Tools you hate using or just don’t get on with?

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

I was just wondering. Do any of you guys find that you don’t seem to be able to master a particular tool or technique? For example, I know many people struggle with parting off or screw cutting.

But for me, there are 3 that I am simply terrible at/with:

1. Slitting saws – I don’t think I’ve ever seen one that runs perfectly true and I don’t think I have ever managed to cut a nice accurate slot. I quite often destroy the teeth too!

2. Reamers – I don’t know what I am doing wrong but the reamed holes I make are almost always worse than just drilling or boring.

3. Fly cutters – Maybe it’s just mine, but it’s always out of balance and vibrating horribly. I’ve never managed to achieve the mirror like finish that some people can.

So I am interested, is there anything YOU are particularly bad at? Or is there any tools you just hate using?

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Nothing that springs to mind for me but I’ll offer these in response to your hates.

1. They never seem concentric so I don’t worry about that. Destroyed teeth are usually down to running too fast, a 100mm HSS saw only wants to be doing about 100rpm max in steel. Too fine a pitch will clog and not help with getting a straight cut. Save fine pitch blades for slotting screw heads or cutting thing 3mm or less material.

2. Hand or machine reamer? What size pilot hole?. Typically A machine reamer wants to run at half your drilling speed a hand one under power very slowly. 0.2mm undersize drill for upto 8mm holes then 0.3mm less for upto 15mm holes. and use lubricant.

3. Again flycutters don’t want to be that fast, a typical MT3 or R8 one with 63mm head may be swinging an 80mm dia at the tip so 100rpm with an HSS tool in steel which should not get too out of balance. This also means a slow feed rate is needed Correct grinding to prevent rubbing and keeping the tool sharp is the way to a good finish

[Kiwi BlokeParticipant @kiwibloke62605]

I just can’t get on with other people’s hand tools. My own are familiar old friends, and I understand their ways, but alien tools aren’t friendly.

[Nigel BennettParticipant @nigelbennett69913]

Worst tool ever – the misnamed “Easy-Out”. All you end up doing is expanding the thing you’re trying to extract so it’s an even tighter fit in the hole, and then snapping the damned thing off flush so now you have a hardened piece of steel down the hole so you can’t now drill it out. I threw my set of the things away.

[Peter Cook 6Participant @petercook6]

Tweezers for inserting taper pins in small clocks.

However much work I put into dressing the tweezers, and however much care I take in gripping and holding the pins, I inevitably spend 10 minutes on my hands and knees in the workshop looking for the pin that took flight.

Oh and the pin that squirted away is always smaller than anything I have in stock – so I have to thin one down!!!

[John MCParticipant @johnmc39344]

Those telescopic bore gauges.  They seem to be popular but I’ve never had much luck with them.  Fortunatley, there are much better ways to measure a bore.

I was gifted a set of them many years ago, I was delighted and grateful until I tried to use them to determine the diameter of a bore accurately.  When asked, by the gifter, how I was getting on with them, I answered honestly!  He agreed with my thoughts and suggested passing them on to anyone who wanted them…

I have, due to circumstance, tried to use them occaisionaly, still hate the b****y things.

[John MC]

On John MC Said:

Those telescopic bore gauges.  They seem to be popular but I’ve never had much luck with them.  Fortunatley, there are much better ways to measure a bore.

I was gifted a set of them many years ago, I was delighted and grateful until I tried to use them to determine the diameter of a bore accurately.  When asked, by the gifter, how I was getting on with them, I answered honestly!  He agreed with my thoughts and suggested passing them on to anyone who wanted them…

I have, due to circumstance, tried to use them occaisionaly, still hate the b****y things.

couldn’t agree more, I have much better success with internal spring callipers, just hold up to the light when presenting to the micrometer

[jaCK HobsonParticipant @jackhobson50760]

hand-held routers

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

Well I’m glad it’s not just me! 😂

Jason – Thanks for the pointers. In regards to the reamers, I am equally bad with both. I usually drill about 0.1mm under, regardless of size. The holes usually end up fairly accurate, but the surface finish usually ends up looking like a ploughed field. I generally try to avoid them if possible. I get a much better result from boring.

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Concerning Nigels “Easy-Out” extractor problems I’m a fan of the straight splined shaft style originally introduced by Ridgid.

Drill the right size hole, bang the shaft in, the spines grip the sides of the hole so the fastener remnant can be unwound using the special nut to drive the shaft. Almost always works, if it doesn’t you are left with a plain hole so other things can be tried.

Individual sizes aren’t silly expensive at around £11 in the UK direct from the Ridgid Toolshop :-

https://ridgidtoolshop.co.uk/product/model-1-screw-extractor/?utm_source=Google%20Shopping&utm_campaign=Pipe-Tube-Cutting-and-Prep&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=adtribes&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=17338995289&gbraid=0AAAAAC_JXN1yQ7isatwfrBtLxxP8F3SGn&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuIGIh6yOlgMVEYhQBh2VKRTjEAQYCyABEgJNU_D_BwE

but you do have to supply your own drill.

The full kits with drills, drill guides et al containing 5 sizes form nominal 6 mm to nominal 13 mm, 1/4″ to 1/2″, in a case are bit, ahem, spendy at £170

https://ridgidtoolshop.co.uk/product/model-10-screw-extractor-set/?_gl=1*1shp8dt*_up*MQ..*_gs*MQ..*_ga*OTM4NzU0MzI1LjE3ODYxMDkyOTg.*_ga_FHLTYZ39GV*czE3ODYxMDkyOTgkbzEkZzEkdDE3ODYxMDk0NjUkajYwJGwwJGgxMTYyNjMyNzg.&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuIGIh6yOlgMVEYhQBh2VKRTjEAQYCyABEgJNU_D_BwE&gbraid=0AAAAAC_JXN1yQ7isatwfrBtLxxP8F3SGn

But similar can be obtained more cheaply from, for example, Sykes Picavant £90, Britool £60 and E-Bay no-name £20. Personally I’d be chary about using anything other than known quantity brand name for the extractor part that does the hard work. But it’s almost tempting to get the E-Bay offering for the case and non precision accessories to replace the actual extractors with the genuine McCoy. A bare set of 5 extractors and nuts is about £35 from Ridgid. So if the drills in a bay of E set are OK you are potentially saving over £100.

Most of the time mine get used off site, down the garden or at least in the garage so having a proper case to keep everything under control wouldn’t be the worst idea in the world.

I’ve had my genuine ones come back from being borrowed bent and/or twisted but not broken. I don’t lend them any more, however dramatic and tearful the appeal!

Worst part of the job is usually driving the threaded remnant off the shaft. Creativity needed as the splined shaft becomes seriously seriously tight. Centring the hole can be bit fraught too but they work fine even when not dead on.

Clive

[JasonB]

On JasonB Said:

Save fine pitch blades for slotting screw heads or cutting thing >3mm material.

 

0.2mm undersize drill for >8mm holes

I think the forum software may be doing bad things with your post as it has put ‘greater than’ symbols into your post where I think you intend a ‘less than’ symbol.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

“Easy outs” the worst described tools in the workshop.

Usualy jams the remains tighter, if it hasn’t broken off as well!

Howard

[DC31k]

On DC31k Said:

I think the forum software may be doing bad things with your post

I think it was my fingers

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

Hope I don’t sound smug, but I get along with my set of bore gauges. Provided I’ve made sure that the plungers are fully free to move when I want them to be and fully locked when I want them to be I find they give good results. I always take the reading for as many times as is necessary to make me confident it’s a reliable reading. That’s usually three times, but may be more.

Tools I don’t get along with? Anything requiring forceful two-handed operation, e.g. a cold chisel and a lump hammer, a hammer and a nail, a lump of wood held over a bench edge or milk crate and sawn with the other hand. The first two are awkward to say the least, the last simply isn’t going to happen. So it gets a bit boring when I go to Selco’s timber section and there’s a hand saw and a notice inviting customers to saw their own piece to size over the edge of a trolley or a rickety table. If there was a vice to hold the timber it wouldn’t be a problem, but there never is.

[Graham MeekParticipant @grahammeek88282]

Slitting saws are, if YouTube is anything to go by. Often run far too fast, in some of the posts I do wonder if they are cutting wood not metal. Four times the Surface Speed of the material divided, by the diameter of the cutter, (4S/D), (The Units are in Feet from memory, I have never tried it in metric units), this will often give a ball park RPM and I always err on the low side as selecting from the RPM available. Cutting oil is always used, even on Brass.

There was a discussion on reaming last December, I think. One thing that was not brought up at the time was the question of lubrication. I use a general cutting oil for Brass and Aluminium, but WD40 is also good for Aluminium. When reaming Steel I use something like Rocol liquid, Rocol RTD or Temaxol. These three are also used for tapping.

A large radius on the flycutter will often cause vibration. A keenly stoned HSS cutter will produce an excellent almost mirror like finish on Brass or Aluminium.

Regards

Gray,

[Graham MeekParticipant @grahammeek88282]

Now I have had chance to check my notes, and the Migraine has cleared, the Cutter size D in the formula above is in Inches.

Thus for Mild Steel at 60 Feet/Min, and a 3″ diameter cutter, (4 x 60)/3 = 80 RPM.

Regards

Gray,

 

[Charles LamontParticipant @charleslamont71117]

Tools I hate using: a spade! Big garden, but I would mostly rather be in the workshop.

[jimmy bParticipant @jimmyb]

For me it’s adjustable hand reamers!

 

Just never had any luck with them…..

 

Jimb

[jaCK HobsonParticipant @jackhobson50760]

What about favorite tools? Currently it is my mini-digger but I’m running out of holes to dig.

 

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Didn’t really get on with Keats angle plates etc for turning eccentrics so designed my own eccentric chuck (which seems to be on loan most of the time).

[PeteParticipant @pete41194]

I thought this was an extremely clever method of modifying and then being able to offset a Keats Angle plate to a known dimension Bernard. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmwBNV6boj0

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Interesting never seen that before thhank you

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

An excellent upgrade … and very nicely presented

Thanks for the link, Pete

MichaelG.

[John MC]

On John MC Said:

Those telescopic bore gauges.  They seem to be popular but I’ve never had much luck with them.  Fortunatley, there are much better ways to measure a bore.

I was gifted a set of them many years ago, I was delighted and grateful until I tried to use them to determine the diameter of a bore accurately.  When asked, by the gifter, how I was getting on with them, I answered honestly!  He agreed with my thoughts and suggested passing them on to anyone who wanted them…

I have, due to circumstance, tried to use them occaisionaly, still hate the b****y things.

Can you describe how exactly you’re using them?

There are a few techniques, and some work better than others.

Here’s a video that I think demonstrates the most practical and repeatable technique:

Yes, he has a far bigger workshop than most of us, and bigger machine toolsbthdn we’re likely ever to have, and worst of all, he’s a frightfully vulgar American! 🧐

But seriously, his videos are pretty good, and this one in particular is excellent.

I’ve started building up a collection of analog ‘tri-mike’ type, bore micrometers, so I don’t use them as often, but when I have to use them on larger bores (have you seen the cost of the larger ‘tti-mikes’?🫣), I can generally get a repeatable reading within a couple of hundredths of a mm.

I’m afraid that this is one of those instances where it doesn’t pay to go down-market on these things.

They key to them producing repeatable results is the ability to snug up the ‘lock’ just enough so they are set to the bore diameter as you rotate them out of the bore, but will remain at that settings afterwards, and that the tightening up of the ‘lock’ to then measure in the micrometer doesn’t alter the setting.  Cheaper telescopic gauges tend to feel gritty, and aren’t smooth moving, and the tightening of the ‘lock’ can affect the final result.

Mitutoyo are always a reliable manufacturer and their set, whilst not cheap, is not unaffordable (£180 from Digital Micrometers Limited, an official Mitutoyo dealer).  You can find a second-hand set, for about £100.

M&W?  Made in China, and whilst they may be fine, for £170, I’m not willing to take a punt.

Starrett? Who knows where they’re made these days.

This Old Tony has a video where he finds a Browne and Sharp set is less than brilliant.  He then goes on to fettle them to a good usable state, so this video is worth watching for anyone who has a set that isn’t as smooth as they might wish:

He’s also quite amusing in a surprisingly gentle, rather ‘unamerican’, self-deprecating way! 😄

[renardiere7Participant @renardiere7]

Probably because he lives in France and picked up some Old World manners!

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