How on earth do they calculate electricity and gas bills…

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Sam that is just one of the downsides of Smart metering, it isn't universal as you say where there is no mobile coverage it won't work. I won't be having a Smart meter until forced by legislation, the only advantage that gives the consumer is to be able to monitor consumption, what use is that I only use energy that I need to and monitoring isn't going to change what I use. There appear to be a number of advantages that suppliers potentially can benefit from and I don't feel that benevolent towards them.

Dave W

[Nathan SharpeParticipant @nathansharpe19746]

According to OFGEN, Scottish Power are the worst of all of the domestic electricity suppliers in the UK.

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by Samsaranda on 21/12/2017 22:21:41:

Sam that is just one of the downsides of Smart metering, it isn't universal as you say where there is no mobile coverage it won't work. I won't be having a Smart meter until forced by legislation, the only advantage that gives the consumer is to be able to monitor consumption, what use is that I only use energy that I need to and monitoring isn't going to change what I use. There appear to be a number of advantages that suppliers potentially can benefit from and I don't feel that benevolent towards them.

Dave W

I agree completely Dave. The other point is that the expected £12 billion cost of installing meters countrywide will of course be passed on to customers.

I did read the Germans were not going down the smart meter route as it was too expensive and of no benefit to customers.

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

Well Neil, if some smart alec at one of these companies decides to clean out your account, you might find yourself cooking over that open fire anyway. It could happen by accident or deliberately. If enough people refuse the direct deduction thing they will have to find other ways to allow people to pay them money. We did have one once, but had the payment come out of a separate account, but that was a fixed amount. Long term we changed company and now pay everything via Internet banking. They will put pressure on you to do the DD thing, after all, the financial whizz kids must just love the idea of a regular cash flow that they can jack up at will to cover any shortfalls from their stock market gambling.

The cost of those smart meters should be covered by the saving on people driving around reading meters. When I was in the cell phone/mobile data business, that was the main selling point. Of course we were trying to sell the idea to the power providers.

John

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Nathan Sharpe on 21/12/2017 22:17:42:

Neil, you miss the point. DD is for a FIXED amount. Electricity and gas companies use VARIABLE DD's and then make it very difficult for you to reduce the amount. Nathan.

You can't vary a DD without notifying someone – that's how I picked up what they were planning!

I have a multitude of DDs many of which change at an annual renewal.

Can't say I stress about it, the DD guarantee works.

[jimmy bParticipant @jimmyb]

I've stopped worrying about the cost of electricity now.

Mrs B got me a 2500W oil filled radiator for the shed, uses about a fivers worth a week keeping the shed warm all the time.

I would rather have a warm shed than a couple of pints….

Also Mrs B takes care of the bills…………..

Jim

[Danny M2ZParticipant @dannym2z]

The so called 'Smart Meter' is not so smart after all. Once it's computerised it is a prime candidate for a bit of fun **LINK**

My own meter (here in Oz) is not even encrypted and there are many threads on the net about how they work

* Danny M *

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Posted by Danny M2Z on 22/12/2017 08:24:01:

The so called 'Smart Meter' is not so smart after all. Once it's computerised it is a prime candidate for a bit of fun **LINK**

My own meter (here in Oz) is not even encrypted and there are many threads on the net about how they work

* Danny M *

That item concerned the system in Spain. This article **LINK** describes the security approach in the U.K. System. **LINK** is a possibly slightly out of date discussion of security vulnerability.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by John Haine on 22/12/2017 09:01:30:

This article **LINK** describes the security approach in the U.K. System.

.

Thanks for that, John

The author has a chatty style, and yet inspires confidence that we are 'in good hands'.

That's very good writing !

MichaelG.

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

If they decide that we have to be fitted with a smart meter does that mean we will get a decent mobile connection ?

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

I have also been plagued by EON to have a smart meter. They do not seem to understand my concern of an outdated smart meter. As for DD I stopped mine several years ago because when I asked why they were going to increase my payments as the account was in credit the answer was " because we can". You can imagine what a grumpy old goat like me replied. I now pay online when I am ready every quarter. I usually wait for notification and pay 2 weeks later.

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

Smart meters what a load of crap, I don't need one of those to keep my electric in check, i've been careful with electric all my married life never ever leaving lights telly etc on(ask the kids & grandkids) same with the water as well. I just can't stand unnecessary waste.

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Tis just another product they can sell, and it shouldn't necessarily supersede the current metering practices.

[Brian GParticipant @briang]

Posted by the artfull-codger on 22/12/2017 11:46:53:

Smart meters what a load of crap, …

I beg to differ.

Without one I would either have to submit readings every month (not easy when you are in a wheelchair and the meters are in a 2' high cupboard under the stairs) or be willing to pay on the basis of wildly inaccurate estimated readings for up to two years between meter readings.

Brian

[Colin HeseltineParticipant @colinheseltine48622]

Do they have smart meters for three phase supplies

Colin

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Gordon W on 22/12/2017 11:24:15:

If they decide that we have to be fitted with a smart meter does that mean we will get a decent mobile connection ?

.

Not necessarily …

**LINK**

https://www.smartdcc.co.uk/media/341298/15595_dcc_fact_sheet-coverage_v7.pdf

MichaelG.

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

John, There is no crock of gold at the end of the rainbow, we are already paying for those Smart Meters AND I do not want nor need one.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Denmark went through the Smart metering exercise and a study when it was completed proved no benefit to consumers so conclusion was an expensive exercise paid for by consumers. The sinister element not explained is that the communication with the Smart meter is two way, this means that the energy supplier gets up to date information on usage but also the facility to change tariffs and charging rates without notification and they can selectively disconnect consumers when they want to balance demand, you the consumer get no say, definitely smacks of Big Brother and I am not paranoid but realistic.

Dave W

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

Michael G- That article on the coms' methods is very interesting, and a bit disturbing. I would have thought it would be easier and cheaper to improve the existing mobile network. Instead we will be paying for a " new" system used only by a few. Actually two new systems.

[MK_ChrisParticipant @mk_chris]

Neil.

Referring to your opening observation re. Direct Debits. Have a look at Bristol Energy. They have reviewed my DD's more than once a year : reducing or increasing as appropriate.

They also offer the option to pay in full each month. Providing a monthly reading gave me a zero balance each month. I reverted to DD because the pay in full system is only manual at present. The option to pay in full by variable DD is described as "we do hope to be able to offer variable DD ".

All the options are down to Customer choice and I intend to revert to full pay by variable DD when the option is made available. This will put my energy bills in line with my credit card as a "full payer".

Usual caveat: I post this only as a satisfied customer.

MK_Chris.

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

Posted by Brian G on 22/12/2017 12:05:08:

Posted by the artfull-codger on 22/12/2017 11:46:53:

Smart meters what a load of crap, …

I beg to differ.

Without one I would either have to submit readings every month (not easy when you are in a wheelchair and the meters are in a 2' high cupboard under the stairs) or be willing to pay on the basis of wildly inaccurate estimated readings for up to two years between meter readings.

Brian

Hi Brian, sorry about your situation, in your case they're ok , don't know where you live but in North Yorkshire we get the meter man each 1/4 he leaves a card If wer'e not in & I phone the reading in, they like to take a reading once a year themselves so in my situation I don't need/want one

Graham.

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

Posted by Brian G on 22/12/2017 12:05:08:

Posted by the artfull-codger on 22/12/2017 11:46:53:

Smart meters what a load of crap, …

I beg to differ.

Without one I would either have to submit readings every month (not easy when you are in a wheelchair and the meters are in a 2' high cupboard under the stairs) or be willing to pay on the basis of wildly inaccurate estimated readings for up to two years between meter readings.

Brian

Hi Brian, sorry about your situation, in your case they're ok , don't know where you live but in North Yorkshire we get the meter man each 1/4 he leaves a card If wer'e not in & I phone the reading in, they like to take a reading once a year themselves so in my situation I don't need/want one

Graham.

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

Oops came out in stereo !! Apologies

Graham

[HowiParticipant @howi]

Posted by Samsaranda on 22/12/2017 14:44:36:

Denmark went through the Smart metering exercise and a study when it was completed proved no benefit to consumers so conclusion was an expensive exercise paid for by consumers. The sinister element not explained is that the communication with the Smart meter is two way, this means that the energy supplier gets up to date information on usage but also the facility to change tariffs and charging rates without notification and they can selectively disconnect consumers when they want to balance demand, you the consumer get no say, definitely smacks of Big Brother and I am not paranoid but realistic.

Dave W

What utter garbage! They cannot change your tariff without notification as most are on term contracts, neither can they selectively disconnect consumers to balance demand as that would be highly dangerous and would most certainly lead to litigation.

No! You are not realistic but paranoid. Stop being so negative, if you don't want one don't have one.

[Maurice TaylorParticipant @mauricetaylor82093]

I've always sent meter readings and then paid the quarterly bill.Far easier than direct debit in my opinion.

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