Welding Gas

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Hi Everyone, just to let all know there is a "new" source of gas for welding–alternate to British Oxygen and Air Products.

Air Liquide have started supplying all gases including Oxy Acetylene in bottles you can buy rather than rent, it is under the brand "Albee Gas"

You buy the bottle and its yours for life and refills are about £40 for 11lt bottles about 6 hours continuos welding !

Look at this link

http://www.albeegascylinders.com/ look for your local agent.

A lot cheaper long term than renting from BOC etc.

PS I have no connexion to the suppliers I found them after a search for Acetylene supplies after receiving my renewal from BOC rental

Regards John F

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

[Ompa OmpaParticipant @ompaompa11814]

Anyone yet used these, and more to the point any idea on the costing. Just closed my BOC account, so could be of interest although nearest stockist at present is a fair trek for me.

[Roger VaneParticipant @rogervane67137]

I had rented an Air Products oxygen cylinder for years, but when the advice of the next year's rental came in at £120 I decided that things had to change.

Admittedly this was a large cylinder, but I hadn't exchanged it for 9 years or so and it was still two-thirds full, so I could afford to downsize and hopefully save some cash. In addition to the annual rental, Air Products impose a handling charge when exchanging the cylinder – expensive when collecting and even more expensive for delivery. Another annoyance was that their agents are now few and far between.

So, I needed to look for something smaller (and hopefully cheaper to rent). I'd started thinking about the future – maybe I'd go back to BOC and see what they could offer – at least they had a more suitable network of agents than Air Products.

Then I found a reference to a company by the name of 'Adams Gas' on this forum which made interesting reading. Adams are based in Margate, Kent and operate through distributors – there are a number of these in Kent and some further afield. The interesting thing about Adams is that you don't pay an annual rental charge, neither are there any handling charges. All you pay is an one-off up-front payment which is fully refundable at any point in time should you no longer wish to keep the cylinder – this charge is currently £55.

Looking at the Adams website – http://www.adamsgas.co.uk – I found that I could get an oxygen cylinder for £36 (inc VAT) plus the up-front payment of £55. Admittedly the cylinder is much smaller than the one I had and it is filled to a lower pressure (137 bar as opposed to around 200 bar) but it appeared to be a good solution to my problem. The real test will be when building a boiler and seeing how many refills will be required, but this only happens occasionally and I'm already in profit.

Adams list various gases under the heading of 'Hobby Gas' which includes MIG welding mixes as well as the oxygen – they don't offer acetylene. Their cylinders use the same regulator fittings as BOC, Air Products and Air Liquide, so no problems there.

Depending on where you live the Adams Gas may also be worth considering.

Good luck.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

I was talking to the Guy from Stevens & Son who are Adams gas distributors and he says they hope to also be doing acetylene soon.

**LINK**

J

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

Thanks for that – I have an Argoshield light bottle from BOC. I have had it for about 9 years, and its still well full. 9years at £120 a year….

I reckon I can get one of these little bottles, weld for 5 years and still show a retun on 1 years rental. That Argoshield in the BOC cylinder must be worth its weight in gold!!

[Ray LyonsParticipant @raylyons29267]

I found paying a rental for an Argon 10L bottle from BOC was expensive at about £60 a year plus handling charge when refilling. Very handy for me since the depot is only a short walk down the road.

Now changed to Barnet Welding Supplies. A 10L cylinder of Argon costs £54.50 + Vat and Oxygen is £37 + vat . Lifetime refundable deposit on each cylinder is £60 and delivery for two cylinders was £15.50 including Vat. I use Oxy/Propane for brazing since most of my welding is now electric.

[Steve WithnellParticipant @stevewithnell34426]

I tried to get Acetylene off BOC, and they just cannot deliver it. They've had massive supply problems, my local BOC agent almost refused to take my order… Ended up with Air Liquide (I think they own Air Products) its c£21 a month for a small acetylene and a small oxygen. The gases are then a small fortune on top. I think the Acetylene refill is now £50. Great Grandad had a tank full of carbide to supply his welding kit…

PS:  They charge you for collecting the stuff too!

Edited By Steve Withnell on 14/08/2012 22:07:21

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Had all my cylinders [4] off BOC so was spending a fortune in rental £240/year, all gases other than acetylene are available but I need this for a Eutectic metal spray that I use a lot — propane just won't do hence my search for an alternative suppler who would sell me the bottles.

Albee / Air Liquide charge £120/140 for the cylinder depending on size –one time payment and that includes a fill of gas at about £45 depending on the gas & size. Each cylinder comes with a new valve and regulator fitted each time you refill.

Steve — can't be sure but I don't think Air Liquide are associated with Air Products but stand to be corrected.

John

[SkarvenParticipant @skarven]

Hi,

It is a little bit more expencive in Norway.

I just bought a 10 litre bottle of Argon from Air Liquide, (I think the price is the same for all gasses), and paid £545.-. that was including the gas. A bottle exchange is £78.

I use an old fire extinguisher with CO2 for MIG-welding. It's a 5 litre bottle that refills for about £27.

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

I've been using Air Liquide for some time. In France you can buy the bottles and refils in most DIY stores. My last acetylene refil (1000 litres) cost about 70 euro.

I don't know the cost of new bottles but a complete welding kit can be bought for less than 500 euro.  Might be worth a day trip to Calais?

Russell.

Edited By Russell Eberhardt on 15/08/2012 16:51:58

[Neil GreenawayParticipant @neilgreenaway71611]

Hi There,

BOC have had major supply issues for acetylene due to a serious fire in theyre bottling plant in UK/Ireland. I know that they have recently restarted but are not filling all sizes – some of my work suppliers are only getting medium size bottles so far, however it appears that eventually they will get all sizes back up and running in theyre bottling plant – it will just take a while!

I recently bought an argon bottle that a local supplier fills with argoshield type gas for MIG – the refills will be about £35. I previouslky used CO2 and notice a huge improvement with the argon/CO2 mix.

Neil

[Steve WithnellParticipant @stevewithnell34426]

Posted by JohnF on 14/08/2012 22:24:57:

Steve — can't be sure but I don't think Air Liquide are associated with Air Products but stand to be corrected.

John

You are right John – they are a private company owned by Airproducts & Chemicals in the US.

Haven't a clue where I got the Air Liquide linkage…

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

> My last acetylene refil (1000 litres) cost about 70 euro.

Wow! At that rate I'll get my LPG car converted to acetylene and import my gas from the continent

Neil

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

If you want a day trip to Calais you could try these people: **LINK**

Russell

[Steve WithnellParticipant @stevewithnell34426]

My Dad just pointed out he used to pay 30 shillings to get a large oxy bottle filled and £4 for Acetylene. No rental on the cylinders, just a deposit…

[Chris KellandParticipant @chriskelland71558]

Hi All,

I have been using Air Liquide, Albee Flame oxygen for some weeks with great success. I paid £145.00 + vat for an 11 litre cylinder and first refill. I own the cylinder and exchange the empty one for the cost of the gas only, I think about £30.00. The regulator comes with the cylinder but does not have a outlet pressure gauge, but the regulator is calibrated and I've not found that a problem.

The UK Albee gas web site is so far out of date that it only shows MIG and TIG gases I got all my info from one of the European web sites. Acetylene is also available but I am using Propane.

Chris

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Steve Withnell on 16/08/2012 21:04:11:

My Dad just pointed out he used to pay 30 shillings to get a large oxy bottle filled and £4 for Acetylene. No rental on the cylinders, just a deposit…

.

Steve, let me have an adress and I'll ship my two empty bottles down with a check for £5 10s 8d

The extra 8d is for the return postage on the two bottles as a stamp was only 4d then.

John S.

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

Has anyone tried Hobbyweld – http://www.hobbyweld.co.uk/default.php?page=55

I too dread the arrival of that BOC envelope.

Edited By capnahab on 16/02/2014 18:19:55

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

This is reminiscent of the situation 30 years ago when the Post Office monopoly on modems strangled digital communication development. deregulation halved the price overnight.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

This reminds me, at the opposite end of the scale I have two refillable CO2 canisters as normally sold for Soda Stream (for a Gasparin CO2 motor). I haven't seen these for exchange in the supermarkets for years. Has anyone eny suggestions?

Neil

[John CParticipant @johnc47954]

Hi Neil,

 

Not sure about refillable ones, but the small sparkets type cylincers – single use –  are used in CO2 powered air guns. Search fleabay for 'CO2 Powerlets', or try your local hunting/shooting/fishing supplier.

Rgds,

John

Edited By John Corden on 16/02/2014 21:11:48

[Graham WhartonParticipant @grahamwharton]

Posted by capnahab on 16/02/2014 18:19:24:

Has anyone tried Hobbyweld – http://www.hobbyweld.co.uk/default.php?page=55

I too dread the arrival of that BOC envelope.

Edited By capnahab on 16/02/2014 18:19:55

I use hobbyweld. You pay about 50 quid deposit for the bottle, which is refunded on return. You keep the bottle for as long as you like. No rental charges. An argoshield type gas refill came in at about 40 quid for a bottle that stands about waist high.

I think they also do Co2, pure argon, acetalene, oxygen, nitrogen, helium.

Definately worth a go if you want rent free.

Graham

[_Paul_Participant @_paul_]

Posted by capnahab on 16/02/2014 18:19:24:

Has anyone tried Hobbyweld – http://www.hobbyweld.co.uk/default.php?page=55

I too dread the arrival of that BOC envelope.

Edited By capnahab on 16/02/2014 18:19:55

Air Products envelopes are no better, Hobbyweld's gases look a reasonable alternative, just noticed their Acetylene cylinder is £192 deposit which does seem a little on the high side for such a small cylinder.

Regards

Paul

[Steve WithnellParticipant @stevewithnell34426]

Air Liquide are now charging me £24 /month rental for their small size Oxy & Actylene bottles and they sent me a note a while back saying an acetylene refill would be £100…

Part of the problem seems to be that the BOC acetylene plant suffered a catastrophic explosion quite a while back, so I think Air Liquide are the only serious producer in the UK now. The picture isn't at all clear.

What I am finding is that calls into low cost / rental free suppliers is that Acetylene might be mentioned in an ad, but it's not usually available to buy.

An outfit near my Dad's charges a £150 non-refundable deposit for the bottles, which is a big reduction on current costs, but haven't sorted out that out yet. Great Grandfather had an acetylene generator in his shop, but it was said to be a dirty job to run.

Steve

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