New vice – is it too large?

This topic has 33 replies, 17 voices, and was last updated 4 June 2018 at 10:59 by thaiguzzi.

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31 May 2018 at 18:33 #18936
Ross Lloyd 1
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@rosslloyd1
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31 May 2018 at 18:33 #356018
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
Hi

I just ordered this vice from chronos. Its a very nice 6 inch vice. I wondered though, once I had it in my hands, is it a mite big? Or perfectly acceptable for a mill the size of the Warco WM18?

Cheers gents

Edited By Ross Lloyd 1 on 31/05/2018 18:35:30
31 May 2018 at 18:45 #356020
Tim Stevens
Participant
@timstevens64731
It is a bit on the large size, but remember, you can hold small stuff in a big vice, but big stuff won't go in a small one.

The only 'down side' might be if you need to use in in conditions where the length (or height etc) gets in the way.

Regards, Tim

PS What do I know anyway?
31 May 2018 at 18:53 #356022
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
Hi Tim,

Yes good point. I definitely wanted the 6 inch length as I have already been doing some jobs on other machines that need that (admittedly it was a full size bridgeport though). Is it possible that the weight of it could distort the table, or am I worrying over nothing?

There is quite a lot of z travel left in that axis, I guess also if I run out of room I can just take it off and clamp the piece to the table?

Thanks again!
31 May 2018 at 19:01 #356023
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
Hm Just found this piccie online, maybe this is one of our members He seems to be coping ok and thats a whopper. Maybe I will be alright
31 May 2018 at 19:01 #356024
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Take it off the swivel base to start with which will take up less table and reduce the overall height, put it in a cupboard and forget about it as you are only likely to use it once in a blue moon.

Biggest problem with a large vice are 1. obscures y=axis handwheel dial. 2. can need mounting on the front tee slot if the tool is to clear the rear jaw when machining in Y direction which puts a lot of weight off one face of teh table and can make it harder turning the X handle.
31 May 2018 at 19:42 #356027
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
Hi Jason

Yeah taking it off the base will certainly give a bit more room and lessen the weight. I bought one because at the club I go to, the vice seems to be on the mill permanently. Its a big old bridgeport mill that gets a fair bit of use. Some of the members felt it was a good idea to get one, do you find that you have little need for one?

Cheers
31 May 2018 at 19:44 #356028
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Only used the swivel once or twice in 10 years
31 May 2018 at 19:46 #356030
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
Ah I misunderstood, you meant specifically the swivel as opposed to the whole vice itself! Cheers
31 May 2018 at 20:01 #356033
Brian G
Participant
@briang
My son has a similar size vice to yours on his Sieg mill. I suggested he didn't fit the swivel until he really needs to use it partly to get extra headroom, but mostly because it removes any temptation to set it up using the scale on the base instead of a dial gauge

Brian
31 May 2018 at 20:27 #356038
Neil Lickfold
Participant
@neillickfold44316
I am making a sub plate for my vice and rotary table etc. For the Vice, it will have some dowel positions so I can quickly have it parallel or set to 15, 30,45 deg. As I have a ZX45 mill, the plate will allow the holding things like teh vice and rotary table to be further forward on the table, so the cross slide is always in full contact area on the machine. If I have the vice mounted on the middle T slot, the edge of the back jaw centre line means that the cross slide is no longer on the full engagement. I guess it is an idiosyncrasy of my mill. I also have the vice and rotary table switched compared to how you have yours, mainly due the restriction of the vice to the rotary table handle. This is another reason for making sub plates. The I can quickly add or remove and accessory that for most things will be accurate enough. Yes I will have to re cut the edge of the T slot , as they do not run true to the run of the table, about 0.1mm over the run of the table movement. The down side the 14mm tennon slot won't be 14mm anymore. How ever , having the reference dowels always on the same direction against the trimmed edges will be more beneficial to me. The other option is to rework the whole table.

Neil
31 May 2018 at 21:21 #356044
Rik Shaw
Participant
@rikshaw
Bought a large swiveller from Axminster (they do have a rather nice showroom ) . The vice is intended for use on my shaper. Like Jason the first thing I did was remove the rotating base and confine it to a cupboard – maybe it will get some use one day .

Rik
31 May 2018 at 23:45 #356053
Bazyle
Participant
@bazyle
A 4in should be enough. If you really need a 6in then you probably need a bigger mill to put it on.
1 June 2018 at 00:46 #356057
mechman48
Participant
@mechman48
I have a 4" fitted on my WM16, take it off the swivel, I have used the swivel once in 6 yrs I've had it so …

George.
1 June 2018 at 10:34 #356073
Ian S C
Participant
@iansc
You are better off with two smaller matching vices than a big one. Taking off the swivel base will make the vice more rigid.

Ian S C
1 June 2018 at 11:18 #356081
not done it yet
Participant
@notdoneityet
Posted by Ian S C on 01/06/2018 10:34:12:

You are better off with two smaller matching vices than a big one. Taking off the swivel base will make the vice more rigid.

Ian S C

All my vises are singles and nothing matches. If I were starting again with a bit more hindsight, that is what I would do.

Likely buy two vise and match them (if of chinese origin). Otherwise probably pricey, but the better all-round solution.

Selected precision vises such as available from ARC (among others, I suppose) might be a good way to go…
1 June 2018 at 18:44 #356126
mark costello 1
Participant
@markcostello1
Does this mill make My vise look too big?
2 June 2018 at 23:46 #356262
Ross Lloyd 1
Participant
@rosslloyd1
OK its going back. I spoke with Warco, they recommend a 4 inch for the WM18. I am considering a high end 4 inch. What are the brands to look at? I know Kurt and Glacern for the US market, are there alternatives for the UK?

Thanks

Edited By Ross Lloyd 1 on 02/06/2018 23:47:45
3 June 2018 at 06:38 #356266
Neil Lickfold
Participant
@neillickfold44316
The new Kurt with the sliding jaw stop and other jaw offerings make it look like a really nice to have vice Talk with who you brought the vice off, and see what they have.

Neil
3 June 2018 at 07:05 #356267
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Bear in mind that the rectangular flange on the bottom of a Kurt and their clones makes them quite large on a smaller mill. This is a 80mm clone up against a 90mm precison which gives you more width, length and depth of jaw for a smaller footprint. (swivel base removed from clone)

And the 100mm against the 80mm clones on a smaller SX2.7

Edited By JasonB on 03/06/2018 07:06:17
3 June 2018 at 08:30 #356271
Neil Lickfold
Participant
@neillickfold44316
Why not place the vice so that Y axis is in line with the jaws? IE rotate it 90 deg.

Neil
3 June 2018 at 09:53 #356273
not done it yet
Participant
@notdoneityet
You can, but travel is much limited that way.

Most machines that have power feed only to one axis have it on the long travel.
3 June 2018 at 09:55 #356274
KWIL
Participant
@kwil
That all depends upon whether you have a power feed on your Y axis and how long a part may actually be gripped in the vice jaws. More room for overhang in the X axis.
3 June 2018 at 10:02 #356277
Anonymous
Posted by JasonB on 03/06/2018 07:05:33:

Bear in mind that the rectangular flange on the bottom of a Kurt and their clones makes them quite large on a smaller mill.

Genuine Kurt vices don't have a flange all the way round, only on two sides, so they're better for the smaller mill:

Andrew
3 June 2018 at 10:10 #356278
JasonB
Moderator
@jasonb
Posted by Andrew Johnston on 03/06/2018 10:02:48:

Genuine Kurt vices don't have a flange all the way round, only on two sides, so they're better for the smaller mill:

Rather depends on which Kurt you go went for

Edited By JasonB on 03/06/2018 10:11:11
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