Problem with Warco WM290V

This topic has 40 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 24 May 2017 at 10:55 by mechman48.

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20 May 2017 at 18:25 #298971
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Hi All

Recently taken delivery of this new lathe from Warco and I am unable to get the feed working on either axis.

The lever on the apron appears stuck and I have not been able to select either feed direction.

Am I missing anything obvious? Thread cutting appears to be working ok so believe the gearbox at head end is all ok as I am seeing the expected rotation of the leadscrew and feed rod dependent on whether thread cutting or feed mode is selected.

Will contact Warco but thought worth checking in here to see if I'm being dumb. Also have lugged the lathe down into my cellar, so I'm obviously not to keen upon the idea of returning.

Looked at taking the apron off to see if anything obviously wrong but could not get easily apart. Am I correct in thinking that it has 2 tapered pins aligning the top bed plate and that these need pulling out by threading in an M4 bolt and levering upwards. Tried this but could not get them to budge. Any tips on removal in case I have to try again?
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20 May 2017 at 18:25 #32979
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
20 May 2017 at 18:35 #298973
alan-lloyd
Participant
@alan-lloyd
Do you not have to engage a lever at the bottom of the headstock
20 May 2017 at 18:44 #298974
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Posted by alan lloyd 3 on 20/05/2017 18:35:26:

Do you not have to engage a lever at the bottom of the headstock

I'm selecting feed at the base of headstock, it has three positions, screwthread cutting / off / feed

It is the lever on the apron that selects carriage or cross feed that I am unable to engage
20 May 2017 at 18:52 #298976
alan-lloyd
Participant
@alan-lloyd
Which shaft is turning? lead or feed?
20 May 2017 at 18:57 #298977
SillyOldDuffer
Moderator
@sillyoldduffer
The lever moves right and up, or left and down . The central neutral position does nothing. Engages best with the motor turning. Another possibility is that the half-nut lever is closed and locked the saddle on the leadscrew. Can you see the shaft and leadcrew turning?

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 20/05/2017 18:58:17
20 May 2017 at 19:41 #298981
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Shaft movement as follows:

Threadcutting – Leadscrew is turing

Feed – Feed shaft is turining

At no time do they both turn, presumably this is not correct as there is therefore no drive? So maybe the issue is in the gearbox under the headstock
20 May 2017 at 20:13 #298985
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
You should only have one of the two turning at any one time.

Sounds like the head end is OK as you can get either screw or feed shaft to turn. Can you get the feed shaft to turn at the three different speeds by selecting A, B or C?

You do have to wait for the groove in the feed shaft to come round to a point where the feed will engage, this can take a while if the lathe spindle is going slow and you also have a fine feed selected.
20 May 2017 at 20:43 #298989
SillyOldDuffer
Moderator
@sillyoldduffer
Apologies if it was me responsible for the 'both shafts turning at the same time' red herring. My first post is badly worded!

If the half-nut is closed as shown in the picture you can't engage the self-act feeds, which is like Nik G's symptoms. The half-nut is opened and closed by the lever on the right of the apron: to select self-act it must be in the up position, not down as shown.

Hope it's something simple,

Dave
20 May 2017 at 20:45 #298990
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Posted by JasonB on 20/05/2017 20:13:47:

You should only have one of the two turning at any one time.

Sounds like the head end is OK as you can get either screw or feed shaft to turn. Can you get the feed shaft to turn at the three different speeds by selecting A, B or C?

You do have to wait for the groove in the feed shaft to come round to a point where the feed will engage, this can take a while if the lathe spindle is going slow and you also have a fine feed selected.

Feedshaft turns at A, B and C

B appears fastest, then A then C
20 May 2017 at 20:48 #298991
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 20/05/2017 20:43:37:

Apologies if it was me responsible for the 'both shafts turning at the same time' red herring. My first post is badly worded!

If the half-nut is closed as shown in the picture you can't engage the self-act feeds, which is like Nik G's symptoms. The half-nut is opened and closed by the lever on the right of the apron: to select self-act it must be in the up position, not down as shown.

Hope it's something simple,

Dave

Lever on right is up, and it functions correctly on threadcutting setting, so appears to be working

It is as if the feed lever is jammed and is not able to key onto feed shaft. Lever is rigid and if you apply pressure it sounds as though something is lightly rubbing in apron gear box. If that makes sense.

Is it worth taking lever support off front of apron box to see if anything seized there?
20 May 2017 at 21:05 #298993
SillyOldDuffer
Moderator
@sillyoldduffer
Posted by Nik G on 20/05/2017 20:48:48:

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 20/05/2017 20:43:37:

,,,

Lever on right is up, and it functions correctly on threadcutting setting, so appears to be working

It is as if the feed lever is jammed and is not able to key onto feed shaft. Lever is rigid and if you apply pressure it sounds as though something is lightly rubbing in apron gear box. If that makes sense.

Is it worth taking lever support off front of apron box to see if anything seized there?

As it's a new lathe I suggest speaking to Warco before doing anything intrusive. I'll have a look at the exploded diagrams in the manual tomorrow and see if that helps, I have a 280 which is similar but haven't had the cross-slide apart.

You must be annoyed, especially having got the thing installed in a cellar. Argh!
20 May 2017 at 21:13 #298996
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
I thought Warco were meant to plug it in and check everything worked before dispatching. I guess not! Having said that I plugged it in and checked it spun up but didn't check all the lever positions, doh! Then moved it

Don't fancy getting it back out of the cellar
20 May 2017 at 21:17 #298997
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Looked at taking the apron off to see if anything obviously wrong but could not get easily apart. Am I correct in thinking that it has 2 tapered pins aligning the top bed plate and that these need pulling out by threading in an M4 bolt and levering upwards. Tried this but could not get them to budge. Any tips on removal in case I have to try again?

Anyone got any comments on this, was I on the right track?
20 May 2017 at 21:29 #298999
Nigel Taylor 2
Participant
@nigeltaylor2
There is a set screw underneath the block from which the lever protrudes. It provides some friction but, if it is too tight, it will lock the handle.
21 May 2017 at 18:14 #299068
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Posted by Nigel Taylor 2 on 20/05/2017 21:29:00:

There is a set screw underneath the block from which the lever protrudes. It provides some friction but, if it is too tight, it will lock the handle.

I have completely removed the bolt/set screw and it made no difference
21 May 2017 at 19:11 #299074
mechman48
Participant
@mechman48
I would get back onto Warco tomorrow a.m. & get them to sort it, you shouldn't have to do any major work to a new machine, start taking screws / pins out here / there & everywhere & you'll void any warranty. There is the old cliché… 'fit for purpose' which this clearly is not so it is up to Warco to remedy it, unfortunately it will mean lugging it back out of the cellar for return… unless you can persuade Warco to send a workshop technician out to 'fix on site'… . So much for ' thoroughly tested before dispatch'.

George.
21 May 2017 at 19:33 #299079
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
I see the latest 290 comes with a "overload clutch to feed shaft" anyone know if this is at the head end or in the apron?

Could be the clutch is not engaged, could be the lever got a bump as it went down the basement stairs.
21 May 2017 at 19:56 #299082
John Rudd
Participant
@johnrudd16576
My SPG equiv of the 290 has the clutch on the feed shaft….It is fitted after the gearbox, axially with the feed shaft, a bit like the clutch on a battery drill….works well, not that I've needed it…

The apron assembly comes off relatively easy….4 cap heads secure it to the saddle, you need to free the feed shaft from the clutch( watch out for the springs/balls), release the support bracket from the right hand end, the apron should just move along to the right for removal…

The leadscrew cover shouldnt present too much of an issue….

The grease in mine was apalling….I warmed it up, cleaned out the box and added new before replacing it on the lathe…

Hope you get to the bottom of your problem…

Edited By John Rudd on 21/05/2017 19:58:03
21 May 2017 at 21:21 #299088
KEITH BEAUMONT
Participant
@keithbeaumont45476
Hi Nik ,

When I bought my Mill from Warco 2 years ago, I understood they gave a 3 year warrantee with the first 6 months being on site service, for their machines. . As advised by George, above, get on the phone to Warco.with the problem.

Keith,
21 May 2017 at 21:22 #299089
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
John, looked getting the apron off but could not separate because of what I presume are 2 taper pins which locate the saddle onto the apron as well as the 4 bolts. Did not want to try levering them out.

I took the exterior selector unit off this evening and with that out you can see the shaft is turning correctly but it will not push in or out to select direction/engage feed. So something not right in the apron.

The prospect of getting back up the cellar steps is not really a palatable option at this time.

JasonB clutch unit as John say is on the feed shaft where it exits the gearbox at headstock

Edited By Nik G on 21/05/2017 21:23:46
21 May 2017 at 21:30 #299091
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Posted by KEITH BEAUMONT on 21/05/2017 21:21:44:

Hi Nik ,

When I bought my Mill from Warco 2 years ago, I understood they gave a 3 year warrantee with the first 6 months being on site service, for their machines. . As advised by George, above, get on the phone to Warco.with the problem.

Keith,

Looks to of changed to one year, but as you say a home visit is a possibility in first six months
1. A 12 months warranty is supplied from delivery date. For UK mainland customers, first six months of warranty to include parts and our labour costs. For customers outside UK mainland, first six months warranty to include parts only. At our discretion warranty work during the first six months will be carried out on the customer's premises or the goods will be returned to our works at our cost and re-delivered at our cost. Second six months warranty is parts only, delivered at our cost.
22 May 2017 at 07:32 #299102
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Nick, if you join this yahoo group and then look at the photos you will see some of the insides of the apron gearbox which will give you a better idea of what should be going on inside. These are basically the same machines with PM's blue paint job and in the 280/290 size range.

My earler 280 just has a shear pin on teh output sid eof teh head gearbox to protect the feed shaft.
22 May 2017 at 11:12 #299135
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
Spoken to Warco and it has been suggested that I drop the apron and see what I can see
22 May 2017 at 19:11 #299200
Nik G
Participant
@nikg
After a bit of a tussle the apron is off and from what I can tell the gear box is now free and working correctly. So a little confused. Something must of been misaligned or out of position. I cannot see anything obvious.

Edited By Nik G on 22/05/2017 19:16:26

Edited By JasonB on 22/05/2017 19:20:34

Edited By Nik G on 22/05/2017 19:22:32
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