Drummond M Type Lathe

[Anthony Jamieson 1Participant @anthonyjamieson1]

I have recently acquired a Drummond 3 1/2" M Type lathe. I have just started to strip down to refurbish it, overall it seems in decent condition generally but is currently still very 'as built'. I have been trawling the internet looking for some spares as I think I'm going to need to replace the lead screw and nut. I also think I will need to acquire some of the change gear bolts for holding the gears to the banjo. whilst I can find a few spares I'm struggling to find somewhere I can get a leadscrew and nut. any ideas??

also I was wondering if anyone has any experience of the size motor I should rig up, I have got a couple 1 being a small 1/4 horse from an old washing machine and the other is a 1/2 horse from an old black and decker band saw. the latter being my preferred option as it has a bracket I can utilise to attach to the rig with the countershaft. any comments would be much appreciated.

[Anthony Jamieson 1Participant @anthonyjamieson1]

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Search in here for leadscrew nut and Drummond, there are loads of posts

As far as the motor is concerned, I would say if you are new to this game start with the 1/4HP and upgrade to the 1/2HP once you're past the carriage crashing knuckle bashing stage

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Slow down. Your leadscrew is probably ok Give more of the people on the Drummond Yahoo group time to see your post there and advise on the nut. You have got plenty of other work in setting up to do in the meantime.

Washing machine motors are mostly not fixed speed synchronous motors so need a feedback speed controller to keep them under control. The saw motor might be synchronous but B&D had a nasty habit of using their drill experience to just use high speed motors and a belt reduction. Noisy too. Post photos to give us a better idea of what you've got.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Welcome to the fold. Quite a few M-type owner on here. Mine is a 1937 model, still going strong.

Post us some pics of what you got. (Best way is to post pics to Photobucket and then use the image button at the top of the new post pro-forma to insert the direct link into your post).

What makes you think the leadscrew needs replacing? Usually it is just the half-nut that wears out. MEW magazine ran an article by Geoff Walker in the past 12 months or so on how to fix it up. There is also details on the Yahoo Drummondlathe group on how to cut up the original leadscrew and reverse the threaded section so the unworn section from the far end is now in the most used spot next to the headstock. It is in the Files section, IIRC, which is a good place to download all the info you can from, before they shut the groups down (inevitable one day, they are so primitive). Another good file to have is the section from the owners manual on how to adjust the headstock bearings, a simple but cunningly tricky technique which must be followed to get a good finish on these old lathes.

[Anthony Jamieson 1Participant @anthonyjamieson1]

i'm struggling to add pictures

i have stripped the lead screw out and it is heavily worn, the nut is U/S as is places i can move it up and down the lead screw so threads must be ruined.

i was wondering if a Myford ML 7 leadscrew could fit?

[Anthony Jamieson 1Participant @anthonyjamieson1]

Ahhhh i've worked it out

Does anyone know if the lead screw looks standard? there is a shoulder at one of the screw and i can't work out how its fitted or how it can be removed so i can remove the nut. i was wondering if the leadscrew at some point had been damaged and repaired by adding the part with the shoulder.

you can see in the below picture with the nut, the threads to the right of the screw are very rounded.

 

Edited By Anthony Jamieson 1 on 03/06/2016 12:13:49

[EugeneParticipant @eugene]

Another M type fan / victim here.

Much depends on how much you have invested in the ole girl currently, how much tooling you have, and how much you are willing to punt in the future. You've seen the prices asked for M type bits and bobs; crazy IMO.

What you have right now is an old machine, quite worn and lacking some parts. If you look on it as a fun project in itself, and don't actually need a fully competent lathe straight away, then fine, but if you want to use a lathe to make things without a good deal of time and money invested in fettling, this probably isn't the place to start.

As to specifics …. the lead screw looks to be standard; can't comment on the shoulder because I've never disassembled one, but Im guessing it must be pinned or just possibly, sweated. The change wheel "bolts" are actually thread-less spring pins; there is a drawing on the Drummondlathe website in the files section.

The other areas you might check before making a decision on future progress is wear and tear on the bed ways, the state of the spindle and bronze bearings, and the condition of the saddle and cross slide gibs / vees.

Sorry to sound a bit cautious, but I've been where you are, and whilst some of it was fun and instructive, a lot of it wasn't. On the positive side once you've got an M type sorted, even a novice like me can produce some surprisingly good work, which is very satisfying.

Eug

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Took me 3 years to semi-sort mine. Cost 125 and have probbly spent 3 grand on bits since then (Not just the lathe obviously)

Start cutting metal as soon as possible to see how far you want to take it. It's dirty, dangerous, frustrating, and eventually highly skilled and very satisfying once you get any good at it (so I've heard).

With the TV now in the bin the hobby has replaced that void of "what to do" and the only real limitation is yourself

I'm currently boring a 4 inch hole in the body of a prefabricated fixed steady, the metal I'm using blunts HSS tooling in seconds but carbide tooling can survive for a while and the lathe just takes it all in its stride, they're great once you get 'em sorted.

Edited By Ady1 on 03/06/2016 19:00:58

[EugeneParticipant @eugene]

Money thus far …….. initial purchase of a standard Myford 1946 M type, with the original stand and motor, £300. This came with virtually no accessories but was in very fair shape with no real wear.

Bought a second Myford M, a 1948 long bed this time, no stand or motor and not in such nice nick but with a full suite of bits. £310. So between them I've got one nicely specified standard machine and an ongoing project. Over and above that …… a face plate, a set of change wheels, a 3 jaw chuck (rubbish, money wasted) a chuck back plate, milling slide; call it another £300.

With the machine in your pic you'll probably be travelling a similar road.

Obviously if you are starting out from scratch as I was, you need drilling machines, tool grinders, and measuring tools, all that stuff, but that would happen no matter what lathe you chose.

To take Ady's point about starting at the beginning, you might look to the change wheel retainer pins as something to make with what you've got … turning, knurling, slitting and possibly a bit of heat treatment.

Best of luck,

Eug

Edited By Eugene on 04/06/2016 09:37:23

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Naive question, but doesn't the nut come off the tailstock end of the leadscrew, not the headstock end?

Neil

[EugeneParticipant @eugene]

Neil, Anthony,

What we see in Anthony's picture is the top section of the bronze lead screw half nut … except it isn't threaded from the factory, just a plain shell; it isn't permanently engaged. Pic below from a selling site ad of the apron from an M type with the parts of the half nut arrangement.

Eug

Edited By Eugene on 04/06/2016 09:59:22

Edited By Eugene on 04/06/2016 10:05:56

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Let's not forget you can do a lot with a lathe without using either the screwcutting or autofeed. many people on here report never having screwcut in years as dies handle the small stuff used by modellers.The simplicity of the lathe means it is easier to repair, enhance and modify. I think the nut needs to come off and be cleaned even if you try shifting it to the right as I suggested on the Yahoo group.

The bush is at the tailstock end to take the thrust from the leadscrew doing its job and fits up against the larger diameter of the thread. A spanner that just fits over the thread followed by the rest of the spanner set can act as sort of slide hammer and avoids hitting the bush one side only. Put the handwheel securing nut back on the end to protect that thread end before anything else. I suggest cooling the bush and rod as far as possible with an ice pack then with cardbosrd heat shields each side of the bush heat it up with a paint stripper gun to try and get a bit of heat differential expansion while the main rod is still cold.

Worst case you turn off the bush – trying that might reveal a pin holding it too. It's not that extreme you have a lathe so you can make a new bush.

Like I said it is easy to modify so have a look at how the M-type half nut works and copy that instead of the B-type fixed nut.

I think you are after the whole changewheel stud not just the pins / nuts. First get your wheels. You can make a stud or two initially from a normal longish bolt with a sleeve which you make yourself 'cos you own a lathe.

[EugeneParticipant @eugene]

Ignore me, I've got that nutty thing wrong. Anthony's M is an early type with a full nut.

Twit.

Eug

Edited By Eugene on 04/06/2016 10:24:30

[geoff walker 1Participant @geoffwalker1]

No Worries Eug,

We all make mistakes and you are NOT a twit, just remember you have forged your place in the history of dummond lathes with the inspired use of a secondary thrust bearing on the M type spindle.

I have followed your lead on my '29 drummond and '48 myford, just the job Eug makes a real difference.

All the best Geoff w

[bethany stevensParticipant @bethanystevens64181]

Hi I may have of the gear studs. The later type with the sprung cap.

I have quite a few Drummond/Myford m type spares that I sell off every so often.

This type of lead screw with the full nut suffers the same problem as the other early drummond lathes.

Because it is is a full nut rather than a half nut it is constantly engaged, so it is rare to find one in very good condition.

Hi let me know what you need and i will have look for you.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

To the dealer who has posted an offer to sell a feed nut, please could you use a personal message to the forum member instead?

Thanks,

Neil

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

If you look on the Yahoo Group, Drummondlathe, in the Files section, there is a description of how to cut the lead screw, turn the threaded section around and rejoin it. so the worn out section is way down the tailstock end where you never use it and the unworn section is now up near the chuck in the high-use area. You just cut the lead screw and machine a hole in the end of one part and a matching spigot on the end of the other part and put them together with Loctite, a pin or a tack weld or whatever.

If the nut has enough teeth left to then grip on the unworn section you can machine up a new insert from brass, bore out the original nut and solder or loctite the insert into position.

[Andy Clark 1Participant @andyclark1]

can anyone help ?

Looking for a tool holder for my Drummond "M" type 3 1/2 inch lathe either the single pinch bolt type or the 4 way square type anyone want to sell please contact me

Thanks

Andy

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Anthony Jamieson 1 on 03/06/2016 12:11:52:

… you can see in the below picture with the nut, the threads to the right of the screw are very rounded.

.

Indeed they are, Anthony … and I think your opening assumption that you need a new leadscrew is quite reasonable.

That said; unless you are intending to do accurate screwcutting, you will probably get away with it for years.

… Concentrate on the rest of your restoration, and grab a decent leadscrew when one comes along.

MichaelG.

[Author]

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