Indexable lathe tools

[osrixParticipant @osrix]

I'm looking for my first set of lathe tools

So Ive been looking at these sets:

Glanze turning parting Threading Boring & Knurling Set 5/8 Size (Ref: 977720)

Soba Turning – Parting – Threading Boring & Knurling Set 3/8 Size (Ref:977701)

And this 9 piece from rdg

http://www.rdgtools.co.uk/acatalog/9PC-Turning—Boring—Parting-and-Grooving-Tool-Set-10mm-Shank-34554332.html#SID=535

I want to be able to do some threading, a knurling tool would be useful and I intend to progress to Stainless steel in the coming months

Does anyone have any good advice on the makes and sets above, is there something else I should be looking for?

Is thicker better? I can use up to 12mm on my tool post should I be going as big as I can or is there advantage to smaller tools

The set from RDG looks good but no info on the insert size.

Any and all advice very welcome!

cheers

Ben

[osrixParticipant @osrix]

[Jim NolanParticipant @jimnolan76764]

Make sure the tips are readily available I looked at something similar recently and you could only get replacement tips from one source.

J&L, Cromwell and Cutwell all do similar offers, more expensive but the tips are industry standard.

Do you need all the tools at once perhaps consider going down the free tool if you buy X tips which most of the tool companies also offer.

Jim

[Douglas JohnstonParticipant @douglasjohnston98463]

The holders are quite easy to make yourself and that way you can start by finding a source of decent inserts then make a suitable set of holders. When I started using carbide inserts a good few years ago the holders were very expensive (a lot cheaper now ) and I bought one to try it, then realised that they were not difficult to make and I have been making them ever since.

Ebay is a good place to find tips but you must be careful regarding size, tip radius and quality.

Doug

[VicParticipant @vic]

Bigger is better for tool holders up to a point so yes, use 12mm if you can.

[VicParticipant @vic]

http://www.jbcuttingtools.com

Is another source of supply.

[Anonymous]

Personally I wouldn't have anything to do with the boxed sets. You are unlikely to need all the tools; far better to buy individually. I looked into a Chronos set some years ago, but the inserts were not an industrial standard, equals unobtanium. Far better to go with standard CCMT or CCGT inserts which are widely available from multiple sources.

I have several Glanze boring bars; they seem fine to me. However the inserts that came with them were useless, so I binned them and bought brand name CCMT inserts.

Everything else is secondary to what happens at the interface between work and tool, so I have two rules regarding cutting tools:

Rule 1: Never buy cheap cutting tools; they are false economy

Rule 2: See rule 1

You'll need some HSS blanks as well. I still use quite a lot of HSS for specials.

Andrew

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

If you must use carbide tips, get good quality named tips, I use Sandvic, but there are plenty of others. HSS is probably the most economic way to go, and is suitable for most work, works ok on stainless for me.

Ian S C

[osrixParticipant @osrix]

Thanks you all for the replies, some great information there, its a minefield for the beginner with so many types and grades of tool, but not clearly standardised by some manufacturers.

HSS should be ideal, after all I use HSS for drilling and tapping of Stainless steel, but there is a such a good press of indexable carbide tooling that Its difficult to make the right choice

I'll take a look at jbcutting tools Vic thank you.

What about cutting angle ive seen LH and RH turning tools at 93 degrees as well as 75 degrees, what does that mean to the end user, is that rate of removal and therefore more required torque and added heat to the workpiece?

Still confused but getting there! Thanks for the help so far.

[CabengParticipant @cabeng]

I'm 100% with the comments from Andrew & Ian, but if these are to be your very first lathe tools, i.e. you're new to metal cutting, then I would add don't go for inserted tips, but learn with HSS first. Go straight to carbides and you run the risk of seriously damaging your bank account. Asking how I know this would be to ask a silly question!

I only ever buy tips in a SEALED box, with the manufacturer's name & tip reference on it, and preferably with the cutting data on the label. The cutting data tells you what material the tip is intended for, the range of depths of cut and feeds it is suitable for, and the cutting speeds. Without that information you are working blind when it comes to cutting metal. If the label or the seller can't provide that information, don't buy the insert(s).

Here are two I can thoroughly recommend for model engineering applications, I've used these for umpty-one years:

Turning: Sumitomo CCGT060202N-SC-T1200A

Boring: Sumitomo TPGT080202L-W-T1200A & for a larger boring bar TPGT110302L-W-T1200A

[VicParticipant @vic]

Many of the industrial type inserts don't work well on small Lathes which is a shame as they are a similar price and often being double sided offer 6-8 cutting tips before needing to be replaced. The smaller Rhomboid style inserts which work well on small Lathes are normally only single sided so you only get two cutting tips. As said HSS is going to come in handy at some point, Cromwell have a special offer on 8% Cobalt HSS blanks at the moment.

[speelwerkParticipant @speelwerk]

I use these **LINK** from Komet now for a long time, they have 3 tips with a very small radius, ideal for the small work I do. Niko.

[Tony RayParticipant @tonyray65007]

APT is another supplier that sells quality items at fair prices

[osrixParticipant @osrix]

So what about this eccentric tool, seems like it can do it all. except internal threading?

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by osrix on 28/02/2015 15:54:23:

So what about this eccentric tool, seems like it can do it all. except internal threading?

It's a tool well worth having whether you buy one or make it yourself. Several threads on here, search for Tangential tool.

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Posted by Vic on 28/02/2015 19:25:11:

Posted by osrix on 28/02/2015 15:54:23:

So what about this eccentric tool, seems like it can do it all. except internal threading?

It's a tool well worth having whether you buy one or make it yourself. Several threads on here, search for Tangential tool.

Have one too, does most of the work I have done / do ( 90% ) easy to grind & keep sharp.

George.

[MM57Participant @mm57]

Posted by Cabeng on 28/02/2015 12:49:54:

Here are two I can thoroughly recommend for model engineering applications, I've used these for umpty-one years:

Turning: Sumitomo CCGT060202N-SC-T1200A

Boring: Sumitomo TPGT080202L-W-T1200A & for a larger boring bar TPGT110302L-W-T1200A

Is there a UK supplier for these please?

[VicParticipant @vic]

These are my Tangential tools. Bought one is second from the right.

[CabengParticipant @cabeng]

I get my Sumitomo & Iscar inserts from H. B. Tools:

http://www.hbtools.co.uk/

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Whilst I have used Sumitomo inserts, they are in my opinion very good, but not to the extent that you should pay any premium over Korloy, Sandvik etc.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

It's a little confusing to start with but the part numbering system for tool holders and inserts is fairly simple once you see how it works. The ANSI (American) and ISO (rest of the world) systems are similar but use different units of measurement naturally.

Here are examples of Tool holder nomenclature and Insert nomenclature

The different manufacturers have different grades that don't exactly equate but there are various Grade cross references

If you buy from any of the main manufacturers through reputable suppliers, you shouldn't have a problem. But there are many different grades and options, so it pays to make sure you aren't buying an oddball insert. Again, if you buy from a reputable supplier, they are most likely going to be offering fairly standard parts and grades.

The polished inserts (CCGT etc) are often recommended for light alloys but may be a good choice for turning steel in small machines.

Never used them myself but this is another UK supplier of carbide tooling.

Murray

Actually, I lie. Seems I bought some KGT inserts from them last year. Good price and fast service.

Edited By Muzzer on 01/03/2015 13:14:51

[osrixParticipant @osrix]

Thanks Muzzer thats very helpful in understanding it all!

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Most of my indexable tools use the CC*T0602 size inserts. For alloys, that would be the CCGT (ground and polished) and for steel, the CCMT. Boring bars are the 10mm SCLCR06 (right hand) which will bore down to 8mm diameter and larger 14mm diameter version for bigger holes. For turning I use a pair of simple left and right holders (16mm height for my Colchester bantam). It's handy using the same inserts for several tools, as they aren't cheap. Not much point going for larger inserts, as you may not have the power to use them and they will cost more.

Edited By Muzzer on 01/03/2015 18:37:59

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

This is OT, During WW2 a secret operation was carried out on the West Coast of the South Island of NZ, it lasted about 4 years, and involved only one person, he extracted tungsten from the iron sands on the beaches, and made tungsten carbide lathe tool tips that were sent from there to Britain and USA, I think some went to Austrailia and NZ. I don't know of any documentation of this exercise.

Ian S C

[Author]

Posts