Abbreviations

[JAParticipant @ja]

In English shall and will have different meanings. Many contracts define these because of the lack of knowledge of the language among its first language users (including me).

JA

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

It’s easy to remember the distinction, JA, if you think of the biblical

“Thou Shalt … “

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

For a glimpse of the horrific scale of abbreviations, etc. try the NHS

https://www.abpi.org.uk/media/xnjbwwlb/abpi-cymru-wales-jargon-buster-july-2023.pdf

MichaelG.

.

Edit: — That’s only the tip of the iceberg

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

What no X or Z Michael how disappointing!

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Government organisations seem to like them. European Union Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) (Yes I know it should be EUASA but that’s wht they say see top of https://www.easa.europa.eu/en)  and MOD are bad. Service enquires are full of TLAs and FLAs

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/service-inquiry-si

Some are interesting from an engineering view remembering of course that they resulted from a fatal incident.
This one https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/service-inquiry-report-into-the-challenger-2-incident-at-castlemartin-ranges-pembrokeshire-on-14-june-2017
does make you think how it could happen (80 acronyms in the glossary).

Robert.

[Richard Simpson]

On Richard Simpson Said:

On Tony Pratt 1 Said:

I can use abbreviations with the best of them but tend to use the full spelling as I am aware there are a lot of people on here who aren’t so familiar with certain terms.

My personal opinion is that certain people use abbreviations to make themselves feel important, I have Googled abbreviations in the past but it’s certainly an annoyance.

Tony

That can also be an aspect of it and there is no doubt that it does happen whereby some prefer to use abbreviations and technical terminology either as a means of bolstering their own levels of self importance or because they simply do not understand how they are coming across. I hasten to add I am not referring to this forum with that comment.  I have sailed with many engineers in the past who have been extremely knowledgeable in their own fields but totally incapable of communicating with anyone not at the same level as them.  They would frequently get offended if I criticised their communication skills as they had fallen into the trap of considering themselves beyond criticism.  …

Mmmm, the counter argument is that juniors have to learn the ropes before expecting to join the grown-ups.  Jargon is the most efficient form of communication.

My experience is that engineers rarely use abbreviations and technical terminology to bolster their own levels of self importance!  I have seen folk, including myself, react badly to the realisation that they are out of their depth.  But there’s no escaping it – above a certain level common sense, grey hair, and irrelevant experience are no help at all.   You have to make the grade.

On a computer course with a Norwegian (who spoke better English than me), he asked about British square 3-pin plugs.  I launched into a basic description of safety earthing only to find him smiling at me!    Emergency stop!  He was a professional Electrical Engineer with PhD who was learning to program in C to help his job, whilst my Software Engineering job required me to learn a new language for a security application.  I knew about earths in a basic way because dad was an electrical engineer and I’m a keen radio ham.

Spot the problem?  Non-British members may not know about BS plugs and sockets.  What “British” means is blurred.  Earthing is a complex subject, and called Ground in the US.  PhD is the Latin abbreviation ‘Philosophiae Doctor‘ or “Doctor of Philosophy”, but not literally so – it’s the highest level of academic distinction, not just in philosophy.  Wikipedia’s explanation of PhD runs to over 16,000 words.  Latin is a classical language, once essential in science; Newton wrote to Leibniz in it.  C is a programming language, outlined by Wikipedia in 11000 words, but that’s only the tip of the iceberg.   Another large technical field is covered by the term “security application”.   Ham is colloquially short for “Radio Amateur”,  and be aware some find it offensive.

My take on Model Engineering is experimental, rarely working to other people’s plans or relying on experience.  I’m frequently baffled by technical documentation because it’s written for experts by experts, often tersely.   The reader is expected to have a fair bit of technical background because otherwise it would take a very long time to explain…

Maths I think is the most difficult form of abbreviation.  Concepts and behaviours captured formally, to strict logical rules, using arcane symbols.  But maths isn’t simply an abbreviation:  new information can be deduced and inferred from it, and falsehoods detected.  My career in engineering / science ended at school when I decided higher mathematics was too difficult for me.   Possibly a mistake, but I didn’t have the grit necessary to tackle a subject I didn’t take to quickly.   My fault.

On the forum I often assume that the audience are up for a challenge.  Pushing the envelope is for fun and interest;  I’m not trying to prove I’m right!  Different approach to questions: I try to pitch answers to suit the questioner, sometimes causing getting it wrong as in my Norwegian example above!

Leibniz is said to be the last man who understood everything there was to know.  He lived in a much simpler world than us.  Since he died in 1716 we have all become specialists, and there’s no shame in not understanding another specialists jargon.   There is shame in expecting that everything is “simples”, and that writers are our servants.   When we prove ignorant, only we can fix it.

🙂

Dave

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

As a slight digression … Have a look at this amazing piece of work:

https://thinklocalactpersonal.org.uk/jargon-buster/

MichaelG.

[PeteParticipant @pete41194]

No doubt a lot of the common abbreviations used here would be unfamiliar and sometimes confusing to anyone first starting out. I can still remember they were for myself. Mostly I think there just a short form of typing it out, [H.S.S.] or High Speed Steel would be a common one. If I were talking with someone, I’d more likely just say High Speed Steel instead of using it’s common abbreviation.

Books related to machining do much the same. George Thomas for example used them often, but did include a glossary of the terms in the back of his books. A bit of a pita☺ and some abbreviations in the UK aren’t common in North America. [SS] [GM] for Silver Steel and Gunmetal as examples. I don’t think that [S.S.] or [G.M.] is ever used here. His use of [L.A.] for Aluminum Alloy was one I definitely had to check his glossary for. So having a glossary of terms for the UK forum members here might also require what they mean elsewhere? Every industry, craft or hobby has the same I suppose. It’s just learning and then remembering what those abbreviations mean. Even using the same basic English between the UK and say North America, there’s non abbreviated terms in use that aren’t used elsewhere. Spanner for you / wrench for us, exact same thing but different word.

Now terms like using digi-verns by some while meaning digital calipers might be a bit over the top since vernier calipers are quite different than the digital models. Their both calipers and make the same type of measurements, but quite obviously different in how it’s accomplished. And while technically correct over 100 years ago, using the word Jib today that some seem to still do instead of Gib, might definitely be confusing to those just starting out. Possibly I’m being pedantic to some, or maybe to others I’m not?

[Speedy Builder5Participant @speedybuilder5]

Doesn’t explain who or what the UK is !

[PeteParticipant @pete41194]

🙂 A valid point.

[Speedy Builder5]

On Speedy Builder5 Said:

Doesn’t explain who or what the UK is !

IF you really don’t know I would suggest a Google search!

Tony

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, well I’ve never understood why the BS1363 is often referred to being a square pin plug, as all the pins are rectangular in shape, and are set out in a triangular formation. You wouldn’t expect to get a piece of square bar if you ordered a piece of rectangular bar, or get a piece of rectangular bar if you ordered a square bar.

Regards Nick.

[Charles LamontParticipant @charleslamont71117]

It is easier to say ‘square’, one syllable,  than ‘rectangular’, four.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Depends on how you are using the word “square” We often use a tri-square to check if a corner or two parts are “square” yet we are really only checking that they are at 90deg. So you could say that a square pin plug has right angled corners to all the pins “square” to each other..

Or just call it a 3-Pin Plug😀

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi JasonB, both square and rectangle sections have four square angles, but the angles don’t define their shape, and although a tri-square has two rectangular sections, the overall shape is an L, and have at least 18 right angles within it.

Regards Nick.

[GeorgineerParticipant @georgineer]

Then there’s the three-square file…

George

[JasonB]

On JasonB Said:

……

Or just call it a 3-Pin Plug😀

That could be mixed up with round pin plugs which are still legal in UK

https://www.beaconelectrical.co.uk/electrical-accessories/plug-top-5a-3pin-round/

[Dave HalfordParticipant @davehalford22513]

On a computer course with a Norwegian (who spoke better English than me), he asked about British square 3-pin plugs.  I launched into a basic description of safety earthing only to find him smiling at me!    Emergency stop!  He was a professional Electrical Engineer with PhD who was learning to program in C to help his job, whilst my Software Engineering job required me to learn a new language for a security application.  I knew about earths in a basic way because dad was an electrical engineer and I’m a keen radio ham.

He was probably hoping to have the idea of a plug mounted fuse explained.

[vintagengineerParticipant @vintagengineer]

We always used to write MT on empty gas bottles.

[vintagengineer]

On vintagengineer Said:

We always used to write MT on empty gas bottles.

Hi, Yep, been there and done that,

Regards Nick.

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