Rivet snap dimensions

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

Well fair enough. I’l try the chisel.

 

Then the press. I’m going for one of Machine Marts economy ones. Clarke is the supplier I think.

 

The economy one looks a bit primitivebecause it uses a bottle jack for the urge, but it has the advantage that the frame bolts together. So if you need to get something really large dia in there, you can. Where you may not be able to with the smarter presses that use a purpose built ram

 

 

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

Edited By David Clark 1 on 02/01/2012 20:10:05

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

Above is a lovely little rivet shortener from Arrand bought it in 06 and has done sterling work since MGJ do not understand why you would want to use a chisel or bottle jack

this device is aimed at ME’s who wish to shorten quantites of rivets, bolts ,bar efficiantly

quickly and accurately.

 

Arrand 01664 454566

They have no web site.

 

Everyone have a good new year

 

Bob

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Handy little tool, should not be too hard to make something up from Gauge plate.

 

mgj’s bottle jack was for forming the rivits not cutting them, though I think he should consider getting one of the following instead, not the novel use of the inspection pit

 

J

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

Pretty handy for strakes – doubt they would ever work loose.

 

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Thought you may have gone for something different on the 4″ one like the wood block wheels, I was chatting to a guy at Sandown who is going for that option on his 6″, not sure what the 9″ he’s also doing is going to be fitted with. For the rims he has cut down an RSJ or UB to give him two Tees with a nice internal fillet and then had them rolled as half circles by Angle Ring and then welded them into a circle.

 

J

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by mgj on 01/01/2012 09:52:40:

Well fair enough. I’l try the chisel……….

 

 

Just make sure it is really sharp, in fact sharp enough to cut paper when used like a Stanley Knife. It then needs little effort or force and the chisel will cut soft iron like butter.

 

Hi Bob,

 

why do you make so little of traditional tried and successful techniques? Do you really like to complicate things so much? I’m sure that dear old Fred (god bless his soul) used the simplest (and quickest) methods to get the job done.

 

Happy new year all,

 

T

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

T

I do not make so little of traditional techniques as you state and still use them but

this is not complicated and is efficient for small rivets up to 1/4″ . Also who is dear old Fred.

In this day and age there are many ways of doing the same task and getting a good result , you have to look out of the box. In my 70s and still looking.

Or is it Luddites rule.

 As you are a member of mensa you should know that one of the questions was to connect a lot of lines up without crossing them and the answer was to go out of the box doing lateral thinking.

Bob

Edited By Springbok on 02/01/2012 02:35:52

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

So that’s how Ogri puts the studs in his leather jacket…

 

Neil

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi Bob, I guess Terry means Fred Dibnah, the famous Bolton steeplejack as seen on TV.

 

Regards Nick.

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

No Jason,I’m going for rubber tyres from your lad Alan at MJ. Woodblock would look lovely, but I think on tarmac they would get to seem pretty untidy in moderately short order. I could well be wrong. Also remebering the fun at school sliding around on those old parquet floors, I wonder how much grip wood block would provide on grass?

 

I had my tees rolled up ready to weld, all 4 for £160, but thought they were undercharging so I gave then a couple of hundred. Considering what some charge I felt that was pretty reasonable. (Paid handsomely because the perch braket cost £10 including material, and I’ll only pay a tenner for geting a few other bits bent up.)

 

A weekend will see them as “wheel blanks” . I’ll get a Clarke cheapie press, and make a dolly guide up from 1″ x 3″ steel section, (as on TT) and I think I shall use Edwards conical squishing system. If it takes a bit longer to produce a decent job, then fine – I have the 3″ and shortly Metre Maid to keep the fires burning. That 3″ has been a real winner – took a bit of sorting through my inexperience, but its a super engine now.

 

I shall have an experiment with chisels, and if I can’t make that work quickly and easily then I shall use your rivet grip and the bandsaw. That Arrand gadget looks very good, but they will charge, and I already have a bandsaw, so the bandsaw idea wins in my workop. If I had’t got a bandsaw or a power hack, then the Arrand would be very attractive.

 

Thank you all – I have learned a lot.

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

I bought the Arrand because at the time I had over 300 rivets to chop down.for a particular loco.

 I should imagine if it is only a few the good old saw wins.

Bob

Edited By Springbok on 03/01/2012 01:18:28

[Geoff RogersParticipant @geoffrogers81118]

Jason,

thanks for the photo of the hydraulic riveter – I am looking at knocking up a smaller version for the two 4″ Burrells I am making

 

Geoff

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Another option being used on a 6″ Fowler crane engien here or the good old gun method here and a flypress

 

mgj if you have a look at Julia’s GMT build on TT there is quite a bit about using a press and making dollies there

Edited By JasonB on 03/01/2012 21:02:35

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

Jason – thanks. I had seen that, and thats why I was going for this very massive dolly guide.

 

What I’d like to be able to do is rivet the spokes to the ringsand then weld the rings in. That would simplify things (back wheels), because the guide won’t need to bridge the second ring, so one would probalby get a better squeeze. I think I’d make a pattern to compare the bent item against as well, just so as to be able to make the odd scientific adjustment.

 

(After looking at your link – he uses a bridge dolly with 3/16 rivets, and that has worked very well and i think his dolly is less massive than I was planning, so there is another option)

 

Edward in his book has a good idea for a spoke bender which could easily be made to have stops on it, so it would actually bend pretty accurately. Have a trial run/assembly and then a happy afternoon TIGging in the rings!

 

We have diverted a bit from rivet heads, but its all part of the process – of TE wheel riveting. Maybe not loco sized rivets.

Edited By mgj on 03/01/2012 22:43:12

Edited By mgj on 03/01/2012 22:48:07

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

That would certainly give easier accesas you would be able to come at it from the outside of the ring but you would still need a cranked dolly to miss the second tee if using the press method.

 

It would lend itself more to the rivit squeezer method, I’ll dig out a pic of a nice little squeezer made from a hydralic ram and a few bits of plate.

 

J

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Here you go, this was made by Rob Wilson over on Madmodder forum

 

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

Wow Jason

Did he make both of these items that you have pictured and is there any build history

that we can look at.

 

Bob

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

No The second pic just shows the painted up squeezer in the background. Though hes capable of making a milling machine.

 

Its worth looking through the posts of “Rob.Wilson” on Mad Modder, very skilled man, mostly machine refurbs and alterations but he’s also a very talented welder and home caster. You will have to register if not already a member then go to the member list , select Rob and view his posts.

 

http://madmodder.net/index.php

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by Springbok on 02/01/2012 02:19:49:

T

……………………

In this day and age there are many ways of doing the same task and getting a good result , you have to look out of the box……………………..

Edited By Springbok on 02/01/2012 02:35:52

Hi Bob,

 

And a Happy New Year, I’ll respect ‘out of the box thinking’ when I see more done properly inside it. Just because some things are old, it doesn’t mean they are outdated.

 

I’m not too far behind you in the age stakes either and in my previous profession I was acknowledged as a lateral thinker, But I can still appreciate the elegance of the simple ‘Complex’ is usually the result of muddled thinking. I’m reminded of those designers (and I use the term loosely) who try to redesign new versions of old, but proven solutions and the new ‘solution’ simply doesn’t fulfil the need. I’ve seen it often with ambitious young Turks who think they know better than the older generation. Perhaps I was even like that myself once.

 

As far as being a Luddite, a Luddite is one who resists progress. I welcome progress, but I don’t think that change is necessarily the same as ‘progress’. It takes lateral analysis to recognise real progress and not simple change. I’m just awaiting the day when someone here announces that they have redesigned the wheel, because it’s outdated.

 

All the very best regards,

 

Terry

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by JasonB on 04/01/2012 09:18:11:

Here you go, this was made by Rob Wilson over on Madmodder forum

 

 

 

Hi Jason,

 

Wow, that’s good, it fair takes me back to my days working with the fabrication platers in my first apprentice department. It would also make a great basis for an English wheel for body panel work with a few simple attachments. I haven’t been to Mad Modder fro ages, I must revisit. Thanks for the prompt,

 

Best Regards

 

Terry

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

No disrespect, but on the basis of that, I think a dolly with 2 slots in it might be a more speedy answer.

 

I bet that would squeeze a rivet a trifle.

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