Chuck a mile out

Chuck a mile out

Home Forums General Questions Chuck a mile out

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #318336
    nigel jones 5
    Participant
      @nigeljones5

      I fitted one of my spare 3 jaw scroll chucks to the L5 and noted that a bar put in it was 10 thou out when rotated. One can only assume that it ran concentric when new so how did it get into this state, and is there any way of fixing it?

      #25517
      nigel jones 5
      Participant
        @nigeljones5
        #318339
        JohnF
        Participant
          @johnf59703

          Hi Fizzy, presume its a Harrison L5? however which spindle nose does it have? Do you perchance have a similar chuck and have mixed up the jaws, they are usually serial numbered as well as 1.2.3.

          For any fix you need to work through any elements where an error could be from the spindle nose to the backplate register and so forth to the chuck body etc

          Hope this helps a little John

          #318345
          Robin
          Participant
            @robin

            You have to fish for clues… Is the chuck body out by the same? Is the error still .01" and inch further out? Do different size bars have the same error?

            #318349
            Mick B1
            Participant
              @mickb1

              When you take out the chuck jaws to check the sequencing, look at the scroll and the jaw scroll segments to check there ain't a piece of swarf wedged in there.

              Look at the front face of the chuck whilst running and see if there's any wobble.

              Edited By Mick B1 on 24/09/2017 11:10:16

              #318354
              nigel jones 5
              Participant
                @nigeljones5

                chuck body runs true, jaws apear to be matched set, no swarf – had it apart and cleaned it, other chuck runs true. Just seems a shame to bin it. Dont know what different spindle noses there are but the hole down the middle is rather small – I know there are variants with bigger spindle holes.

                #318356
                Hopper
                Participant
                  @hopper

                  Don't bin it. The jaws can be trued up with a Dremel type tool held in the toolpost if a suitable "clover leaf" or packing pieces are used to spread the outer ends of the jaws while grinding is done.

                  #318357
                  Neil Wyatt
                  Moderator
                    @neilwyatt

                    Have you tried it with different diameters of bar?

                    #318369
                    nigel jones 5
                    Participant
                      @nigeljones5

                      Yes Neil – problem is less apparent

                      #318372
                      Martin Connelly
                      Participant
                        @martinconnelly55370

                        If you want accuracy then don't use a self centering chuck, use a chuck with independent jaws that allow you to set up work accurately. You can use the scroll chuck to turn all the features that can be done in one setup and they will all be concentric. Once the workpiece has been removed from the chuck it needs to be set up in an independent chuck or accurate collets to continue This topic comes up regularly.

                        Martin C

                        #318389
                        Mick B1
                        Participant
                          @mickb1
                          Posted by Martin Connelly on 24/09/2017 13:44:48:

                          If you want accuracy then don't use a self centering chuck….

                          Depends how accurate you need it to be. It's quite reasonable to expect a new 3-jaw to be concentric to a thou or two and some – even budget ones – can be better than that. Plus there's always the option to machine a set of soft jaws to achieve the same or better.

                          I think the OP's quite right to think something's more than usually out of line when a chuck that appears to be correctly fitted shows 10 thou eccentricity.

                          #318401
                          Tim Stevens
                          Participant
                            @timstevens64731

                            I wonder if the 'bar' used was not accurately round, or perhaps hexagonal? I have found examples of hex bar in which the AF dimensions were out. (AF = across flats)

                            I agree with the 'don't bin it' advice. There are many jobs where the concentricity of the chuck is not critical, and many off-the-shelf components where the parts are not concentric from new. Things like hydraulic pipe fittings, where the flats are not always in line with the threads or the bore.

                            But before you consider your next move, it would be useful to do a series of checks using (eg) silver steel bars of different sizes, noting the run-out of each. This would give you info to work out whether the scroll was bad in parts, or a jaw was distorted. It would be no use grinding the jaws to get it back on form, if the scroll was bruised on one (or more) places. The next time you used it with a different size, it would show a new eccentricity.

                            Regards, Tim

                            #318623
                            Phil Whitley
                            Participant
                              @philwhitley94135

                              Tim Stevens has said it all really, but I will just add that the best concentricity on a 3 jaw when new will be within 2 to 3 thou, if you get one that is spot on, it will be by good luck alone. If you turn all the faces of the component you are making, it will be concentric with the bed of the lathe, but not concentric with the bar left in the chuck, so your finished component will be unaffected by the inaccuracy of the chuck. This is why you should always use stock which is oversize in all dimensions. If you consider the way a scroll chuck works, any slight movement in the pivot of the scroll, or the recess it seats in will result in unequal torque on the jaws, and give rise to run out. As Tim says above, if the chuck has been over tightened, the scroll itself can be bruised and that will bring inaccuracy at certain diameters.. Grinding the jaws is not an answer, one of our biggest chuck makers (can't remember which, but someone will) used to offer a recon service, and gave it up! The most accurate chuck you have is a 4 jaw independent.

                              #318626
                              Neil Wyatt
                              Moderator
                                @neilwyatt
                                Posted by Phil Whitley on 25/09/2017 18:09:02:

                                Tim Stevens has said it all really, but I will just add that the best concentricity on a 3 jaw when new will be within 2 to 3 thou, if you get one that is spot on, it will be by good luck alone.

                                Well I've struck lucky with my last two 3-Jaws then, both inside a thou

                                Far more accurate than I had any right to expect, but SCRUPULOUS cleaning of the jaws is required.

                                Neil

                                #318643
                                Mick B1
                                Participant
                                  @mickb1
                                  Posted by Neil Wyatt on 25/09/2017 18:18:26:

                                  Posted by Phil Whitley on 25/09/2017 18:09:02:

                                  Tim Stevens has said it all really, but I will just add that the best concentricity on a 3 jaw when new will be within 2 to 3 thou, if you get one that is spot on, it will be by good luck alone.

                                  Well I've struck lucky with my last two 3-Jaws then, both inside a thou

                                  Far more accurate than I had any right to expect, but SCRUPULOUS cleaning of the jaws is required.

                                  Neil

                                  Yes, I got one o' them, too, leastways on the main jaws when new. Still OK to about a thou an' a bit after two years' abuse…

                                Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 15 total)
                                • Please log in to reply to this topic. Registering is free and easy using the links on the menu at the top of this page.

                                Latest Replies

                                Home Forums General Questions Topics

                                Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)
                                Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)

                                View full reply list.