New mill vice which one

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

I have been looking on the ARC euro site for a milling vice. My own is a very good Abwood with 100mm wide jaws , but only 70mm of opening. It is a pain so i am looking for one with wider opening jaws. I have read a few comments about the cast iron ones called a Versatile 100mm version with a 122mm opening which would be handy. It seems a very reasonable price. I have also looked at the precision tool vice 90mm with a 120mm opening.

Anyone got either of these & can give some comments on how good they are.

I am not looking at dragging a product down as to buy a similar european model would be out of the question due to cost over usage. I do not mind a bit of deburring & fettling , but do not want any huge errors to try & overcome.

Steve.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

What to buy

[John ReeseParticipant @johnreese12848]

The Versatile vises are Kurt clones and I highly recommend that style vise. You might want to consider the Versatile SG iron vise. The vise can be used on its side, increasing versatility.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Thanks John i will have a look at those.

Steve

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

I originally bought a standard mill vice which came on a swivel base and it has served me well for 8 years. The swivel base is seldom used and I just use the vice and clamp it directly to the mill table. A key slot has been added to the underside of the base for a key which aligns the vice with the mill table slots. Very quick to remove and re-mount the vice for most work..

Also have a 70mm wide precision vice which I use for those more accurate milling operations. It is also handy when machining parts with a double inclined angle by holding it in the standard vice.

I am considering upgrading and would like a Kurt vice but my pockets are not that deep and am looking at getting a versatile vice, a clone of the Kurt but much cheaper.

The advantage of using a precision type vice is the clamping action of the jaws which pull down as the jaws close and not lift as it does in a conventional vice. This also what happens in a Kurt vice.

The jaws can also be re-positioned and used for light clamping of wider parts that wont fit between the standard jaw position.

Paul

[Ron LadenParticipant @ronladen17547]

I have the ARC Versatile 80mm vice and I can't fault it and at the price it represents great value for money. Like most I never use the swivel base so removed it which on the 80mm reduces the height by 30mm. I have not needed to do any deburing on mine I used it straight out of the box. I also went around it with a test indicator checking from both open to closed and it's as good as I will ever need.

No connection with ARC just a very satisfied customer.

[Stuart BridgerParticipant @stuartbridger82290]

I have had the Vertex VA4 for a number of years and rate it like all the Vertex kit I have.
Nominally a 4" vice with 102 mm width and 103mm opening.

[Chris CrewParticipant @chriscrew66644]

I too have a Vertex 4" vise on a swivelling base. I can't fault it for the price, just like all the other so called cheap 'Chinese crap' I have (dividing head, rotary table, boring head etc.) everything does exactly what it says on the tin perfectly accurately enough for anything outside of the tool-room at Rolls-Royce.

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

Add me to the list of ARC worshippers. I have a 100mm SG versatile vice and in addition to the alternative jaw positions akin to those illustrated above in Paul's reply, with a bit of inginuity and a number of parallels, it's possible to hold large items quite steady for through hole drilling, I did this set up when I made up the perspex walls for my gearbox build. (Perspex because it's transparent for display purposes.)

John

[Oily RagParticipant @oilyrag]

I'm a firm believer that you can never have enough vices! My collection is of 4" Abwood, 4" Edgwick, 100mm Aciera with swivel base (an extremely low level vice for a swivelling action) and a 4" Palmgreen as well as a 3" J&S multi swivel vice. The Abwood and Edgwick are almost identical, the Palmgreen has a wide opening (about 5 1/2" IIRC).

If you feel constrained by the 4" Abwood (a fine vice in my opinion) have you considered Mite-Bites as a method of clamping oversized work directly to the mill table? I use mine about 30% of the time.

Martin

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Posted by Oily Rag on 22/02/2021 11:17:03:

I'm a firm believer that you can never have enough vices! My collection is of 4" Abwood, 4" Edgwick, 100mm Aciera with swivel base (an extremely low level vice for a swivelling action) and a 4" Palmgreen as well as a 3" J&S multi swivel vice. The Abwood and Edgwick are almost identical, the Palmgreen has a wide opening (about 5 1/2" IIRC).

If you feel constrained by the 4" Abwood (a fine vice in my opinion) have you considered Mite-Bites as a method of clamping oversized work directly to the mill table? I use mine about 30% of the time.

Martin

Do you mean Mitee-Bites? and if so which type? They look interesting but I have just googled mite-bites and the images of mite bites were quite disturbing!

A true story!!

[Oily RagParticipant @oilyrag]

Sorry Nick, you are quite right – it is 'Mitee Bites'. The dog gets the Mite bites! I blame it on my fingers at this late time in the morning.

As I use them on an Aciera F3 they are the 3/8" size ones (the Aciera being 10mm Tee slots). I bought them on a vist to the US before I believe anyone was importing them. I have two sets of 4 in a box in each set, the earlier purchased set were slightly taller than the later ones. I was wary of them at first but am amazed at how much holding power they have. Easy to use as well.

Edited By Oily Rag on 22/02/2021 12:30:20

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Thanks – but worryingly it is only a couple of days until payday, so I must keep temptation in check!

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by Oily Rag on 22/02/2021 11:17:03:

I'm a firm believer that you can never have enough vices! My collection is of 4" Abwood, 4" Edgwick, 100mm Aciera with swivel base (an extremely low level vice for a swivelling action) and a 4" Palmgreen as well as a 3" J&S multi swivel vice. The Abwood and Edgwick are almost identical, the Palmgreen has a wide opening (about 5 1/2" IIRC).

If you feel constrained by the 4" Abwood (a fine vice in my opinion) have you considered Mite-Bites as a method of clamping oversized work directly to the mill table? I use mine about 30% of the time.

Martin

 

Agreed. There are plenty of make your own designs out there so I’d be tempted to make them.

http://www.homews.co.uk/page560.html

 

Edited By Vic on 22/02/2021 12:49:33

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by Steviegtr on 21/02/2021 21:31:26:

I have been looking on the ARC euro site for a milling vice.

……

I have also looked at the precision tool vice 90mm with a 120mm opening.

Anyone got either of these & can give some comments on how good they are.

….

Steve.

If you are looking at the ‘precision type 2’ you will either love it or hate it. I happen to like them and they are my general ‘go to’ options. The 70mm lives on the Raglan and the 90mm on the Centec.

My second one (the 90mm) came from a forum member who bought it but simply did not use it.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

I bought one of ARC's 125mm versatile vises as the 100mm Bison's did not open enough. It came with a removable rotating base, which can be invaluble on the odd occasions when it is needed. Their SG vises are nicer, but more expensive and do not have the rotating base.

The 125mm is about the limit for a Tom Senior bed, the 100mm would fit better. I can recommend the versatile, it is great value and not badly constructed.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Posted by old mart on 22/02/2021 15:23:56:

I bought one of ARC's 125mm versatile vises as the 100mm Bison's did not open enough. It came with a removable rotating base, which can be invaluble on the odd occasions when it is needed. Their SG vises are nicer, but more expensive and do not have the rotating base.

The 125mm is about the limit for a Tom Senior bed, the 100mm would fit better. I can recommend the versatile, it is great value and not badly constructed.

Yes old mart i had already discounted the 125mm version because of size. From comments , the versatile 100mm sounds to be the one i maybe should go for. The precision one looks nice , but of course is more money.

I saw a few video's of the versatile that had been stripped & slightly fettled to make it better than is. Or is this one different.???.

Steve.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Just had another look on arc. The SG cast iron ones look very nice & would have the benefit of being able to move back or forward due to having slots as opossed to fixing points. mmmm. Any one got one of those models.

ARC No 130-040-03500.

Steve.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

The SG iron ones are better if you don't mind the extra money, but having no swivel base is a shame. Lots of people seem to discount the value of the swivel base, but they are detachable and can come in handy. I have two, the other one came with the NOS 100mm Bison that matches exactly the one the museum already had. I have used both on occasion. The versatile vise could be clamped down using the flange round the sides if necessary.

Edited By old mart on 23/02/2021 16:31:50

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

In the last 13 years I have probably only used my swivel bases twice and I could just have easily set the vice at an angle using other means if needed and would probably have to do that anyway if an accurate angle was needed.

The SG ones although of a similar jaw width have a smaller footprint as they don't have that lip running all round making it easier to see the dials and get the vice further back on the table without having to cut bits off.

[John CParticipant @johnc47954]

Posted by Steviegtr on 22/02/2021 20:55:03:

Just had another look on arc. The SG cast iron ones look very nice & would have the benefit of being able to move back or forward due to having slots as opossed to fixing points. mmmm. Any one got one of those models.

ARC No 130-040-03500.

Steve.

Steve, I have that vice on my generic 626 mill. I find it very good indeed. One of the reasons for choosing that vice was the (relatively) low profile, as I suffered from lack of headroom with taller vices. You will need to supply your own clamps.

John

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Well i am glad that the response has been positive for the SG iron model. I have ordered one from ARC. The 100mm one. There is nothing wrong with the Abwood, just the 2 3/4" jaw opening being not enough.

From ARC ad it mentions a little fettling, i have seen a few youtube vids where they have remilled the raw casting which the leadscrew presses against. Also the odd deburr here & there. None of which i will mind doing. The alternative. Well i could not really find one.

Most of the european made ones that give a 4" jaw opening seem to be a bit too large & very expensive too. I would like to get on & make 4 clamps but until it arrives i have no measurements.

Steve.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Posted by JasonB on 23/02/2021 16:41:31:

In the last 13 years I have probably only used my swivel bases twice and I could just have easily set the vice at an angle using other means if needed and would probably have to do that anyway if an accurate angle was needed.

The SG ones although of a similar jaw width have a smaller footprint as they don't have that lip running all round making it easier to see the dials and get the vice further back on the table without having to cut bits off.

My thought too. Smaller footprint.

Steve

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

Academic for you, Steve, since you've made your choice, but one advantage of the Type 2 Precision vices is that, because of the absence of a screw running down the centre of the vice, you can hold relatively long and thin pieces of work upright in the vice with much less projection of the piece above the jaws than would be the case with conventional screw vices.

This might sound like an unlikely advantage, but it's been absolutely indispensable for the work I've been doing.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

They will be stronger and not be brittle like the ordinary cast iron., the Bisons are sg iron and I have drilled and machined them without the horrible black dust. You will have to make some dedicated clamps for it.

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