Multifix Retracting Toolholder.

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Hello all, having just purchased a Multifix Retracting Threading toolholder, I am at a loss as to where to obtain the tangential inserts from.I believe they are made by Ifanger or Komet. I took a chance buying the toolholder (new Swiss E size at a good price)and now hope someone on here could point me in the right direction for the inserts !. Will try and post a picture of a similar one. Many thanks.

PS, looks like I have to put the picture in my album first.

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

Log on to Brutsh Reugger website in Switzerland, they have a comprehensive listing of Ifanger and other suitable tooling for Multifix.

Clive

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Hello Clive, thanks for the info. This is a picture similar to mine, the cutter "insert" is a sort of dog leg shape.

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

Hi Roger, I have a couple of those cutters in 55' and 60' deg. I rigged up a tool holder to suit. You notice that you can rotate the tool holder to match the pitch of the screw?

Multifix is a superb system and the accessories are very good.

Clive

[VersabossParticipant @versaboss]

Just use the correct name:

Brütsch-Rüegger: **LINK**

But Ifanger is also on the web:

**LINK**

Regards, Hansrudolf

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Link straight to the part

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Versaboss and JasonB, thanks for the links.

Clive, you are right, you can rotate the shaft, Ive just been in the workshop to try it !. Did you have to buy your 2 cutters in from Germany ?. They certainly look easy to sharpen.

Roger.

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

Hi Roger, I was given the task of closing down a workshop equipped with Schaublin machines, a lot of tools were kept as spares and I found these in a cupboard much later and therefore inherited them.

The tooling was used on a Schaublin lathe (N102) that had a sliding headstock shaft where the thread being cut had a threaded sleeve placed on the end and the that was engaged with a star of the same thread and the whole shaft came forward. the whole thread was cut in one go on brass or Alu.

It took longer to place the component than to cut it.

Clive

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Bet you don't get those tools for peanuts. Ian S C

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Clive, you were lucky to inherit them. I believe CIS in the UK import Ifanger stuff, so I will try them. Interestingly, I saw a video of a bloke somewhere who cut the cutter clamp off the end and welded a square threading insert holder on the end, the modern type. A bit drastic.

IanSC, the cutter bits, or the actual toolholder unit ?.

Regards, Roger.

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

Hi Ian, they currently cost approx Sf 135 (£90)from the Swiss tool company listed further up the postings. I have never been able to fault the tooling and it has always done what it says on the label. Very desirable tooling and they were not the only tooling I inherited (See my Photos) I would have had the Lathe or 1 of them anyway but had no space to put it. Later the N102 complete wiih all tooling, collets and a dividing head went for £750. I could have wept as I could have built another shed to put it in and still made a profit. Currently they go for £7000 to £8000, when I first ordered it from Switzerland it cost £14000 and that was in 1977. I also ordered a Shaublin 13 Milling machine and that cost £17000. That and another N102 went for £7800 for the pair. Next time I buy a house it will have a double garage.

Clive

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

Roger , did you get anywhere with the insert ?. I am having trouble registering with the website.

Can the viewers recommend any of the German copy to holders , – AXA and PeWe ?.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Regarding Multifix copies

I had the most bizarre exchange with the owner of PeWe Tools just before Xmas (gold coloured). I queried why he charges a lot more for a pair of holders than the incremental cost difference between say 4 and 6 holders bought as a set. I think a pair of holders may even have cost more than two singles. I was looking to buy a Type B post for my Bantam, along with something like 8 or 10 holders and simply asking for him to do me a sensible price for the lot. This seemed to be beyond his comprehension, although he came up with some amusing explanations. He clearly didn't want my business, so my bank account remained intact. Although they appear to be German parts, I am pretty certain they are sourced from China.

The other supplier I narrowed down to was Create (blue coloured) in China. As they were temporarily out of stock, I was able to avoid damaging said bank balance until my mouse / finger problem resolved after Xmas. If I find myself with sufficient funds and / or the finger problem reappears, I intend to get some of theirs.

The Rotagrip system (blue coloured) looks fairly Chinese too, although they cost more. I wonder if they are made by Create?

Obviously I wasn't prepared to cough up for "original" Multifix parts, even if I could track them down through all the smoke and mirrors.

Murray

[Clive HartlandParticipant @clivehartland94829]

I know that the dealer in EMCO machines stock the Multifix tool hoders, worth checking on them. Pro-Machine tools.

Clive

[SteveIParticipant @stevei]

Hi,

I recently purchased some 2nd hand A sized in a job lot from ebay in Germany. Most of them are stamped "West Germany" and are a perfect fit for my Swiss made tool post and are nicely finished and appear to be hardened. I have no idea who made them. Does anyone have an idea?

Also included were a few unmarked and I can only assume these are Chinese origin and the finish is rougher and they are not hard as a file marks them. The made in West Germany marked holders compare well to the few Swiss made I have sourced from ebay.co.uk. The Swiss ones are all marked with the NPL logo which I am guessing is National Physics Laboratory and were in very good condition. (I am still to source a 55° and 60° tool bit for the external threading tool holder I have.) The 1 x unknown source (Chinese) parting blade holder I have is awful compared to the 1 x swiss original I have. I have not seen any of the "P" (tangential) type either original, German or Chinese for sale and I'd like to try one. I'd also like to try an internal thread cutter and it seems the Chinese don't make these.

On German ebay there are lots of unmarked which I think it is safe to assume are Chinese (PeWe are made in China) but also AFI which google tells me are made in Germany. Can anyone confirm that? Does anyone have experience of the AFI?

I have found that the 2 regular multifix sellers I have done business with listed only post to Germany but I messaged them and they agreed to post to the EU/Norway/Switzerland. I wrote the message with the help of google translate they then replied in English! The blanks listed are I think from China and are more expensive than the regular Chinese holders which I don't quite understand. I would really like to source some well fitting blanks.

Steve

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Hello capnahab, I couldnt get an insert, so I made a new spindle and welded the end of a carbide insert threading tool to it. I think its one of JB Cutting tools , about £20. Works a treat. I think Clive mentioned how expensive the original ones are, about £100 . Heres a pic of mine.( I hope)

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Comet make the inserts I think.

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

Thanks Roger, Looks good. Have just worked out that the cutting end can be rotated. You can get the inserts from BRW as someone earlier said, you need to register on the website to get shipping to the UK (not easy) and they are expensive. They look like the Aloris equivalent so should last a while.

As you have shown me your Roger , I can show you mine.

ps let me know if you ever want to get rid of the DSG.

Nick

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

sorry, yours….

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Hi Nick

Is that an old shaving brush on the suds can ?

Emgee

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

yes , badger mind. works a treat , for the cutting oil. can't remember when I last bought any.

Edited By capnahab on 27/01/2015 17:06:24

Edited By capnahab on 27/01/2015 17:11:10

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Nick, I like the bed covers on your Hardinge, or is it a Feeler. Also, if you dont mind me asking, what are the advantages with a retracting toolholder, fitted to a retracting topslide ?.

[capnahabParticipant @capnahab]

I had a feeling Arceuro used to do them but can't find it now. These are from Beakbane and pretty good. I think they are a series of thin aluminium templates to fit over the bed, with black rubberised cotton sewn and glued and waterproofed. I never use coolant having seen what it does to the gearbox. Its a Hardinge.

I got the retracting toolholder in a job lot, so just trying it out. The Hardinge retracting topslide is good but not infallible. It retracts the tool at the same angle as the topslide (say 29 or 30), so if your run out channel is narrow at the end of the screwcut for whatever reason you run the risk of colliding with the shoulder of the last thread (am I making any sense?.)and you are betting to use the topslide dial. I wondered if the mulitifix retraction being 90° might be better. Haven't yet worked it out and I suppose it will depend on the situation. I have tested the accuracy of the retracting toolpost though and even after rotating it to a new position on the toolpost and back it is spot on.

If you want more details of the beakbane covers pm me.

Nick

[Roger Williams 2Participant @rogerwilliams2]

Nick, I must admit, Ive done some screwcutting near a shoulder, and you are right, the tool starts to rub on the shoulder at the end of the procedure on my HLVH. Perhaps down to about 16tpi, it would be better to infeed at right angles to the job, instead of at an angle. On the bigger lathe, the retracting toolholder is perfect !.

Regards, Roger.

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