of attention !

MichaelG.

.

Edit: good illustration of the Hipp Toggle, here  plus lots more to explore.

Edit: pictures of the bearing assembly, here

Edit: corrected text. [ball or roller bearings were used, according to model]

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 15:13:37

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 15:24:28

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 15:28:56

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 06/04/2014 15:34:17

[Tony MartyrParticipant @tonymartyr14488]

I have worked with 'real' engines of all sizes for all my working life and have modelled some for many years but working on these 'industrial' clocks has been very different.

When an engine first runs it is a success – Wow! – but when you start a WT and Gents Master clock they create a rhythm that you realise is decrementing your life with each swing of their pendulums – very spooky!!

For Mark: the WT clock solved the problem of getting several clocks in a factory or, for example on 14 railway platforms synchronised. The WT units have very heavy but short pendulums needed to drive large, open-air hands against wind load. They drive through a worm wheel to prevent the wind stalling or reversing the hands.
They all run (imprecisely) a few seconds fast and then wait for the pulse from the Master (transmitter) clock and so all synchronise every 30 seconds. The Hipps toggle is used to energise two big solenoids that give the pendulum a kick when its arc falls to a minimum.

The master clock works with a pendulum (1metre) that is given a push every 30 seconds coincidentally with sending a pulse to its own and 'slave' WT units that are 'waiting' – just loverly pieces of engineering and the only things I have met that use 1 and 3 BA threads!

I will post some more photos on my album

Tony

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Tony,

This may be the best information generally available about the circuit.

The final page of text mentions Waiting Train, albeit briefly !

MichaelG.

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