Lathe index tips

[petro1headParticipant @petro1head]

I seem to have gone swarf mad and doing a lot of machining jobs

I currently use CCMT and CCGT tips but was wondering of alternative time with three points instead of 2.  Ie WMNG or TCMT.

thoughts please

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

You can get holders that use the other two corners of the CC** inserts so you can get your monies worth out of them.

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Although the holders to use the obtuse corners are useful and effective you need to be very disciplined about tool changing if you are going to exploit a significant proportion of your collection of worn out on the sharp corners CC** inserts.

I can’t get near even consumption. Probably 1 obtuse corner killed to 5 sharp ones.

Might do better with a classic British large lathe indexing 4 way tool post instead of the Dickson QC set-ups my machines wear. An indexing four way is so much faster than a QC. Loosen the handle so it rides up on the spring, twist to next position and lock down. Especially when you get into a rhythm.

Doesn’t help that the sharp corner is pretty general purpose so changing is for tip use economy not cut function. The motive for change is weaker.

When I went insert I lucked into a decent starter kit of C series tips and holders for £ very, very cheap. If I’d had to pay official prices I’d probably have gone W series.

Clive

[VicParticipant @vic]

I’ve been using TNMG 1604’s for a while. You can get them for just over £11.00 for a box of ten on Amazon but I paid £22.00 for the last lot of polished ones for Aluminium. Not bad price wise as you get 6 cutting edges per insert.

The smallest tool holders I’ve seen are 16mm so slightly too big for my lathe which can accommodate 14mm. I just trimmed 2mm off the bottom with a carbide end mill. The tool holders was, at the time about about £12.

These inserts also fit the little hogger mill I use on my milling machine and work well.

There seem to be many more options for these inserts than the typical inserts aimed at hobbyists if you can deal with the tool holder.

[HuubParticipant @huub]

The price per cutting edge of my inserts (AliExpress) are most of the time independent of the number of cutting edges. CCxT inserts can get into smaller holes than TCxT inserts. For custom cutting edge angles, I use mainly TCxT or DCxT inserts.

If you like me, can’t use the full cutting edge of an insert, buying the smallest insert size saves money.

When I chip a cutting edge of my (double sided) WNMG inserts, most of the time the opposite cutting edge is also damaged. Because double sided inserts are thicker, they are more suitable for interrupted cuts.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

I use a holder for the 100 degree corners, for roughing, and keep the new 80 degree corners for finishing.

I’m with Clive on using four way toolposts, (Made one to carry front and rear chamfering tools and a parting tool) Minimal over hang, so maximum rigidity

Howard

[VicParticipant @vic]

I too am a fan of the four way tool post on my little 8.5” x 14” lathe. As mentioned the tool holder for TNMG inserts is 14mm deep so quite rigid.

My journey with carbide inserts started with the little DCGT0702 inserts. I bought a double sided tool and a box of inserts from Jenny of JB Tools at one of the shows many years ago. I didn’t find them very durable, the tip radiuses available were often limited and being only 2mm thick easily damaged. The shape can be useful for some jobs though so I sometimes use the larger DCGT11 inserts.

The cost of inserts obviously varies by supplier. Yesterday I received some from Amazon. I’ve had several boxes of DCGT and TNMG inserts from them and I’ve not been disappointed so far.

You can get bargains though from mainstream tool dealers like this supplier. As you can see, the cost of TNMG inserts is pretty similar in this case but you’re getting three times the number of cutting tips than the little DCGT07 inserts.

[VicParticipant @vic]

Anyone used inserts from Temu?

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

No, but I guess we will all have to when there are no independent suppliers left onshore.

Bit disappointed that we get free adverts for discount box-shifters but not APT..

 

[VicParticipant @vic]

Two of the pictures posted were from APT, you may have recognised them from the website?

I cropped them to make the prices easier to read. Here’s another picture.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

WNMG 06 or 08 size can be obtained in aluminium grades as well as for steel, they have 6 edges per insert, as do the TNMG 16. That is if you don’t crash and destroy one whole corner. APT is a very good supplier for hobby use and if you want to try smaller quantities rather than buying a whole box of ten, then they also have a limited number of inserts available at a higher unit price especially for home users.

Those Temu inserts pictured in Vic’s post are exclusively for use with right hand tools.

[old mart]

On old mart Said:

 

Those Temu inserts pictured in Vic’s post are exclusively for use with right hand tools.

Are you sure, I thought the right turning one’s looked like this?

Either way, Temu sell both types for similar prices Old Mart. 😉

When I get low on stock, I sometimes look on eBay for bargains. I didn’t pay more than £1 an insert for these ones including postage.

 

[VicParticipant @vic]

It looks like the cost of the Tool holders is about the same price as I paid a few years ago.

The steel is quite hard (or it was on mine) so if you do need to trim it down to fit your toolpost you’ll need a carbide mill.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Old Mart is correct about the handing of the inserts.

That ebay image you have just posted is a right-hand tool not left. The heading has an L in it for L/H but image and insert is R/H

The other images down the side with the Allen keys in them do show a L/H tool and that has the L engraved on the side

That is the problem buying from cheap suppliers who can’t even describe or illustrate a listing correctly you may not get what you are hoping for and then it is hard to return. Or if you don’t know your right from your left they generally are not that helpful at answering questions.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

I bought a cheap box of the right handed TNMG16 inserts for steel and found they are primarily for much more powerful lathe than we have at the museum. I sharpened the edge with a diamond lap and improved the cutting.

Remember a righthand lathe tool bends to the left to face off the righthand end of the work. Righthand tooling is more often used than lefthand. Lefthand tools can be mounted in line with the spindle axis facing towards the chuck when a difficult small diameter or tight clearance makes a righthand tool problematic.

[JasonB]

On JasonB Said:

Old Mart is correct about the handing of the inserts.

That ebay image you have just posted is a right-hand tool not left.

Yes, that’s correct, exactly what I said in my post.

 

[Vic]

On Vic Said:

Are you sure, I thought the right turning one’s looked like this?

 

 

 

Those are Left Hand as Old Mart Said not right as you think they are.

[JasonB]

On JasonB Said:

You can get holders that use the other two corners of the CC** inserts so you can get your monies worth out of them.

Can’t see any, do u have a link

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Apparently it is an SCYC holder

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

There’s a few of different types, Chronos /Glanze do a facing tool and a through-turning / rougher

https://www.glanze.co.uk/product-category/lathe-turning-tools/lathe-turning-tools-single-lathe-turning-tools/

and RDG do an SCKC* tool which will face and turn.

https://www.rdgtools.co.uk/product/10mm-right-hand-indexable-lathe-facing-tool-sckcr1010f06/

other sizes available.

I think you can also get SCKC* through-boring bars which use the obtuse corners.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

I use this shape for turning diameters. The one I use for facing is an SCBCL where the L is the left hand version which is held with the shank along the lathe’s axis

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