Joint Round Edge Needle Files

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Joint Round Edge Needle Files

This topic has 37 replies, 17 voices, and was last updated 13 December 2018 at 15:23 by JasonB.

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31 August 2018 at 14:17 #369800
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
We had a delivery in today, in which Tome Feteira sent us 'Joint Round Edge Needle Files', by error.

Not having ever seen such a thing before, I initially thought that they were blanks which they had forgotten to finish. On advising them, they replied that they were Joint Round Edge Needle Files, which were for someone else and they were sent to us by error.

I am unable to take a clear picture at present, and to avoid getting into any copyright issue, to see what they look like, please see this link.

The reasons I am making this post is to figure out if any people in the collective are aware of such files, and if they use them. If they are being used, then for what purpose?…. Is anyone able to direct me to some video or site which shows such a product being used?… so far I am unable to find a clear application… other than for jewellers?

Ketan at ARC.

Edited By Ketan Swali on 31/08/2018 14:18:14
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31 August 2018 at 14:17 #26166
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
31 August 2018 at 15:01 #369805
Thor 🇳🇴
Participant
@thor
Hi Ketan,

I had never heard of "Joint Round Edge Needle Files" before reading your post. An Internet search brought up this site that explain their use.

Thor
31 August 2018 at 15:02 #369806
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
If they had square edges I'd take one off you. I have a couple of needle files that I have ground off the teeth from the flat faces so that they can be used to make a round ended milled slot square for things like wedge and cotter joints.

can't think off hand what the rounded ones would be used for
31 August 2018 at 15:04 #369807
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
Posted by Thor on 31/08/2018 15:01:15:

Hi Ketan,

I had never heard of "Joint Round Edge Needle Files" before reading your post. An Internet search brought up this site that explain their use.

Thor

Thanks Thor,
31 August 2018 at 15:07 #369809
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
Posted by JasonB on 31/08/2018 15:02:11:

If they had square edges I'd take one off you. I have a couple of needle files that I have ground off the teeth from the flat faces so that they can be used to make a round ended milled slot square for things like wedge and cotter joints.

can't think off hand what the rounded ones would be used for

I have already asked them and am awaiting their reply for other shapes. Will let you know.

Ketan at ARC.
31 August 2018 at 15:10 #369810
Nick Hulme
Participant
@nickhulme30114
Ketan,
There is one of those in the Teng Tools 12 piece needle file set.
31 August 2018 at 15:12 #369812
Trevorh
Participant
@trevorh
Hi Ketan,

we use to use them in the petrochem industry in the workshops when profiling slots into inconel and titanium components

basically they allow you to slot fairley accuratley by hand when it just wasn't practical to use a mill

I still have my original set supplied as an apprentice back in the 1970's

cheers
31 August 2018 at 15:13 #369813
Brian Sweeting 2
Participant
@briansweeting2
Ketan, found s site different from above link which details them as used by jewellers and watchmakers, uses shown on link page. **LINK**
31 August 2018 at 15:32 #369815
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
Brilliant, Thank you Nick, Trevorh and Brian,

Also, links posted show some interesting use…. even though I can't quite figure out their use on hinges, or why one would call it a joint file.

Learned something new today.

Ketan at ARC.
31 August 2018 at 15:54 #369819
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Posted by JasonB on 31/08/2018 15:02:11:

If they had square edges I'd take one off you. I have a couple of needle files that I have ground off the teeth from the flat faces so that they can be used to make a round ended milled slot square for things like wedge and cotter joints.

can't think off hand what the rounded ones would be used for

That's exactly what I thought!
31 August 2018 at 15:57 #369820
Brian Wood
Participant
@brianwood45127
Ketan,

I have used the larger brethren of these which include teeth as normal on the file faces. In that configuration they are know as 'Mill Files' and are used in saw sharpening, especially in blending in the gullet radius on circular saw blades after tooth filing..

I am talking about big blades here, 30 inch diameter and more. They have other uses of course, but that was what they were made for.

Kind regards

Brian
31 August 2018 at 17:02 #369827
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Posted by Ketan Swali on 31/08/2018 14:17:06:

We had a delivery in today, in which Tome Feteira sent us 'Joint Round Edge Needle Files', by error.

Not having ever seen such a thing before, I initially thought that they were blanks which they had forgotten to finish. On advising them, they replied that they were Joint Round Edge Needle Files, which were for someone else and they were sent to us by error.

[ … ]

.

Potentially very useful, Ketan … So the question is:

Will you be stocking them ?

MichaelG.
31 August 2018 at 17:20 #369829
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
Hi Michael,

I am thinking about it. It depends on response from TF. At present these files are made specifically against an order for a particular customer of theirs, and it is outside their standard catalogue range. So I first need their approval to sell it. It may or may not be exclusive for that customer.

Secondly, I need to understand what shapes, other than rounded edge are possible to get, ie. square edges?, and what cuts. Also, Cut 2 seems to be most popular, but will it be considered to be too coarse or too fine, depending on materials it may be filing – used for. Is it likely to clog too much on wood or brass? With that cut for example.

Need to sleep on it and wait for response.

Ketan at ARC
31 August 2018 at 17:36 #369832
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Thanks Ketan,

The people I know that use such files would consider Cut 6 more useful than Cut 2

They would also spend time making the safe edges truly safe [i.e. flat and polished]

… others, of course, may feel differently.

MichaelG.

.

Here is a handy reference to some other useful shapes:

https://contenti.com/media/catalog/pdf/library/file_cuts_styles_shapes.pdf

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/08/2018 17:38:09
31 August 2018 at 19:01 #369844
Adam Phillips
Participant
@adamphillips50363
Hi there

I use these when I am making watch case hinges. They are for making the half round groove that the hinge tubes are soldered into. In the watch and jewelry trade a hinge is often called a joint. The ones to have are the course cut as it a very fiddly job and time consuming. If you can find a video on Yotube of Martin Matthwes he shows how its done

Best Adam
31 August 2018 at 19:12 #369847
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Four Generations of Watchcase Making – Martin Matthews

… Barbara Darby **LINK**

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/08/2018 19:12:37
31 August 2018 at 19:57 #369854
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Also this one: **LINK**

… which is a clip from the 'H4' DVD

MichaelG.
31 August 2018 at 20:36 #369865
Jon
Participant
@jon
Never heard that term before Joint Round Edge.
Purely just a flat file with a round over rather than square ends.
Rarely used them perhaps twice a year pro but they do come in handy for that otherwise impossible task.

Rounded edge do have the advantage of not bending unwittedly though you can force it bend in to as you file. From memory we had 4 rounded edge files, three 2nd cut flat one was around 3/16" thick x 1" wide and two sub 1/8" thick x 1/2" wide. Plus the Vallorbe rounded edge needle files ok for a cleanup.
31 August 2018 at 21:29 #369876
BC Prof
Participant
@bcprof
Inherited a couple from my Father 40yrs a go . Excellent for making slots for wing ribs when I am butchering balsa wood for model aircraft . Brian C ( I must figure out how to change my Identity . Too many Brians on this forum )
31 August 2018 at 21:40 #369878
Enough!
Participant
@enough
Posted by brian curd on 31/08/2018 21:29:08:

…. I must figure out how to change my Identity ….

Deed-poll?
1 September 2018 at 03:14 #369889
Hopper
Participant
@hopper
Useful for toolmakers cutting intricate shaped slots etc in diesteels on press blanking dies and the like. Although, these days I suspect most of what we once laboriously did with files is now done with CNC and EDM etc. I still have a drawer full of all manner of odd shaped Swiss/needle/riffler files from toolroom days. Can't say I remember one just like this example. Would be very handy for touching up rounded ends in slots without making the end wider than the slot, as easily happens when using a round file.
1 September 2018 at 14:18 #369937
mechman48
Participant
@mechman48
Ketan

I'd be interested in getting a couple of these + a couple of square edge ones if you were to stock / supply them.

George.
7 September 2018 at 14:37 #370797
Ketan Swali
Participant
@ketanswali79440
Thank you all for contributing on this thread.

Adam, thank you for clarifying the origins of the use of the word 'joint' in the description, and Michael for the YouTube links.

Sorry I have taken some time to respond. Been waiting for some answers from Tome, to decide if ARC can/will carry these type of files.

George, ARC will introduce the 'Joint Round Edge' Needle files shortly, in cuts 2 and 4, (as we have already got them here) and will also introduce, what we will call 'Sharp Square Edge' (plain face), also in cuts 2 and 4 in the near future, as they will be made as special production so may take some time.

Michael G, thank you for the earlier Contenti link with reference to cuts. I discussed this with Tome. They told me that their cuts are similar to Vallorbe. I found this link which can be used for guidance. Tome dont have any demand from any of their customers for Cut 6, so they don't make it. They do have demand for Cut 5, but very rare, so we are leaving these cuts out of our range, for now.

ARC is looking to expand the range of files it offers from Tome Feteira. If anyone has any specific types which they would like us to consider to add to our range, please let us know. At present, I am looking to add some of the 'special files' from this page.

Ketan at ARC
7 September 2018 at 15:04 #370803
Michael Gilligan
Participant
@michaelgilligan61133
Posted by Ketan Swali on 07/09/2018 14:37:46:

[ … ]

Michael G, thank you for the earlier Contenti link with reference to cuts. I discussed this with Tome. They told me that their cuts are similar to Vallorbe. I found this link which can be used for guidance. Tome dont have any demand from any of their customers for Cut 6, so they don't make it. They do have demand for Cut 5, but very rare, so we are leaving these cuts out of our range, for now.

ARC is looking to expand the range of files it offers from Tome Feteira. If anyone has any specific types which they would like us to consider to add to our range, please let us know. At present, I am looking to add some of the 'special files' from this page.

Ketan at ARC

.

That's great, Ketan … Thank You

Note: When I wrote earlier: 'The people I know …'

I was referring to folks that are much more capable than me.

No. 4 Cut is almost certainly fine enough for anything I will do.

MichaelG.
Author

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