Black 5 Boiler problems

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Black 5 Boiler problems

This topic has 74 replies, 22 voices, and was last updated 14 April 2016 at 19:28 by Ron Hancock.

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13 March 2016 at 13:02 #229728
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Well had another disappointment today our club boiler inspectors suggested i take my boiler and have pressure tested now i have it back.

so i fitted blanking plugs gasket and took it to them they took pressure up to 120 and found 3 more leaks beginning to wonder if i will ever get my loco finished.

now leaking from boiler joint on the Barrel also from the front by fire box tubes and from top dome weld on bush.

I just think i am very unlucky fingers crossed next time might be ok.

and to think we do this for pleasure !!!!
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13 March 2016 at 13:02 #1503
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
13 March 2016 at 13:40 #229733
Steven Vine
Participant
@stevenvine79904
Hi Ron

Didn't GB give you a new certificate after doing the work in February? I'm curious to know if the boiler can be leaking and also get a certificate.

Steve
13 March 2016 at 13:52 #229735
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Yes I got a new certificate I must just be unlucky but glad they did the boiler test before I started building again

Ron
13 March 2016 at 15:04 #229745
Brian H
Participant
@brianh50089
Very sorry to hear of the problems Ron. I don't see how a boiler certificate could be issued for a boiler with leaks, I would go back to GB
13 March 2016 at 15:30 #229748
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
Looks as though your boiler certificate was a DUD! I wonder if it was even tested in the first place, should have been of course. Back to GB AGAIN . Perhaps you have to pay extra for a real certificate?
14 March 2016 at 11:37 #229865
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Hi took it back to GB this morning we connected an air line and found the two leaks using bottle soapy water spraying onto the joints.

The dome weld was leaking also joint at bottom of the barrel was leaking and one of the firebox tubes was also leaking.

Got to go back end of week he is going to pressure test it when i am their but i will have to make new gaskets for the dome first before he can test it again.

Fingers crossed i am lucky next time as now the good weather is here so desperate to finally get it in steam.

Will let you know if i am lucky or not next time

all the best Ron
14 March 2016 at 13:29 #229889
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Make sure he does a proper hydralic test to 2xWP while you are there not just an air test.

Did he say how it passed his supposed previous test but then failed your inspectors test?
14 March 2016 at 13:48 #229894
AndyA
Participant
@andya
Take a club boiler inspector with you if possible. Why does he need you to make a new gasket for the dome? How did he test it before without one?

Edited By AndyA on 14/03/2016 13:50:06
14 March 2016 at 14:01 #229896
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
Ron,

With all the problems you have had with this boiler, I would want to see a prolonged 2x hydraulic test without any leak or loss of pressure for much longer than the standard test period.
14 March 2016 at 14:43 #229910
Peter Krogh
Participant
@peterkrogh76576
I don't know a thing about this GB outfit but something is certainly wrong here. I used to do a lot of pressure vessel fabrication and welding and such back and forth over leaks is just unreal. Perhaps this GB outfit should be re-examined for their certification standing.

Pete
14 March 2016 at 14:48 #229911
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
I only wish I could take boiler inspector with me but he lives a long way from GB So not poss.

As for test yes I want to see it at twice the pressure for the ten mins if it holds at that it should be fine.

I am sure he will do a good job after so many times going back he must be as fed up as I am.

I can only wait and see I will not keep going back with it only so long you can take problems this must be the last time.
14 March 2016 at 15:10 #229916
BC Prof
Participant
@bcprof
The only boiler test in which I would have any confidence is one that I had witnessed.

I once purchased a 3"Burrell from a dealer who provided a new commercial certtificate . On stripping it down for a re paint I found a wooden plug in one of the safety valves and a section of steel angle undet the front of the smoke box!. After some discussiona suitable discount was arranged and a replacement boiler ordered.

The 20 week delay at least gave me time to do the re paint . I was given the option of either having the boiler delivered to the Foss Way show or, the makers prefered choice , collecting it from Exeter to see it on test .

After a 180 mile drive I arrived to find the boiler on test at 1 1/2 WP. . It was then pumped up to 2 WP with the comment " let's leave it at that while we have a drink and I go through the paperwork with you"

1/2 hr later the paper towel under the boiler was still dry and I was given some more to wipe over the boiler "To satisfy yourself that it is OK. "

The boiler was thern carried to the car with the comment " I will carry it for you . If you drop it after that you will have to bring it all the way back for me to sort out"

First class service and a very well made boiler .
14 March 2016 at 16:47 #229931
Bob Rodgerson
Participant
@bobrodgerson97362
If You are witnessing the test make sure you see him raise pressure using a hand pump. Also check the line up of the pump and make sure it isn't dead heading against a closed valve.
14 March 2016 at 17:17 #229937
BC Prof
Participant
@bcprof
A very important point Bob. I should have added that I was invited to raise the pressure to 2x after first releasing it.
14 March 2016 at 17:54 #229944
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
I am sure he will do it at twice the pressure whilst I am their as he knows my boiler inspectors will be doing the same Sunday. Hopefully by the time I get their it will still be on test at 180.

I have to believe he will put it right this time as I am sure he is fed up me going back as much as I am.

Could not take another failure it's very hard to keep getting motivated then so disappointed plus the extra costs petrol reprinting etc.
15 March 2016 at 17:17 #230131
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Sorry re painting not re printed
19 March 2016 at 09:35 #230690
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Well was hoping to get my Boiler back today but still have a problem the front fitting he cant get the thread to seal as he had to remove to weld leaking boiler tube.

He has used ptfe tape did not work now trying copper ptfe to see if that will seal the thread.

I am thinking this boiler is jinxed so many problems getting really worried if it will ever be ok.

I am supposed to take for boiler pressure test Sunday he is going to ring me dinner time if it has sealed.

If not don't know what next step will be surprised he can't seal or blank it of he must do so when he makes the boiler.

Wish i understood more but how they pressure test when not threaded and can do twice working pressure baffles me.

Ron
19 March 2016 at 09:44 #230693
nigel jones 5
Participant
@nigeljones5
I am baffled by how a commercial boiler maker manages to get it so wrong. It must be very frustrating for you.If you need a thread sealing you will do no better than using loctite (grade varies with application but aside from locking thread they seal even when there are big gaps in thread). I use it on all my fittings including sight glasses, no gaskets and no need to even make the thread tight – screw it in to the position you want, leave it an hour and guaranteed perfection every time. simply add heat to remove – and i mean flame heat, not boiling water!
19 March 2016 at 10:30 #230702
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Now you have said that I remember I had Loctite on thread when I fitted it. The thread was a good tight fit and did not leak on pressure test at club just the 3 leaks on the welds. Just hope it passes when he phones dinner time. To think I bought this so I would not have problems with the one I built. So disappointed hoping when it's finally done it lasts. Guys at my club say you could get more problems after several repairs as it leaves other welds weak after so much heat. Hope it's not a £3000 mistake.

Ron
19 March 2016 at 13:10 #230732
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Well boiler not ready yet still hoping to get it tomorrow in time for boiler test at club tomorrow.

He wants to wait for copper silicone to dry going to try it in the morning.

Fingers crossed begging to wonder if it will ever be any good.
20 March 2016 at 09:11 #230823
Ron Hancock
Participant
@ronhancock63652
Well it's still leaking from front fitting so no boiler test today got to wait for a call tomorrow if he can get fitting to seal will book boiler test for Wed will it ever be finished

Ron
20 March 2016 at 09:59 #230831
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
Ron,

You do seem to taking one step forward and two steps back. If a professional boiler maker cannot set it up for safe testing what chance has the average end user? Money back time form my point of view.

Was the £3000 bill really that much cheaper than any other Quote you may have been given? If so, were all the quotes given on an identical basis for the same actual design and detailing?

For your own sake, I know you want to complete this loco, hopefully very soon, but do not be pressured by this or any person into accepting 3rd best, perhaps better to start again?
20 March 2016 at 10:17 #230835
J Hancock
Participant
@jhancock95746
'Something' tells me this is more than just a thread sealing problem.

I am sure your boilermaker is 'doing his best' but only those who have 'been there' , know how difficult it is

to reheat a big boiler to cure a leak , without causing further leaks !
20 March 2016 at 10:24 #230839
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
A big boiler?
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