Wood Glue for Teak

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

Not quite model engineering, but I have some teak garden furniture which is cracking in places, and someone is bound to know the answer to my questions!

Given that teak is by nature an oily wood, what wood glue would the team recommend? I have some Polyurethane wood glue that says it glues just about anything, would that work?

Some of the failures are in load bearing bits of the chairs, some are just in decorative areas, none of it has been treated with teak oil for many years, which is probably good right now but also probably a contributory factor in the failures!

Chris

[Brian OldfordParticipant @brianoldford70365]

I'd be inclined to give the PU adhesive a go. Assuming it's the foaming type make sure the joint is firmly clamped to prevent the expansion opening the joint. If used primarily for its gap filling capabilities it'll have little or no strength.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Any outside things I have made for clients with oily woods like Iroko I have used West Systems Epoxy adhesive and not had any failures. As with all oily wood give the mating surfaces a good wipe over with acetone first to try and remove some of the oil in the wood.

If you do go with the PU then as Brian says a tight joint is better than one where you end up hopping the foam will hold things together and make sure its reasonably fresh

J

[Peter HallParticipant @peterhall61789]

I too would try the PU glue. I've not had much experience with tropical hardwoods, but I have had bonds fail using (yellow) PVA-type adhesives on Iroko, which is similar to teak. Polyurethane can be messy to use. Try not to get it on surfaces where you don't want it. And clamp up the job as Brian suggests.

Pete

[kevin largeParticipant @kevinlarge76611]

I would recommend cascamite not sure of the spelling its a powder you mix with water clamp joint leave over night

job done

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

If its the joints then drill holes through into the joint and fill a syringe with epoxy glue and pressure it into the joint clamping up as needed. Clean up when its set hard Joints that start working loose usually need taking apart and cleaning and then re-glued. If outside then Epoxy is best or as stated Cascamite or one of the glues that has a hardener that is brushed on one part and the glue on the other. Any Ships Chandler will have these glues but they are expensive and used mainly for boat building.

Clive

[DMRParticipant @dmr]

I also say Cascamite, especially since it is totally waterproof when set and will fill gaps if you let it go off a bit before applying. Any oil would weaken any new gluing efforts. Joints must be clean of any form of dirt and clamped up. This sounds a big clamping job so do parts at a time and use a good cord as a clamp wrapped round and round tightly and tied off. wipe off any oozings with a damp cloth or let it set and use a chisel. Once you have done it all, then oil it well, but you cannot sit on it straight away!

Years ago I had an open handled tenon saw that found its way onto the floor and broke off the bit you hold. It was glued with Cascamite and is still going strong.

Dennis

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Just to save you looking aimlessly on the net, Cascamite has not gone by that name for years, it was Extramite for quite a while and is now sold as Polymite though I think its recently gone back to Cascamite but there is still quite a bit of the Poly one about.

Also don't clean up hardened glue polymite/cascamite with your best chisel as it tends to set glass hard and will soon take the edge off your tools.

 

Edited By JasonB on 29/04/2015 20:15:25

[Peter HallParticipant @peterhall61789]

I've had joints fail with Cascamite too. It has a short shelf life. If you've not used it before you would probably do well to avoid it.

Pete

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

If the wood itself, rather than joints, is cracking check the clamping load needed to close the crack before gluing. If the wood is determined to crack the separating loads forces may well be approaching the strength of the glue or surrounding timber. If so the repair will not last long as either the glue will give way or the crack will simply shift over a little into another part of the timber. If properly made glued joints are frequently stronger than the wood itself.

If you have got a crack in the wood which requires considerable force to close the only satisfactory repair is to open it out a little and let another piece of wood in. Lots of work and harder top do well than an inexperienced wood basher might appreciate. Certainly way outside my skills thereof which are basically nail gun and chop saw level. But I was able to find a man who really did know how things should be done when faced with a similar problem.

Clive

[Steve PaveyParticipant @stevepavey65865]

In the day job I make quite a few bits and pieces for boats using teak and iroko, including laminated curved parts such as tillers and deck beams). I always use epoxy, usually SP106 but West Systems is equally as good (depends what your local stockist sells). I rarely degrease with acetone, but do rough the surfaces with some 80 grit glasspaper. I have also used PU but it's not my first choice for anything structural. I have always found Cascamite, Extramite etc to be absolutely useless – in fact I haven't bought any for years. All the marine joinery work I have dismantled where Cascamite has been used has been very easy to break apart – it is far too brittle.

[Swarf, Mostly!Participant @swarfmostly]

Hi there, ChrisH,

Back in the 1970s, I enlisted my father's help to make a table top by assembling some teak boards, dowelling and glueing edge to edge. My father was an accomplished worker in wood and used a lot of Cascamite one-shot for his jobs (mostly soft woods but also some oak and mahogany).

Cascamite was, at that time, made by the Borden Chemical Company and, knowing that teak is an oily wood, I wrote to them asking their advice. They replied that the best adhesive for oily woods like teak was resorcinol resin based glues but they didn't make it! However, assembling while the joint faces were freshly planed ought to be OK but, to be sure, wipe them with carbon tetrachloride or washing-up liquid before glueing.

We followed their Plan B and that table top has lasted pretty well, one joint is showing a bit now but that edge has been against a radiator for some seven years. (We should have slotted the screw holes in the cross battens, drawing board style, but didn't!)

Ironically, a few weeks after we'd done the job I happened to be reading a copy of 'The Woodworker' and happened on an advertisement by the Borden Chemical Company announcing that they were now producing a new glue based on resorcinol resin! I never did get to try it!!

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

The rubbing strips on my steam launch are made from Teak. I used West system epoxy to glue them on. I think I degreased them with acetone first, but it is a year or two back now. Anyway, they are staying on. Epoxy has the merit of being good for gap filling too, and if you wish you can colour it to match the timber. You can even add matching sawdust to the resin if you have any available. I agree with Clive that if it is a joint failing you are probably best to take it apart and remake it if possible. Cracks in the wood can be just filled with a thick mixture of glue.

A tip for polyurethane glues…if you get this stuff on your hands, it makes black stains that do not wash off. So rubber gloves are a good idea. If you already have the stains on your hands anyway, then put the gloves on and wear them for a few hours. After a while the sweat will lift the staining off. I wouldn't use polyurethane for this particular job myself.

John

[VicParticipant @vic]

http://www.titebond.com/Libraries/News_Articles/HowStrongisYourGlue_FWW.sflb.ashx

Makes for interesting reading.

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

Hi, I have used West (and SP) Systems Epoxy in the past, and very good they are too, but I've not tried it on teak. As stated above, neither are cheap. Plus at the moment I don't have any!

Cascamite I have also used in the past – I once had a wooden boat which had it's hull sheathed in cascamite and it's cloth and I had to repair a section. Again it was expensive and it was long ago dumped when out of shelf life.

I was going to try PU, until I read Vic's link, didn't make for very good reading. Maybe I will try one joint with it and see what happens.

Thanks to all who have helped here with their comments, much appreciated

Chris

[andrew winksParticipant @andrewwinks64215]

There was a glue years ago, formulation called urea formaldehyde. Was used in wooden boat manufacture and furniture, has anyone heard of this?

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Urea Formaldehyde glue is Aerolite 306 that I mentioned earlier. Axminster is a source, I have used it on teak succesfully for both solid parts as well as veneer. I have used Resorcinals for mahogany laminating (Glues Direct). Usual disclaimers as regards suppliers. Aerolite is better than "cascamite" in my opinion because the hardener is a separate item, not part of the powder you mix, so the glue stock when mixed has a longer shelf life.

http://www.aircraftplywoodandtimber.co.uk/aircraft_adhesives.html

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

If you want cascomite Axminster do it.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/cascamite-powdered-resin-wood-glue

If you want to ask a woodwork forum sign in to

http://www.getwoodworking.com/

and post a question on their forum.

Best wishes Martin

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

For wood glue use it's worth looking up the NZ build of the Mosquito, I think it was the West System epoxy glue that was used there with advice from Team NZ (America Cup yatch racing engineering team), none of the old glues on the Mosquitos were any good when used in tropical climates, a number of aircraft became unglued in flight, not a good idea.

Ian S C

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

I built a Dhingy using cascamite and it was strong and when rowing was OK, then I fitted a small outboard and under power the cascamite broke up at the transom joints. I had to remove all the plywood and remains of glue and fit a 1" thick transom with reinforcing bars . From then on it was OK. To fix it I used Aerolite glue using a hardener on one side and glue on the other side. It stood three years of hard usage with no problems. I also built a canoe using aerolite and screws and it was fabric covered and that also had no problems. I also made a table and 6 chairs for a dining table using Elgon Olive wood, that was very hard and brittle to work and I also used aerolite on these items, still in use now after 49 years and no loose joints. The wood will break before the glue joint.

Clive

[Edgar Vin 1Participant @edgarvin1]

lightly scrub both wooden surfaces with acetone and wipe 2-3 times with clean cloth with a bit of acetone to clear any residual oil. Let dry in fresh air for 12-24 hours and epoxy using at least a 10 hour cure. The longer the cure the more flexible will be the glue line (less brittle). I have belaying pins made that way and have been in the weather for a few years.

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