IMPETUS METALMASTER COMBINATION MACHINE

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

http://www.lathes.co.uk/advertphoto/120802metalmaster/

Some good pictures of this machine and an equally good write-up have appeared on http://www.lathes.co.uk site .

 

 

Edited By MICHAEL WILLIAMS on 06/08/2012 09:30:48

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

I do like it when manufacturers put their Patent numbers on machines.

MichaelG.

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

That should be in a museum, not a workshop.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by KWIL on 06/08/2012 11:18:47:

That should be in a museum, not a workshop.

Be that as it may; the people who insist on building "mini Mills" with round columns could learn a thing or two from the designer !!

MichaelG.

[mickParticipant @mick65121]

Goes some way to explaining why most of the old turners who were around when I was a lad had fingers and thumbs missing!

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

Bought one of there chinese multi lath/mill some years ago looked like a good idea at the time
no matter how much you tried to tighten the column you occasionally got whiplash. beware any mill with a round column if you are makeing as I was a 7.25g loco. Soon bought a Chester 626 and pushed the gadget to one side.
Yes it should be in a museum.

Bob.

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Nice to see that some of you can make proper value judgements .

Interesting machine in many ways but a dead end as far as development goes .

Many attempts have been made over the years to produce 'multi function' machines but few of them have been even remotely successful .

In respect of the Metalmaster itself :

(1) The designer was a clever man but seems to have become blinkered in his thinking here .

(2) I've never understood why a patent was granted for the triangular gib key . Analysed properly it works just the same way as the gib strip on an ordinary machine . In any case trying to use a tiny key to line up things feet away is doomed from the start whatever may be claimed .

(3) I've further never understood why many people , every ten years or so , have seen fit to reinvent the machines concept all over again – there is even a CNC one now I believe .

I think we'll respect the designer for making a gallant attempt to produce something different but consign the actual design to history .

Michael Williams .

Edited By MICHAEL WILLIAMS on 07/08/2012 08:05:37

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Michael,

An excellent summary of multi-function machines in general.

Regarding your (3), I think the reason this concept keeps getting reinvented can be best identified as Greed.

The punters are greedy to get as much functionality as they can, in terms of (i) financial expenditure, and (ii) allocation of space. … They want it to be possible.

The manufacturers are greedy to Sell a lot, whilst Providing only a little … If I can persuade you that my multi-machine is three machines in one; then I can easily charge you for [say] two of them. <etc.>

MichaelG

_______________________________

For those who may not have looked …

Mr Urwick's Patent, although it uses the metalmaster as an example of implementation, really concerns the triangular gib key. This, as Michael indicates, is nothing very special in terms of its apparent function … but the important thing [and the patentable invention] is the novel approach to obtaining alignment on a cylindrical shaft.

It is generally much easier and cheaper to make matching 'shafts and holes' circular in section; but then there is no positive alignment in rotation. Users of the small mill/drill machines will be familiar with the problem. … hence my earlier comment in response to KWIL.

The patent offers a low-cost manufacturing solution … the end result cannot be "better" than the equivalent square or triangular alignment mechanisms BUT; for a given level of accuracy it will be much cheaper to manufacture.

[Alan JacksonParticipant @alanjackson47790]

I copied his triangular gib in my Stepperhead lathe and have to say it works very well in alignment. As a multifunction machine it may save money over separate individual machines but there are advantages in concentricity in being able to make a component say like a gearwheel at one setting, rather than transfering it to a second machine to cut the teeth for example. Adding a vertical slide to a lathe is after all an example of creating a multi function machine.

Alan

Edited By Alan Jackson on 07/08/2012 10:26:57

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Hi Alan ,

Two different concepts :

(1) The 'multifunction' machine which is (eg) any of lathe/mill/drill/grinder/shaper etc all in one unit . Even though all machine functions are available they are actually quite separate and require use as separate machines . You could not (eg) machine your gear wheel in one go on a Metalmaster – several major resettings of machine and workpiece would be nescessary .

(2) The 'machining centre '. Usually used to describe CNC machines but actual concept is much older than that . In a machining centre workpiece stays at the focus of operations and various tooling units in turn (or one tooling unit with changeable function ) move in , do a task and retract . Your gear wheel could easily be made in one go on such a machine .

The modern day CNC machining centre works essentially the way described but there were similar (non CNC) manual operated , semi auto and auto machines used in industry a hundred years ago .

More :

The triangular gib key can't evade a fundamental piece of geometry . With the 20:1 lever ratio quoted in the Metalmaster description an error of 0.0002 inch at the key becomes .004 inch at the remote end .

Regards ,

Michael Williams .

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Alan,

Excellent points and, as I have remarked in other threads; your Stepperhead concept is superb.

What I should have mentioned in my last posting was Gordon Gekko's famous line:

"Greed is Good"

MichaelG.

[Alan JacksonParticipant @alanjackson47790]

Michael W & Michael G,

I agree with what you say about a small error at a small radius being magnified at a larger radius that is why I have added a secondary column at a larger radius to say back up and ensure the alignment.

Alan

Edited By Alan Jackson on 08/08/2012 10:07:30

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