Newbie with Warco WMT 300/2

[georgelane314Participant @georgelane314]

Hi. I’m George. My 2nd hand 300/2 is in my home- built workshop and I recently made a part for a friend: starting with  a 3.6kg cylinder of mild steel, diameter 70 mm, length 120 mm! A small part of the machining was turning, but most of the material was removed using the milling head and took AGES. The finished part weighed less than 1 kg! I understand that the milling head is not the most rigid item and I have experienced this plus the lack of vertical travel and horizontal travel and access.

I am considering buying a used milling machine, possibly a Warco model with a 3MT spindle taper so that I can use my existing tools. I gather that a model 16 might be a good bet.

If anyone knows of a used machine for sale please let me know. Also, any comments or suggestions gratefully received.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Re MT3 taper for use in both machines. Tricky decision as lots of people rave about R8 tapers which are available now on small machines. This is only because they get MT tapers stuck in the spindle owing to improper use ( eg over tightening , leaving for years unoiled, inserting cold taper in hot spindle).
Now when you think about it there are few tools that you actually use in the taper of a lathe spindle once you also have a milling machine. Perhaps a boring head for boring something on the saddle, perhaps a slitting saw arbor. However one thing that is desirable is to have a small chuck that can be moved from lathe to rotary table/dividing head maintaining truth – how often though depends on the type of work you do.

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

Both my lathe and mill have a 3MT taper and I have seldom had a problem removing tapers from the spindle. Tighten with firm pressure only and and a small tap on the drawbar to remove.

I also have an ER32 collet chuck (actually 3 chucks) with a tapered spindle that can be used in either the lathe or mill, which is very handy.

If the taper is stuck, you may be able to use a tapered wedge to release it.

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

(A design for a taper removal tool was published in MEW No 231, August 2015)

[georgelane314Participant @georgelane314]

Thanks for the replies. I have had no problems with the 3MT taper. Additionally, the lathe has an 4MT taper and with a reducer my ER25 collets are used in the 3MT holder. I understand that R8 has advantages with location and particularly with CNC machines,  but I’m not going there. George.

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

R8 grip like the proverbial, don’t get stuck, and give you nearly 50mm more daylight under the spindle. Not generally used for CNC, which is more likely to use an Int style taper.

Or, for the limited range of milling cutter sizes, use mt3 finger collets. Get the R8 height benefit, don’t hold so well, might get stuck.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

My lathe has a 5MT spindle, with a 5 -3 MT sleeve, so that then matches the 3MT in my elderly WARCO Economy mill.

Being an old machine, it has a round column, so changing the position of  the head requires realignment.

A nuisance, but not insuperable. Sometimes the last drill used can be used as a dowel to maintain alignment while the head is raised or lowered (But beware of lowering it so that the drill cannot be removed from the chuck!) The other way is to fix a bracket to the head to rake a DIY store laser.  This is aligned with a line placed on a wall about ten feet away, and you should then be within a thou.

Obviously, don’t look directly at the laser!

After tightening the head clamps, recheck the alignment; it is possible to shift the head slightly during tightening.

The tricks are as said, not to over tighten, (Morse tapers are self gripping so do not need to be very tight, not much more than nipped), and never clamp a cold taper into a warm spindle. The spindle will cool and contract onto the cold taper, and increase the grip.

Removal (Breaking the taper) will need a tap with a mallet on on a slightly slackened drawbar, or making up some form of extractor (I turned back, partially the nut retaining the pulley on the spindle, to take a plate, bored to fit the nut, and with two 1/4 BSF tappings for bolts in a plate carrying a 1/4 BSF forcing screw to bear on the slackened drawbar. Once tightened, even a really tight taper will break with a light tap with a mallet.

The newer machines have dovetail columns which makes head alignment after repositioning easier, and the R8 taper, being fairly steep is easier to break

H T H

Howard

[georgelane314Participant @georgelane314]

Thanks, Howard. Using a laser is a great tip. I’ll try that today perhaps. I’ve certainly had issues with my mill head rotating, so that will help to realign it. I have thought about locking it somehow, but it acts as a safety feature like a clutch on a power tool and that’s probably a good thing for me.

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