Connecting 3 or motors to a switching PSU?

Connecting 3 or motors to a switching PSU?

Viewing 9 posts - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
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  • #241740
    Ed Duffner
    Participant
      @edduffner79357

      Morning everyone.

      I'm steadily building up a collection of CNC bits to build a small 3 axis machine and have been looking at how to connect 3 or more motors to one PSU and how to determine the required power rating.

      The PSU's offered on Ebay mostly have two pairs of output terminals but I will have three main motors, plus maybe a rotary table as a fourth A or B axis occasionally.

      Does anyone know if the two sets of output terminals are just for convenience and are connected to a common output or bus internally?

      The motors I have ordered are these with a rated current of 2A per phase, so if I have 3 motors, will this require at least a 12amp supply? i.e. Would I need to add up the current per phase to arrive at the total required current rating of the PSU? , (plus whatever the motor current is for a 4th axis).

      Also, Is there any momentary inrush or starting current to worry about and include when rating a PSU for stepper motors?

      Sorry for all these questions so early in the day

      Many thanks.

      Ed.

      #15102
      Ed Duffner
      Participant
        @edduffner79357
        #241743
        John Haine
        Participant
          @johnhaine32865

          Hi Ed, first, the two phases will not be drawing 2 amps simultaneously as the phase currents are in quadrature phase. So probably the peak current to a single motor would be 2.8 amps. Second, I believe that if you are using modern chopper drives, though the motor current may be 2amps, the supply current, from a higher voltage, will be significantly less as in effect they give a transformer action. (They act as switch mode power supplies in a buck converter mode.) IIRC the eBay PSU I bought for my little mill is rated at 6 amps, as you say has 2 sets of output terminals but they are paralleled up inside, so just giving more contact are for the current. I certainly have no issues running 3 motors, one of which is a size 34, off this supply. I've never measured the total current, it will be a week or so before I can but happy to do so if you can wait?

          John.

          #241750
          Ed Duffner
          Participant
            @edduffner79357

            Hi John,

            Thank you for your expertise. Some of the info is miles above my understanding, sorry but I get most of what you said and I think can work with it and move forward. yes

            Please don't make a special task of measuring the current for my little project , but thank you for offering.

            Kind Regards,
            Ed.

            #241766
            frank brown
            Participant
              @frankbrown22225

              FWIW Some "posh" power supplies have a pair of tags for the actual current output with adjacent tags for voltage sensing. These should be connected at the load end of the wiring to the two "power" leads. The idea is that the power supply winds the voltage up to make sure that the voltage at the load end of the wiring is correct. The voltage sensing wires can be as thin as you like, the power wiring must be adequate for the current being drawn.

              Example a 5V PSU delivering 10A over a pair of 1.5mm cables. The actual voltage at the PSU terminals might be 5.4V, giving 5V at the far end of the cables.

              Without the remote sensing, setting the PSU voltage to 5.4V on a 10A load would give you your 5V, but if the load current reduced, the voltage would rise up to the maximum of 5.4 V which could upset the circuit.

              Frank

              #241767
              Muzzer
              Participant
                @muzzer

                These suppliers rarely provide anything that you could usefully call "design data", which is why so many constructors simply go on what is "known good". As John says, the stepper drivers that actually drive the motors convert the high current (2A) at low voltage down from the 24V(?) supply, resulting in a lower current, so the total current requirement is going to be a fair bit less than 2A.

                Most steppers have a torque curve that falls off very rapidly as the motor speed increases. If you are able to get this characteristic (and believe the numbers), you can plot the torque against speed and estimate the shaft power at different speeds. Typically this shows a fairly constant power characteristic over most of the speed. Interestingly, this tells you that the pulley ratio doesn't actually change the maximum speed you can move the table under load. It also means the maximum current draw from the PSU is fairly easy to estimate – it's reasonably constant across the speed range too.

                From what minimal data the website gives you, I'd doubt if you could draw more than 30W per motor on a good day, so a total of 3 wouldn't require much more than the 5-6A John uses.

                The terminal blocks are simply paralleled for ease of connection. Each connection will be more than capable of supplying all the current.

                These are pretty small motors. They are more suited to 3D printers than a CNC machine as such. The best way to be reasonably certain that you have sized the motors correctly is to rely on previous examples of the type of machine you want.

                Murray

                #241768
                Neil Wyatt
                Moderator
                  @neilwyatt

                  Steppers driven using multi-stepping use a maximum of 1.4 times the rated current per phase, if set up properly.

                  Steppers driven in normal modes use twice the rated current per phase.

                  Whatever you choose, get something that has some headroom (1.5 to 2 times your expected current) to allow for transient high currents, plus an over-rated supply will run cooler and last longer.

                  Neil

                  #257837
                  Nick Hulme
                  Participant
                    @nickhulme30114
                    Posted by Ed Duffner on 07/06/2016 08:13:06:

                    have been looking at how to connect 3 or more motors to one PSU and how to determine the required power rating.

                    ED,

                    Your motors will be run by drivers, the drivers connect to the PSU, you can arrange your own common bus for + & – but multiple connections on the PSU can make this easier and neater for small installations,

                    – Nick

                    #257841
                    Iain Downs
                    Participant
                      @iaindowns78295

                      I am far from an expert in this, but I wonder if the NEMA 17 motors are strong enough. My first attempt was with NEMA 17 and found they didn't have the grunt.

                      I'm now on NEMA 23 motors (6Nm) and I'm still not happy that they're powerful enough.

                      The CNC conversions sets offered by the site you're buying from start from 3Nm NEMA 23 with I think end up as 0.59 Nm.

                      I expect this is fine for a 3D printer which has light moving parts, but If you are milling then you are moving a lot of mass against resistance and pushing the material onto the cutter as well.

                      I tried a single motor on one axis fist and then reviewed.

                      I echo the comments earlier that it would be marvelous if the low cost stepper motor people published a torque curve so that it was more than trial and error.

                      Iain

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