Efficient Workshop Heating

[NJHParticipant @njh]

So Russ

Am I right in thinking that, in essence, your proposal is to purchase computer equipment which generates considerable heat in its operation and to utilise this heat to warm the workshop. The costs of this project – both the start-up and running costs ( plus, presumably, a contribution to a sinking fund for future equipment replacement ) would be met by "renting" the computing power of your machine to those wishing to tap into "spare processing power" via the internet?

Norman

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

put your handbag down JD,

The specs was for the benefit of others who might wish to follow the build, the GPGPU chosen is important since it represents an equilibrium between running cost and earnings while providing a good amount of heat at a low capital value.

Server specs have nothing to do with this, so you've missed the boat completely – this is actually the beginning of cloud computing in reverse, whereby rather than the end user paying "X" to use a computer based on a server, a company will one day pay a community cloud to compute data rather than rent or build an expensive server.

on the plus side, your summary is accurate if not complete, so you didn't miss everything…. let me finish that for you

– "hey, I could use the waste heat from a PC working as a shared server on the inet to help heat my workshop – while generating crypto currency I can sell for a profit covering the electric bill!!"

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by NJH on 25/02/2014 18:29:13:

So Russ

Am I right in thinking that, in essence, your proposal is to purchase computer equipment which generates considerable heat in its operation and to utilise this heat to warm the workshop. The costs of this project – both the start-up and running costs ( plus, presumably, a contribution to a sinking fund for future equipment replacement ) would be met by "renting" the computing power of your machine to those wishing to tap into "spare processing power" via the internet?

Norman

pretty much hit that nail on the head, except as of yet, it's just generating online currency, however this online currency can be sold for real money, which I find rather odd, but it is what it is.

One day, as mentioned above, companies will look to these community clouds to tackle packets of data for them that aren't latency dependant (such a medical or market research etc.)

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Russ Just watched the 6 O'clock news and it says the value of Bitcoins has dropped a lot in the last 24hrs, does that mean you are now in negative equaty

J

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by JasonB on 25/02/2014 18:38:30:

Russ Just watched the 6 O'clock news and it says the value of Bitcoins has dropped a lot in the last 24hrs, does that mean you are now in negative equaty

J

No, but well spotted, I've specifically avoided BitCoins

LiteCoin (for now) can only be most efficiently mined on consumer grade hardware – so no stock crash, see https://litecoin.org/ for the brief summary,

Since I will sell my stock monthly, the maximum I could crash would be £8-10 then I'd just pick another cryptocurrency and start earning that one.

I'll be part of a pool, since the winnings are more frequent, and there are many other benefits, this is the one I'll go with as they tick all the boxes for me https://crypto-coin-pool.com/

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Russ, for those that don't have the required hardware in their loft like yourself what would be the current purchase price so we can see how long it would take to get our money back on the initial purchase before we could earn any money

And for the less computer minded you could try the Ikea Tea Light method, only 8p a day

 

J

Edited By JasonB on 25/02/2014 19:06:08

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Russ B on 25/02/2014 18:33:42:

 

 

One day, as mentioned above, companies will look to these community clouds to tackle packets of data for them that aren't latency dependant (such a medical or market research etc.)

 

 

So big users who needs loads of cloud computing are going to use some man in a shed ?

And pay with junkcoin ™ ? No doubt you will issue a VAT receipt ?

 

And they will trust you with this data ?

 

Think I'll stick with me woodburner which contrary to what Howard says doesn't generate any rust and this in an uninsulated workshop but I do have it on every day [ I need to to get down the pile of wood ] so it never drops below dew point.

 

Once you get a few tonnes of machinery up to temp it takes a lot of cooling down.

 

New skip coming in the morning all being well.

 

Edited By John Stevenson on 25/02/2014 19:10:44

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

And trust them with this data ?

I see your point but It's encrypted, plus if a hacker wanted your data, he'd have it in a fraction of a second, just like a real life break in, security doesn't stop attackers, it just slows them down, and in the computer world, things happen in less than nanoseconds to start with. If your on your wifi at home, a hacker could be sat watching everything you do, you'd never know he was there, he's just watching all that data go back and forth.

J, it looks good but think of the moisture! I think you'd need more than a few to match the BTU's of this computers clean dry heat

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

Humm, I think I will stick with JS, my wood/charcoal burner is not a rust producer and works well. And I can understand it, whereas, computers, bitecoins, litecoins, a very very grey unfathomed area

Chris

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Russ,

have you calculated the UPS and backup generator in the sums to protect your clients data ?

That might stuff your break even point up a tad ?

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Well Russ

| " a hacker could be sat watching everything you do, you'd never know he was there, he's just watching all that data go back and forth. "

…. he would be very bored if he was sat there watching me!

N

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by ChrisH on 25/02/2014 19:25:34:

Humm, I think I will stick with JS, my wood/charcoal burner is not a rust producer and works well. And I can understand it, whereas, computers, bitecoins, litecoins, a very very grey unfathomed area

Chris

Fully understand, and I'm envious to be honest, a stove is really what I want, although the wood wouldn't be free I just love stoves, I find splitting logs and building the fire therapeutic in a primevil sort of way!

I live in a residential area, so a ground floor height chimney won't go down to well – nor will a 5 metre stack =)

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by John Stevenson on 25/02/2014 19:43:44:

Russ,

have you calculated the UPS and backup generator in the sums to protect your clients data ?

That might stuff your break even point up a tad ?

packets are distributed by the central system (https://crypto-coin-pool.com/) and its not uncommon for them to be wrong anyway when they return, they simply get sent out again for re-computing, the system runs from USB, it can be turned off and on at any time, it wont start where it left off, it will just request another packet and off it goes again – it can be run on a thermostat just turning on and off mid activity, no trouble.

(keep trying )

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Russ thanks for sharing your scheme.

Though interesting. .not for me.

I follow the generics ..but my pc hardware knowledge is hardly bleeding edge.. ( though you are saying these components are old tech..I would guess that they exceed by a couple of orders of magnitude most of the computer kit in wide use by the rest of us..)

[FMESParticipant @fmes]

I just prefer to use a dehumidifier, I get a dry workshop and the heat it gives out as a process of its operation is a benefit.

It uses 250 watts when on load and runs for 10 hours a day, 7 of which are on the 'night rate' (economy seven).

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

Real electronic technology isn't specifically about personal computers or even ASICs.

Check out Ben Krasnow on "the tube".

He's built an electron microscope, on his Bridgeport, in his shed.

I think he got a really good job (and a respectable, open, future – with possibilities) with Valve through that project.

Valve….. now that's a commercial idea we could use in the U.K.

I think it's sad that electronic technology in the UK is assumed to be PC's, iPhones and eChuff.

I don't think it amusing, and it's definitely not worth bragging about.

As an aside, it is my opinion that someone like Burt Rutan, simply could not exist in the UK.

It is exactly this which I am attempting (but probably failing) to pinpoint.

Edited By Andy Ash on 25/02/2014 21:18:30

[Steven VineParticipant @stevenvine79904]

Russ

Intriguing. I have never heard of bitcoins until today.

What can you actually buy with the coins, and what do you plan on buying with them? Can you use them at Tesco, or can you pay the electric bill with them?

Steve

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by Andy Ash on 25/02/2014 21:09:57:

Real electronic technology isn't specifically about personal computers or even ASICs.

Check out Ben Krasnow on "the tube".

He's built an electron microscope, on his Bridgeport, in his shed.

I think he got a really good job (and a respectable, open, future – with possibilities) with Valve through that project.

Valve….. now that's a commercial idea we could use in the U.K.

I think it's sad that electronic technology in the UK is assumed to be PC's, iPhones and eChuff.

I don't think it amusing, and it's definitely not worth bragging about.

Sorry if I came across as bragging if that's what your pointing at, I just wanted to heat my workshop free of charge…… and thought, this is probably something someone might want to replicate for their model engineering …….

In terms of technology the first electron microscope was built in 1931…. as skilled as he is (and I certainly couldn't achieve that), it's not exactly cutting edge – whereas, I don't imaging the world networking together their mechanical calculators to join forces and battle cancer in 1931,

Not sure what you mean by the PC's, iPhones and eChuff but since Valve Corperation who employ Ben Krasnow are at the bleeding edge of "PC's, iPhones and eChuff" and it's all American I don't know anyone who confuses it as UK tech.

Edited By Russ B on 25/02/2014 21:54:53

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by Steven Vine on 25/02/2014 21:47:42:

Russ

Intriguing. I have never heard of bitcoins until today.

What can you actually buy with the coins, and what do you plan on buying with them? Can you use them at Tesco, or can you pay the electric bill with them?

Steve

Steve, it cant be used in Tesco, but it can be exchanged for cold hard cash online.

Crypto-Currency is a very interesting concept, you'll get a much better idea on wiki – its basically decentralised money – and big banks, won't like not being in control – its going to be one to watch for sure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptocurrency

Edited By Russ B on 25/02/2014 22:17:49

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Posted by Andy Ash on 25/02/2014 21:09:57:

He's built an electron microscope, on his Bridgeport, in his shed.

Off topic but when you think about it we amateurs now typically have the kit (and better) that 30 or so years ago was exactly what was used to build electron microscopes, jump jets, moon rockets and even atomic bombs.

Don't understand the rest of much of this but sort of could 'borrow' say 3 million computers (which we actually own anyway) in STBs running at about 1000 meg for 8 hours a day at least. So how much can I make?

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

 

>>>>Quoted from Russ

Sorry if I came across as bragging if that's what your pointing at, I just wanted to heat my workshop free of charge…… and thought, this is probably something someone might want to replicate for their model engineering …….

In terms of technology the first electron microscope was built in 1931…. as skilled as he is (and I certainly couldn't achieve that), it's not exactly cutting edge – whereas, I don't imaging the world networking together their mechanical calculators to join forces and battle cancer in 1931,

Not sure what you mean by the PC's, iPhones and eChuff but since Valve Corperation who employ Ben Krasnow are at the bleeding edge of "PC's, iPhones and eChuff" and it's all American I don't know anyone who confuses it as UK tech.

>>>>>

Not at all, you came across as someone who would heat their shed with their PC, and claim the money back by using it to generate virtual money…. Or something.

Maybe you should have a look at at Ben's vids.

I think Valve, the US game software company, have employed Ben to carry on building stuff in his shed.

Unlike here in the UK, there is a recognition of the benefit that brains in sheds can practically realise.

Valve have a demonstrable history of doing this. I can name other people that they "look after" too.

Comparable in the UK is Sage. Renown for accounting software. It's a corporate stitch up. I certainly don't think it would be worthwhile to approach them for an engineering development bursary, on the basis of my youtube vids!!!! (Not that I have any)

You get a company like Valve, and they recognise that all the software in the world isn't going to get you to the moon. Most importantly, they have something in them, which makes them look outward. Looking towards that which might be lost, that which could be gained.

It's not that you are bragging. It is that if we look like we are bragging, then I think we look stupid.

Maybe all model engineers have a computer big enough to heat their workshop, but I think not; I know I don't.

Edited By Andy Ash on 25/02/2014 23:00:18

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Fair comment Andy thanks, I do disagree a little in that I work for a great company so they are out there.

Again, I didn't want to brag, it's my intention to share and I don't claim to own or have created the cryptocurrency or any of its associated software/hardware and really have nothing to brag about other than spotting the fact the I can buy a cheap piece of redundant computer hardware and etc. etc. (it's probably already been done!)

I was being secretive for a bit of fun that's all, and this whole mad idea, is just a bit of fun – I agree, model engineers probably don't have a big enough computer, and neither do I, I will have to invest in these GPGPU's as they are the key component, its like I've got a chassis and all the running gear but no engine right now.

Edited By Russ B on 25/02/2014 22:54:14

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Russ B on 25/02/2014 22:53:10:its like I've got a chassis and all the running gear but no engine right now.

Edited By Russ B on 25/02/2014 22:54:14

.

I used to have a van like that.

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by John Stevenson on 25/02/2014 22:55:16:

I used to have a van like that.

Best thing to do with that van, is buy and old computer with a GPGPU, put it under the bonnet, and use it to fly to the moon and back.

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

no no… I'm getting confused now…….

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