Four facet drill grinding.

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

Help!! I am trying to find an article on 4 facet drill sharpening published in either ME, MEW or EIM. I'm sure I read an article in the last few years. I have tried searching the on line index of published articles, using various combinations for the search without success. There are older articles pre 2008 but I'm sure there was a more recent article. Does anybody know what the mag and issue or date was. I'm pretty sure I'm not suffering from the onset of dementia. At least I hope not!!!!!

Alan.

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

[Alain FooteParticipant @alainfoote90915]

DAG Brown Model Engineer 1994 no. 3968 is a good starting point.

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

DAG Brown has done articles in the past but there is one in ME Jan/Feb 1995 by Roland Gyllander from Sweden. i have made his jig but found it susceptible to variable hand pressure so have adapted it to fit directly on the T and C table removing the variable hand pressure problem. I have made a start on a article for MEW about the adaption but not finished yet! and sometimes think people have had enough of four facet articles. if interested drop me a PM

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

Thanks Alain, I did see that ref in the online index and I do have the mag. But I'm sure there was a more recent article published in the last few years. If all else fails I will have to do it the hard way and do a manual search.

Alan.

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Here is some info for starters.

**LINK**

regards Martin

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

There is an article by Gadget Builder in HSM (Home Shop Machinist) try this link to his pages there is a whole load of info on drill grinding , jigs and some of the theory. Also a powered 4-facet grinder/jig ** Drill Sharpening **

John

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

I've found it.

ME Vol 215 issue 4513 2015 by D.A.G. Brown. The reason I could not find it using the on line index was because the title of the article is "Further Developments in Drill Sharpening"

Dementia not just yet!!!!

Thanks to all for your advice.

Alan.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Well-found, Alan

A collection of data becomes information when you properly index it.

MichaelG.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

D A G is very expert at four facet drill grinding on his Quorn.

Four facet ground drills cut extremely well and a centre drill for starting is not obligatory.

Keeping the lip lengths equal is the secret to having accurately sized holes.

You are effectively grinding a two flute End Mill or Slot Drill with` inclined faces.

Howard

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

Thanks MichaelG but I was somewhat fortuitous. I took a punt and started searching ME first from the last issue. Checking each vol index until I got to the 2015 article. I wasn't going to go much further before abandoning ME and going onto MEW and EIM indexes. So think I was lucky.

Regards,

Alan.

[Robert DoddsParticipant @robertdodds43397]

Is the reprint article of Giles Parkes of any interest

From the Archives: Twist drill Sharpening by the Four Facet Method

Model Engineers' Workshop|May 2020 No293

The original article was published in 2000 MEW 64.

Bob D

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 26/04/2021 18:58:59:

D A G is very expert at four facet drill grinding on his Quorn.

Four facet ground drills cut extremely well and a centre drill for starting is not obligatory.

Keeping the lip lengths equal is the secret to having accurately sized holes.

You are effectively grinding a two flute End Mill or Slot Drill with` inclined faces.

Howard

He claims, and there is no reason to doubt him, that his drills do not snatch in brass either.

regards Martin

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

The method is detailed in the Quorn construction book.

Well worth the effort but I tend only to use the method on 1/4" up sizes.

Emgee

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by Journeyman on 26/04/2021 17:18:45:

There is an article by Gadget Builder in HSM (Home Shop Machinist) try this link to his pages there is a whole load of info on drill grinding , jigs and some of the theory. Also a powered 4-facet grinder/jig ** Drill Sharpening **

John

Thanks for that John. I came across this quite some ago but is one of several good links I’ve “lost” over the years. It remains a very comprehensive article on drill sharpening.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Not sure who started four facet grinding of drills, but the late Giles Parkes advocated, and used it, on his Worden Cutter grinder. Relative easy to do, and well worth the effort..

Howard

[Douglas JohnstonParticipant @douglasjohnston98463]

Posted by Journeyman on 26/04/2021 17:18:45:

There is an article by Gadget Builder in HSM (Home Shop Machinist) try this link to his pages there is a whole load of info on drill grinding , jigs and some of the theory. Also a powered 4-facet grinder/jig ** Drill Sharpening **

John

That is an interesting 4 facet grinder. Does anybody happen to have a copy of the article from HSM as I would love to have a look at it.

Doug

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Posted by Douglas Johnston on 27/04/2021 16:06:24:

That is an interesting 4 facet grinder. Does anybody happen to have a copy of the article from HSM as I would love to have a look at it.

Doug

I got a copy from John Moran (AKA Gadget Builder) try his Email: John at GadgetBuilder.com if you get no joy PM me and I will rummage in the archive and see if I can find it. He sent it to me as a web page.

John

P.S. Don't forget to change the ' at ' for a @

Edited By Journeyman on 27/04/2021 16:39:10

[Brian Baker 2Participant @brianbaker2]

I have made Bernard Towers modified 4 facet drill grinding jig, from a pre published set of drawings and it works well. It is designed to fit onto the Stent, and makes the job straight forward and quick.

I think it should be published Bernard, and it is a useful addition to the Stent.

However, I have purchased a Quorn, which I like, and the Stent, including Bernard's jigs have been sold.

Publish it Bernard!

Regards

Brian B

[alan ord 2Participant @alanord2]

Bob D thanks for the info. I will dig out the articles.

Alan

[Douglas JohnstonParticipant @douglasjohnston98463]

Posted by Journeyman on 27/04/2021 16:38:08:

Posted by Douglas Johnston on 27/04/2021 16:06:24:

That is an interesting 4 facet grinder. Does anybody happen to have a copy of the article from HSM as I would love to have a look at it.

Doug

I got a copy from John Moran (AKA Gadget Builder) try his Email: John at GadgetBuilder.com if you get no joy PM me and I will rummage in the archive and see if I can find it. He sent it to me as a web page.

John

P.S. Don't forget to change the ' at ' for a @

Edited By Journeyman on 27/04/2021 16:39:10

Thanks for providing that email address John. I contacted John Moran and he has sent me the relevant files. This will keep me in reading matter for a while, then I will decide whether to make one.

Doug

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Thanks Brian, Article has been half written fo ages perhaps I should finish it!

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

The advice with an old kit for the Worden advised making a collet for each size of drill.

I followed, without realising, Giles Parke's method, of making an ER20 collet holder in a piece of 1" square steel, (The size used in the fixtures for the Worden. )

his allows drills of up to 13 mm to be held.

The drill is clamped in the ER20 collet, so that one cutting edge is vertical.

My holder is marked to identify the faces, so that rotating the holder through 180 degrees is obvious, if a an already ground face has to be revisited.

The Table is set square to the grinding wheel.

Fitted into one of the "standard" drill grinding fixtures (Inclining the drill at 31 degrees ) the complete assembly is swung through 30 degrees to produce the secondary clearance.

Once this is done, the fixture is reset to 10 degrees to produce the primary clearance.

The end result should be the primary reliefs being of equal width where they meet at the chisel edge in the centre.

Howard

[Alan Wood 4Participant @alanwood4]

I've just completed a joint cooperation with John Moran to produce a hybrid 3D print / metal version of his four facet sharpener. The hybrid construction concept works very well making the whole thing much easier to produce.

You can download a ZIP file with Fusion files, STEP files and PDF drawings from my blog.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 28/04/2021 10:40:09:

The advice with an old kit for the Worden advised making a collet for each size of drill.

I followed, without realising, Giles Parke's method, of making an ER20 collet holder in a piece of 1" square steel, (The size used in the fixtures for the Worden. )

his allows drills of up to 13 mm to be held.

The drill is clamped in the ER20 collet, so that one cutting edge is vertical.

My holder is marked to identify the faces, so that rotating the holder through 180 degrees is obvious, if a an already ground face has to be revisited.

The Table is set square to the grinding wheel.

Fitted into one of the "standard" drill grinding fixtures (Inclining the drill at 31 degrees ) the complete assembly is swung through 30 degrees to produce the secondary clearance.

Once this is done, the fixture is reset to 10 degrees to produce the primary clearance.

The end result should be the primary reliefs being of equal width where they meet at the chisel edge in the centre.

Howard

Coincidentally, Howard's detailed article on this subject will be in MEW 320!

I passed the proof half an hour ago!

Neil

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