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  • #35448
    Neil Wyatt
    Moderator
      @neilwyatt
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      #405218
      Neil Wyatt
      Moderator
        @neilwyatt

        Terrible scenes at Notre Dame, but it seems the majority of the stone structure will survive. Surely they will rebuild, like York Minster.

        But an awful loss of heritage, history and art.

        Neil

        #405222
        Ian Johnson 1
        Participant
          @ianjohnson1

          I've been following this on Twitter, terrible thing to happen, but entirely preventable. I can think of three recent fires involving 'national treasures' all caused by poor fire controls during restoration.

          Windsor Castle fire, Charles Rennie Macintosh Art School in Glasgow and The Cutty Sark.

          Surely they must be worth protecting with better fire precautions?

          #405225
          AJW
          Participant
            @ajw

            We were there only a couple of years ago, wonderful building, such a shame.

            Alan

            #405227
            Nicholas Farr
            Participant
              @nicholasfarr14254

              Hi, yes terrible shame. President Macron says together they can rebuild it. The aerial view they showed with the whole of the inside engulfed in flames, looked devastating.

              Regards Nick.

              #405228
              Hopper
              Participant
                @hopper
                Posted by Ian Johnson 1 on 15/04/2019 22:53:54:

                I've been following this on Twitter, terrible thing to happen, but entirely preventable. I can think of three recent fires involving 'national treasures' all caused by poor fire controls during restoration.

                Windsor Castle fire, Charles Rennie Macintosh Art School in Glasgow and The Cutty Sark.

                Surely they must be worth protecting with better fire precautions?

                And the National Motorcycle Museum at Beaulieu a few years ago. Started by a cigarette butt in a skip of air-con filters but not a sprinkler in sight.

                #405230
                ronan walsh
                Participant
                  @ronanwalsh98054
                  Posted by Hopper on 15/04/2019 23:26:53:

                  Posted by Ian Johnson 1 on 15/04/2019 22:53:54:

                  I've been following this on Twitter, terrible thing to happen, but entirely preventable. I can think of three recent fires involving 'national treasures' all caused by poor fire controls during restoration.

                  Windsor Castle fire, Charles Rennie Macintosh Art School in Glasgow and The Cutty Sark.

                  Surely they must be worth protecting with better fire precautions?

                  And the National Motorcycle Museum at Beaulieu a few years ago. Started by a cigarette butt in a skip of air-con filters but not a sprinkler in sight.

                  Wasn't that the place in Birmingham, well between Birmingham and Coventry ?

                  #405231
                  Ian Johnson 1
                  Participant
                    @ianjohnson1

                    Yes it's near to the National Exhibition Centre (NEC) Birmingham, as far as i know the fire spread through the roof ceiling voids, no fire breaks. They did a great job of restoring the burnt out classic motorcycles.

                    #405235
                    Mike Poole
                    Participant
                      @mikepoole82104

                      A little clarification for you Hopper, the National Mototorcycle museum is at Bickenhill near Birmingham and the National Motor Museum is at Beaulieu, the motorcycle one burnt down but is now near fully restored. Just had an entertaining 3 hour talk from Norman Hyde on his days as a development engineer for Triumph which seemed a good excuse to race Triumphs, they had great success for a low budget operation with Doug Hele leading the team.

                      Mike

                      #405238
                      Hopper
                      Participant
                        @hopper

                        He would be an interesting talk for sure. I read somewhere that Hele made a prototype Trident circa 1963 out of 2 500 twin motors. But got told nobody would buy multi cylinder bikes. Doh.

                        And yes my UK geography is sketchy at best. Still have trouble imagining somewhere 100 miles away is regarded as a different place. 😁

                        #405245
                        JasonB
                        Moderator
                          @jasonb

                          The contractors I used to work for were involved in quite a bit of church work, there was always a clause in the contract that said no lead burning after say 2.00pm which was meant to allow time for any small smouldering fire to be spotted while people were still on site. Did not say anything about use of angle grinders which could just as easily throw a spark that could start a fire several hours later.

                          This was one that we did a lot on, fan heater got it in the end. Has been refurbed as the brick and stone were sound. Stained glass and all the lead organ pipes were lost as well as the roof.

                          #405246
                          Simon Collier
                          Participant
                            @simoncollier74340

                            Even if money was no object, are there any workers with the skills? Under about 80 I mean.

                            #405248
                            john carruthers
                            Participant
                              @johncarruthers46255

                              Before the big footed structural guys get in there to shore it up, let the glaziers pick over the rubble.
                              Sort each fragment of glass into seperate boxes marked with the position found.
                              More importantly what depth or layer it was found in.
                              The drafts in a fire can suck fragile glass from one end of a church to the other.
                              We found that out after the York Minster fire

                              #405251
                              Former Member
                              Participant
                                @formermember32069

                                [This posting has been removed]

                                #405252
                                martin perman 1
                                Participant
                                  @martinperman1

                                  According to the BBC this morning most of the interior fixtures, art etc had been removed before restoration, the money pledged is now upto 300 million euro's, structurally the stone building is said to be sound, it will rise again.

                                  Martin P

                                  #405257
                                  Douglas Johnston
                                  Participant
                                    @douglasjohnston98463

                                    Very sad to see such an iconic building in such distress.As has been said there have been a string of high profile fires during renovation and I can't understand why there are not people on site around the clock to reduce the risk to the buildings.

                                    Doug

                                    #405260
                                    Neil Wyatt
                                    Moderator
                                      @neilwyatt

                                      York Minster, was rebuilt, even its great window.

                                      #405262
                                      Alan Waddington 2
                                      Participant
                                        @alanwaddington2

                                        Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

                                        #405264
                                        J Hancock
                                        Participant
                                          @jhancock95746

                                          All on the same day the Titanic sank in 1912 , with the loss of 1700+ lives.

                                          #405265
                                          Tony Pratt 1
                                          Participant
                                            @tonypratt1
                                            Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

                                            Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

                                            My thoughts entirely, totally preventable if the donkeys working on it had taken care in what they were doing!!!!

                                            Tony

                                            #405285
                                            Nicholas Farr
                                            Participant
                                              @nicholasfarr14254
                                              Posted by Simon Collier on 16/04/2019 08:01:04:

                                              Even if money was no object, are there any workers with the skills? Under about 80 I mean.

                                              Hi, this issue was pointed out on the TV this morning, the response was that robots would be able to do many of the tasks, I guess they mean CNC machinery to cut and form timbers and whatever other materials that will be needed.

                                              Regards Nick.

                                              #405286
                                              Nicholas Farr
                                              Participant
                                                @nicholasfarr14254
                                                Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

                                                Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

                                                Hi, but that may not attract valuable tourism.

                                                Regards Nick.

                                                #405291
                                                Martin Kyte
                                                Participant
                                                  @martinkyte99762
                                                  Posted by Nicholas Farr on 16/04/2019 10:53:02:

                                                  Posted by Alan Waddington 2 on 16/04/2019 09:11:34:

                                                  Can’t help thinking the money it will take to rebuild could be better spent elsewhere, its just a building when all’s said and done.

                                                  Hi, but that may not attract valuable tourism.

                                                  Regards Nick.

                                                  Well the 100,000,000 euro's just pledged by a single family wasn't on offer before this happened so you cannot really demand it be spent at all let alone on something else.

                                                  regards Martin

                                                  #405292
                                                  I.M. OUTAHERE
                                                  Participant
                                                    @i-m-outahere

                                                    As tragic as it is losing one of the worlds icons / treasures and many of the pieces of art and artifacts within thankfully no one died !

                                                    We had our ( fortunately) now ex Leader here in OZ come out and ask for a fund to be set up to rebuild it even though we could use that money for Hospitals , Education and probably a million other things we desperately need here – the guy is a di@# head and thank god he is gone !

                                                    #405296
                                                    Ian Johnson 1
                                                    Participant
                                                      @ianjohnson1
                                                      Posted by Mike Poole on 16/04/2019 01:10:53:

                                                      A little clarification for you Hopper, the National Mototorcycle museum is at Bickenhill near Birmingham and the National Motor Museum is at Beaulieu, the motorcycle one burnt down but is now near fully restored. Just had an entertaining 3 hour talk from Norman Hyde on his days as a development engineer for Triumph which seemed a good excuse to race Triumphs, they had great success for a low budget operation with Doug Hele leading the team.

                                                      Mike

                                                      You are right Mike I misread the post, I didn't notice the Beaulieu reference

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