Broken tap removal

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Broken tap removal

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  • #87661
    Bernard Laycock 1
    Participant
      @bernardlaycock1

      I wonder if anyone knows of a firm within reach of Peterborough who could remove a broken 7BA tap in a copper boiler using spark erosion.

      Bernard

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      #6048
      Bernard Laycock 1
      Participant
        @bernardlaycock1
        #87676
        Sub Mandrel
        Participant
          @submandrel

          Bernard,

          Can you rust it out?

          Neil

          #87715
          Bernard Laycock 1
          Participant
            @bernardlaycock1

            Neil,

            This is an entirely new concept for me. Can you give more information of what's involved?

            Bernard

            #87718
            Peter Tucker
            Participant
              @petertucker86088

              Hi Bernard,

              Sulphuric acid wont atack copper but will teadilly disolve steel so you can remove the tap with that.

              Peter.

              #87719
              Richard Parsons
              Participant
                @richardparsons61721

                Hi Bernard Use Ferric Chloride solution it munches steel faster than it munches copper

                Regds

                Dick

                #87758
                Tomfilery
                Participant
                  @tomfilery

                  Bernard,

                  I would recommend that you do NOT use ferric chloride on copper. Ferric chloride is used for etching the copper tracks on printed circuit boards. Richard Parsons is right that it will attack the steel faster, but it will still attack your copper.

                  I have seen various website posts re the use of Alum to remove steel taps from non-ferrous metals and which appears to be fairly non-aggressive – try googling for that.

                  Regards Tom

                  #87763
                  Phil Ashman
                  Participant
                    @philashman88468

                    I broke a tap in my boiler, and removed it using Alum. It took quite a long time, but it leaves the copper and brass /bronze completely undamaged. It works quicker if it's stong and hot, but in my case it was on the backhead bush, and I had to mould a litttle plasticene container round it to hold the Alum, it wasn't possible to keep it hot.

                    #87765
                    Gone Away
                    Participant
                      @goneaway

                      Phil, I'm curious – can you quantify that "took a long time". Just order-of-magnitude of course …. an hour? ….. a day? ….. a week?

                      #87768
                      Richard Parsons
                      Participant
                        @richardparsons61721

                        Yes Ferric Chloride does dissolve copper. But here we have a combination of copper and steel is a little galvanic cell . Galvanic corrosion occurs with the steel acting as the ‘Wasting anode’

                        Rdgs

                        Dick

                        #87770
                        john jennings 1
                        Participant
                          @johnjennings1

                          It should be possible to remove the steel chemically leaving the copper untouched.

                          (the factors are similar to those discussed in the recent pickle thread)

                          Diluted acid: sulphuric or phosphoric or citric are possible choices (after cleaning of any cutting oil or grease) . Copper sulphate, somewhat acidified is best, will also remove the steel by replacing it wth copper – which will be powdery in nature and crumble away. Some hours/days of treatment may be needed periodic agitation with a nylon fine paint brush will also help.

                          Hydrchoric acid best avoided due to general rust promotion .

                          Ferric choride will dissolve the copper: I think the concept of the setting up of a anode/cathode cell in the mechanical circumstances that exist are small. For effective action a circuit needs completing possibly also with a small applied DC voltage. The tap I guess would need to protrude by 1 or 2 mm to make this possible.

                          I would stick by the above soak and wait strategies!

                          John

                          #87771
                          Keith Wood 1
                          Participant
                            @keithwood1

                            I would go with the alum, I removed three broken 8ba taps from some bronze cylinders, placed the cylinders in a pan of saturated alum solution on the stove and simmered, add a spot of water as the solution evaporates.

                            Two hours and they were gone.

                            Alum is cheap and leaves the copper/bronze untouched.

                            Keith W

                            #87783
                            Sub Mandrel
                            Participant
                              @submandrel

                              Alum was what I had in mind. The hard part is getting hold of some!

                              Neil

                              #87803
                              Ian S C
                              Participant
                                @iansc

                                Neil, go to the garden shop, you might have to buy a Kg of it, but it won't cost a great amount. A few years back I needed some to get some rusted screws out of a brass casting, so I went to the chemist, he was able to get some in a few days later. Awee while later I found that mum had a bag of it in her gardening chemicals cupboard, its been there a good many years, and cost less than a dollar for a 2Kg bag. Ian S C

                                #87808
                                lily brown 1
                                Participant
                                  @lilybrown1

                                  Find more useful information here

                                  #87814
                                  CHRIS WOODS 1
                                  Participant
                                    @chriswoods1

                                    In the UK try 'oneclickpharmacy' where I had 500g of crystals. They were a little slow in delivering however. Also for smaller amounts (200g) try 'kitchen-chemistry' on ebay.

                                    #87816
                                    Les Jones 1
                                    Participant
                                      @lesjones1

                                      Just searching for alum on ebay gives a number of suppliers.

                                      Les.

                                      #87818
                                      Phil Ashman
                                      Participant
                                        @philashman88468

                                        Sid,

                                        Re "it took a long time". If I remember right, it took about 3 weeks, but I had plenty of other things to do while I waited. Keiths post was interesting, I didn't realise it could be done as quickly as that. But I couldn't boil it like he did, I only had a few CCs in a plasticene cup. I also used a saturated solution, but is that the best strength? Maybe the chemists among us would know.

                                        #87819
                                        Ian S C
                                        Participant
                                          @iansc

                                          Think you'll find it in the supper market, in amoung the spices,and other cooking bits and pieces. Ian S C

                                          #87838
                                          David Littlewood
                                          Participant
                                            @davidlittlewood51847

                                            Phil,

                                            As a very rough rule-of-thumb, a chemical reaction will double in speed with every 10 degree (C) rise in temperature, so from 20 degrees to boiling (100) it should be about 250 times faster. (Please don't regard this as a precise measure, there are many exceptions!)

                                            David

                                            #87850
                                            Peter Tucker
                                            Participant
                                              @petertucker86088

                                              Phosphoric acid wont work, it dissolves iron oxide (rust) but leaves the iron (steel) in place.

                                              Peter.

                                              #87874
                                              Bernard Laycock 1
                                              Participant
                                                @bernardlaycock1

                                                It would be lovely if someone could answer my original question?

                                                Bernard

                                                #87877
                                                Ian S C
                                                Participant
                                                  @iansc

                                                  Sorry Bernard, we are model engineers, which is another way of saying DIY, but a bit more technical. We believe in doing it the cheapest (well not always) method, and if it gets stuffed, at least we know who to blame. About spark erosion, if its a model engineer he'll build the machine, then do the job, but I'm a bit far away to be of much help. Ian S C

                                                  #87884
                                                  AndyP
                                                  Participant
                                                    @andyp13730

                                                    What Ian said…. but 2 minutes on Google came up with :-

                                                    Anglia Precision, Peterborough, 01733 703230

                                                    Rivercircle, Peterborough, 01733 315101

                                                    Qualitetch, March, 01354 658787

                                                    Personally, I built one, but thats probably because somebody said I couldn't, or it might have been shouldn't wink

                                                    Andy

                                                    #87894
                                                    MICHAEL WILLIAMS
                                                    Participant
                                                      @michaelwilliams41215

                                                      Hi Bernard ,

                                                      Please look in message box .

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