WM18 Broken :(

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

My fault, the tool I was using snagged on the work stalling the machine braking the nylon gear.

I assume its nylon for a reason, sacraficial part and seem to remember reading about it a while ago.

Before you say I have just emailed Warco re a replacement but I will not know unitl tomorrow.

So, just wondering I you can get a replacement?

Edited By petro1head on 08/07/2019 18:42:29

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by petro1head on 08/07/2019 18:41:50:

… So, just wondering I you can get…

If I can get then you can get, I suppose.

Cheaper to make one, I suppose? Make two and you would have a spare for the next time…

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Posted by not done it yet on 08/07/2019 19:04:23:

Posted by petro1head on 08/07/2019 18:41:50:

… So, just wondering I you can get…

If I can get then you can get, I suppose.

Cheaper to make one, I suppose? Make two and you would have a spare for the next time…

Would not know where to start re making one, glad you can get them, thanks

[FatWelshBoyParticipant @fatwelshboy]

If you can measure up what's left there may be a file on Thingiverse.com or other such sites. If you post up the dimensions/specs I'll have a look and can 3d print one if you're stuck for a replacement from Warco.

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Posted by FatWelshBoy on 08/07/2019 20:20:07:

If you can measure up what's left there may be a file on Thingiverse.com or other such sites. If you post up the dimensions/specs I'll have a look and can 3d print one if you're stuck for a replacement from Warco.

Very kind of you. Will the 3D printed one be strong enough?

[FatWelshBoyParticipant @fatwelshboy]

Is it the part below? It's for the WM 16 but could possibly be the same in both machines?

**LINK**

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by petro1head on 08/07/2019 20:25:20

Will the 3D printed one be strong enough?

Many lathes and mills have plastic drive gears (a lathe only needs to drive the feed screw/shaft, mind). Most(?) small gear driven mini-mills use low cost acetal gears (which only fail once, but often need replacement – many fit the noisier metal gears for better longevity, but there may be lubrication issues).

My Raglan (lathe) has tufnol tumblers and they were never a problem… If they wore out or got broken, I would likely replace with aluminium ones.

I expect Warco will have a good stash of spares – they are a real money spinner on the ‘after sales’’ spares market!

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Only related in so far as it is gears. The cricket club mower mashed its plastic drive gear last week and I ordered another today. Prices on ebay for the 20 tooth 10DP gear ranged from £4.65 to over £18 from at least a dozen suppliers. Be interesting to see what your replacement costs but I suggest anyone thinking of a radical redesign of their mill drive should consider using gears for a high volume mower to ensure a good supply of spares.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Plastic gears good enough for Denford…

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Had Warco on the phone this morning

Just in case anyone is interested they cost £29.04 + £4.00 carriage + VAT and a stock item

Edited By petro1head on 09/07/2019 09:40:14

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Posted by petro1head on 09/07/2019 09:39:42:

Had Warco on the phone this morning

Just in case anyone is interested they cost £29.04 + £4.00 carriage + VAT and a stock item

Edited By petro1head on 09/07/2019 09:40:14

… but they have to make a profit & cover overheads; I have a spare belt for my WM250V-F that I bought as soon as I received it; IIRC it was in the region of £18 + vat & that would be about 6 year ago, plus I have a spare half nut on hand, bought 2 yr. ago & that was in the same price range so…

George.

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Posted by mechman48 on 09/07/2019 09:59:14:

Posted by petro1head on 09/07/2019 09:39:42:

Had Warco on the phone this morning

Just in case anyone is interested they cost £29.04 + £4.00 carriage + VAT and a stock item

Edited By petro1head on 09/07/2019 09:40:14

… but they have to make a profit & cover overheads

George.

I was not complaining, thing it quite reasonable actually

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Nearly forty quid for a plastic gear? I did say it was a money spinner for them!

You are prolly in the unfortunate position of not having an operational mill to make one (or more) so very easily.

With a mill and rotary table (preferably with dividing plates) – a simple task of cutting the teeth, onto a blank, using an approx £20 cutter (or even a home ground flycutter?). Keyway could be broached, cut on a mill or lathe or drilled and filed to shape manually.

Can be done on a lathe quite effectively with a milling slide.

Loads of u-toob vids on the subject. Xynudu is one of many practical u-toobers with examples on-line.

If you have a comprehensive dro, one can easily make an indexing plate on a mill. A spin indexer may suffice, as an alternative to a rotary table, dependent on the number of teeth to be cut.

If you know the dimensions and mod number etc, HPC gears (or others) could probably supply.

I quite like gear cutting, although infuriating if something goes wrong near the end. BTDT!

Like most things, once you have done one, it is easy to knock out new gears.

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

To be honest I would rather keep the plasic gear. That way other more expensive parts are protected

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

re Posted by petro1head on 09/07/2019 10:53:34:

To be honest I would rather keep the plasic gear….

HPC supply gears in both plasic and steel as standard. Their plastic is usually delrin. I buy in acetal I need (in sheet or disc form) or cut it off bar stock.

Are you certain your gear is nylon? Delrin is a much stronger plastic than nylon, but most mishaps reported seem to break acetal gears rather than the machine. I thought it looked a bit like tufnol.

Further,Warco state:

• As with all Warco milling machines, this machine has metal gears.

Perhaps only the later machines have all metal gears? Or maybe they actually mean that there are some metal gears involved. Curious, nevertheless.

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Posted by not done it yet on 09/07/2019 13:04:34:

re Posted by petro1head on 09/07/2019 10:53:34:

To be honest I would rather keep the plasic gear….

Are you certain your gear is nylon? Delrin is a much stronger plastic than nylon, but most mishaps reported seem to break acetal gears rather than the machine. I thought it looked a bit like tufnol.

To be honest, dont know, but your probably right as Delrin is much stronger

[Boiler BriParticipant @boilerbri]

I had a fault a few weeks ago with mine and i have to say Warco was very responsive and helpful.

Just buy the part and fit it, never mind making one.

Brian

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by not done it yet on 09/07/2019 13:04:34:

re Posted by petro1head on 09/07/2019 10:53:34:

…

Further,Warco state:

• As with all Warco milling machines, this machine has metal gears.

Perhaps only the later machines have all metal gears? Or maybe they actually mean that there are some metal gears involved. Curious, nevertheless.

May be a model / age thing. My WM18 is about 6 years old and all the gears are metal.

When I crashed my mini-lathe, I was pleased to find a plastic gear soaked up most of the damage. I've had 3 or 4 crashes and this one was by far the most violent. Due to operator error a thick rod cammed out of the chuck and jammed between jaw and bed. The lathe came to a dead stop with a loud bang but apart from a sizeable ding in an unused part of the bed and most of the HI/LO teeth stripped in the headstock, there was no other damage. I think a steel gear would have given the lathe a much more powerful wrench.

A heavy chuck spun fast by a half-horse motor stores a lot of energy that has to go somewhere in an emergency. I see now how a bigger lathe might easily rip an arm off if it got you just right!

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

If you have, a suitable Dividing Head or Rotary table, or have access to one..

At almost £40, I would inclined to buy Warco's replacement, to get me going and then to invest in a gear cutter from someone like RDG (probably about £22 ) and then make a spare "plastic" gear, in case of any any repeats.

If you measure the new gear and count the teeth, you will able to calculate the Module, (probably 1.25? ) to determine which cutter you need.

There may enough of the original left to count the teeth, and a little measurement (centre distance ? ) should allow you to work out the module, and the diameter of the blank.

If have the misfortune to repeat the calamity, as soon as you are up and running again, cut another spare, but don't forget where you have put it!

Howard

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

The teeth are not straight cut more like a helical cut

Edited By petro1head on 09/07/2019 17:17:49

[jimmy bParticipant @jimmyb]

I had a similar thing happen to my Weiss mill. I bought 2 replacement gears, never had a problem since.

Take the hit in the pocket and know its the right item.

Jim

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

Hopefully it will arrive in a couple of days

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Here's the mower gears, old and new, ordered Monday evening, fitted Friday. £4.65 including postage and bronze bush.

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