Turntable truck bearing

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

Hi all,

I am going to build a bespoke machinery truck to help moving my workshop to a new location. I'm proposing a four wheel flat bed strong enough to carry my lathe etc.

I think the front axle should be steered and so will require some kind of turntable bearing.

The heaviest machine will be three hundred kilos I guess, so what size and wall thickness box section will I need and what kind of bearing for the axle.

I think I can power it with a caravan motorised jockey wheel to drag it along rather than have to hand ball it.

Any thoughts appreciated. MICK

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

I'd go and speak to a big toolhire outfit. It's amazing what they have access to. then you don't have the trouble and expense of making somethng for short term use.

[Bob RodgersonParticipant @bobrodgerson97362]

Mick,

a lot depends on what sort of ground you intend to move the machinery. I have put both my manual lathe and manual milling machines on pastored trolleys that make them easily moveable but only within the workshop and the driveway which is tarmac covered. Anything rougher than this and larger wheels will be needed, the wheels on the castors are about 4" diameter and they can take a dynamic load of 500kg each and a static load when jacked uo of 1000 KG . The trolleys are made from 4" channel and can be seen in this months MEW in my article 18 months with a Tormach. These sort of castors are not cheap, probably £ 30 each or more.

The channel used is pretty heavy stuff and is probably overkill. My mill weighs well over 300KG and for that matter so does the lathe, I built the trolleys deliberately heavy so that I could use them on the trolleys with the wheels locked.

I would have thought that 2" Channel would do the job you are contemplating or 2 X 1 box section.

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

I have been searching tool hire for something suitable but can only find items for sale not hire. Plus it will come in for other things too as the current Mrs Mick could do with wheels fitting to everything as it's always in the wrong place.

Channel would be good but box section is my preferred option for fabrication.

And I have to shift these things up some pretty steep yorkstone paving so casters are a no go. So a turntable it is.

Regards Mick

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Can you stretch to Ackerman steering? A turntable will lose stability on turns though admittedly give more manoeuvrability. 300kg isn't that much so 1in would be enough as the main weight can be over the rear axle. pneumatic tyres? better for bumps but also some loss of stability as they move to accommodate those paving stones.

[BikepeteParticipant @bikepete]

Pallet truck?

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

Not enough ground clearance but good for lifting

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

If it is a one off move you don't need steering at all and can lever it round corners. I moved an Aga kitchen range and a 1000lb lathe by making a 'truck' out of two off 3×2, flat, with slight groove to locate the 1in bar axles held by U bolts, wheels are solid 6in gas cylinder trolley wheels. A lever on a brick with the end under the axle lifts it up, easy to feel the balance point, move lever to side and the wheels move 2 in to the side, repeat.

You can get the large sack truck from Costco which is taller than the average DIY one, lay it on its back and rig some wheels for the top of the handle and you have a trolley about 4ft 6 long.

[Mike LightfootParticipant @mikelightfoot72419]

Hi some years ago I made a truck for the same job I used 50×25 X 3 mm with some biggish planks on I just put a piece of plate greased well and a largish bolt through fairly basic but our ME club is still using it to move all sorts also for lifting my mill I used a jack and did each side a bit at a time and blocked it up till I could get under it good luck

[martin perman 1Participant @martinperman1]

I build trolley's for my stationary engines, my largest engine has a turn table front axle which is made of 3 x 2 box with two steel discs seperated by a low friction piece of plastic.

Martin P

[Peter KroghParticipant @peterkrogh76576]

Think 5th wheel on a tractor-trailor rig. Articulated lorry???

Pete

[Martin ConnellyParticipant @martinconnelly55370]

Just search for turntable bearing online. Lots of hits, chose the size and load you want.

Martin

[Steven VineParticipant @stevenvine79904]

Make up a 'plank', long enough and wide enough to support the machine(s). You could construct it out of 4 by 4 etc..

In the middle of the 'plank', construct an axle tree, and put 2 strong wheels on it. Keep the whole thing as low to the ground as you can

Balance the lathe on the contraption so the centre of gravity is over the axle. It should manouver ok.

Steve

Edited By Steven Vine on 26/03/2016 22:37:22

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

100mm x 50mm Channel section back to back with stretchers and axles for 150mm wheels in between. 100 x 50 Cross members bolted to top of each side channel assembly. Load on cross members. Good enough to move 1.25 ton Bridgeport, steer by just lifting centre of one cross member with a trolley jack. Do not allow wheels off ground more than enough to steer (much more stable that way). Turntable steering asking for trouble when it turns too far. Moved a large lathe on the same "platform"

Edited By KWIL on 26/03/2016 22:49:05

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Tractor man on 26/03/2016 20:25:01:

Not enough ground clearance but good for lifting

.

You can buy or hire hi-lift pallet truck that will go to 850mm high.

How high do you need to go.

[John McNamaraParticipant @johnmcnamara74883]

Dollar for Dollar or Pound Pound in the UK a pallet truck is to me one of the most useful ways to move things around, It will not work on soft surfaces so you will also need a few sheets of strong plywood and a number of chocks to create a level surface if moving over say grass. Needless to say if there is more than a mild slope, it is better to use a professional machinery mover.

The fact that it can lift maybe 150mm is a great advantage. However when moving a pallet you should only lift it the minimum needed to clear the floor. This assures the there is little risk of tipping.

They are available fairly cheaply.

Make sure you have a place to park it maybe under the end of a bench if available is a good place the lifting feet are the problem, you have to slide them under something.

I have a storeroom that abuts a driveway that is packed so tight I can only just close the roller door! there is no passage way inside, It is stacked to the roof. with all the goods stored on pallets and shelves made to fit on pallets. It only takes a couple of minutes to drag out a few pallets to access the ones at the back the pallet truck makes it so easy. it is left parked under one of the pallets with just enough room to shut the door. as long as the floor is flat you can move a ton quiet easily.

Regards
John

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

Consider a 3 wheel truck with your caravan wheel as the front axle ? 2×2 angle will be strong enough if the load is distributed properly.

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

.

What about something like these. **LINK** They do larger dia's and load bearing capacities. They even do pnumatic ones.

These could be bolted through the holes usually found in the cabinet feet once the lathe has been jacked and blocked up.

If you wanted a wider wheel base for stability they could be secured to some box section steel and that bolted to the lathes bases feet.

Unless I am missing some point somewhere I don't see why this needs to be an over complicated set up. – I would say the opposite. The simple and more ridgid the better.

Nick

 

Edited By Nick_G on 27/03/2016 09:52:02

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

I have built a lot of stationary engine trolleys,to carry engines up to 15 cwt, a trolley for 300 kilos does not have to be substantial ,a lot of trailers for towing behind cars only have 50mm sq box section with 3 mm wall thickness for the axle and at 4 ft long will carry half a ton. As for a turn table ,it only requires a pair of steel plates 4 to 6 inches dia with some grease for lubrication and a couple of holes to take a bolt so that the steering can be locked to steer straight.The big problem with machine tools are that they are always top heavy so it is advisable to have long axles for stability ,for travelling over rough slabs or uneven concrete it advisable to have wheels larger than castors and have soft rubber tyres so that there is some "give" when a small ledge or an uneven surface is encountered.To move loads uphill try using a trailer winch,mount the winch on the trolley and attach the hook on the cable to a convenient anchor, i.e. a tree, shed floor or concrete path with a Rawl bolt ,thirty years ago I bought a 30 cwt Blackstone which was mounted on plastic wheels with rubber tyres ,wheels were 14 ins and 9 ins dia,it was amazing how the wheels took the load,later ,when the engine was mounted on a decent base I kept those wheels and made a steerable trolley like those in garden centres, and it gets used all the time,very often to carry an engine during restoration and it still carries half a ton easily,so don't over engineer a trolley. I have a pallet truck,its great on level floors,but useless on uneven ground,trolleys with castors are dangerous, the wheel base and track varies too much when being moved and can tip over very easily.

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

Gents as usual a great deal of experience and skill passed on here, many thanks. I have found a 12 inch diameter lazy suzanne bearing in the shop and mounted on substantial plates I think k itvwill provide the front axle steering.

I have sourced some 10 inch rubber tyred wheels for the rear axle and I already had a couple of gas bottle truck wheels for the front.

I'm going to rough out a few plans for it to suit the largest machine (boxford gear head lathe) and heaviest (die filiing machine or 10 inch shaper) of my gear. It should then handle anything I can throw at it.

We are hopefully moving house soon so everything has to travel half a mile up the road to its new home. Just as I had got my perfect workshop she decides she wants a view lol.

Thanks for all the information and I will post some pics when it's done.

Regards Mick

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

I have settled on a trike style trailer with the powered wheel on a tiller for steering. To be safe I fitted a pair of removable heavy duty castor either side of the jockey wheel in case it tips. I moved a slotter over the weekend and it managed the load well. It seems daunting moving my entire shop but it has to be done. As soon as we have a moving date I can really start to panic. Got to box up everything but keep essential tools handy. Thanks for all suggestions so far. Regards mick

[Rufus RoughcutParticipant @rufusroughcut]

Hi Tractorman

Not wishing to offend but caravan parts and trailer parts are good solutions, for instance what wife living in caravan near a view and you staying there.

Danah!

Rufus

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