Another Smart Meter thread.

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Hi Robin

Switching to another supplier charging the capped rate may prove difficult as it seems that unit costs are not available from energy suppliers at present, or at least I couldn't find any from those supplier sites visited.

Emgee

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Emgee on 03/09/2022 23:33:55:

Hi Robin

Switching to another supplier charging the capped rate may prove difficult as it seems that unit costs are not available from energy suppliers at present, or at least I couldn't find any from those supplier sites visited.

Emgee

I actually found a quote from Ecotricity (one of the three exempt from the cap) a couple of days ago, about 65p /KWh for electricity after Oct 1st. But today they won't give a price because of the "fluctuating market". So who knows!

Robin

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

The devil whispers ‘tick-boxes’ and ‘bandwagon’ in my ear : **LINK**

https://www.ecotricity.co.uk/support/our-energy-tariffs

MichaelG.

.

Ref. __ https://politicaldictionary.com/words/bandwagon/

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 04/09/2022 06:39:46

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Please excuse the further digression, but I need to share my astonishment :

gov.uk has adopted the Americanism : checkbox

https://design-system.service.gov.uk/components/checkboxes/

**LINK**

MichaelG.

[blowlampParticipant @blowlamp]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 04/09/2022 06:53:46:

Please excuse the further digression, but I need to share my astonishment :

gov.uk has adopted the Americanism : checkbox

https://design-system.service.gov.uk/components/checkboxes/

**LINK**

MichaelG.

Little by little, the UK & England is being dismantled.

Martin.

[Tony Pratt 1Participant @tonypratt1]

I hope everyone is watching Panorama on how we the great British public are getting shafted left right and centre!

Tony

[Dave HalfordParticipant @davehalford22513]

You don't need to bother, all you need is one of these

Please excuse the Add

[Oven ManParticipant @ovenman]

Posted by Dave Halford on 06/09/2022 21:05:17:

You don't need to bother, all you need is one of these

Please excuse the Add

Good to see that it's not just us Brits that are gullible. £79 for a 10p capacitor in a plastic box? You must be joking.

Peter

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

Many posts back someone asked about energy grades. The grade of any particular energy source is related to the concept of entropy. To keep things a bit simpler and not get too deeply into thermodynamics, lets just think about heat sources. If we have a source of heat and a cooler place, we can run a heat engine on the difference in temperature. Sadi Carnot tells us that the greater the difference in temperature, the more efficient our heat engine can be. So a big difference in temperature means we have a high grade source of energy, while a small difference in temperature means we have a low grade source of energy.

On the other question of how the energy gets from place to place, well, the important thing is actually the magnetic and electric fields around the wires, not the movement of the electrons. These fields propagate through free space at the speed of light, and along wires at maybe 70% or so of the speed of light, depending on the dielectric around the wires.

John

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by blowlamp on 04/09/2022 11:29:30:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 04/09/2022 06:53:46:

Please excuse the further digression, but I need to share my astonishment :

gov.uk has adopted the Americanism : checkbox

https://design-system.service.gov.uk/components/checkboxes/

**LINK**

MichaelG.

Little by little, the UK & England is being dismantled.

Martin.

Michael's link is to a Software Engineering document. In computer speak a checkbox is one of the widgets used to implement WYSIWYG GUI. For example:

• HTML – <input type="checkbox" id="vehicle1" name="vehicle1" value="Bike">
• JAVA – public class JCheckBox extends JToggleButton implements Accessible
• Qt – QCheckBox(const QString &text, QWidget *parent = nullptr)
• etc

The industry standardised on checkbox rather than tick-box because widgets were conceived in the USA. I don't think it's cultural imperialism because other widget names like slider, button, dropdown, textbox and label don't seem to be designed to crush the British! Rather the opposite – almost all the world's computer languages are based on English.

Dave

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by John Olsen on 06/09/2022 22:19:13:

Many posts back someone asked about energy grades. …

.

That someone was me [on another thread], John
Thanks for your elucidation

As you will see from page-1 of this thread … I did manage to convince myself that Iunderstood the concept and commented accordingly.

[quote]

NDIY … you may be interested to know that [after your previous insult] I did look-up the meaning of ‘grade’ in this context; and was disappointed to find that it means very little.

I was expecting to see some sort of scale [c.f. Centigrade], but it turns out to be binary

… Fuels are either ‘Low Grade’ or ‘High Grade’

< sigh >

MichaelG.

[/quote]

Thanks again, John

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Ho Hum

Energy firms remotely switching people to prepay meters

**LINK**

[Tony Pratt 1Participant @tonypratt1]

OK guys, advice please. I do not want or desire a 'smart meter' & thus far have resisted my suppliers pleas to have one installed, they are now saying I must have a new meter installed due to safety concerns as my old meter is 15 years old! Can I still refuse, I'm guessing not ?

Tony

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Ady1 on 09/11/2022 19:46:58:

Ho Hum

Energy firms remotely switching people to prepay meters

**LINK**

Thanks for this Ady. My supplier continues to nag, and although I'm unlikely to fall into arrears it goes to show that the system as currently implemented is flawed.

Tony – from Citizens Advice :

"You don’t have to accept a smart meter if you don’t want one. If your supplier tells you that you must have one installed, contact the Citizens Advice consumer helpline.

If you refuse a smart meter, you might find it hard to access all tariffs. This is because in future the cheaper tariffs offered by suppliers might only be available to customers with smart meters.

If you need to replace your old-style meter because it’s unsafe, you might not be able to refuse a smart meter. This is because not many old-style meters are made now – your supplier might not have any in stock.

You can ask your supplier to install your smart meter with the extra functionality switched off. This means it’ll work in the same way as your current meter, and won’t send any information to your supplier. Contact your supplier to check if they can do this."

So maybe, maybe not.

Robin

[Maurice TaylorParticipant @mauricetaylor82093]

Hi **LINK**

Have a look at the above link.

Maurice

[Oven ManParticipant @ovenman]

Posted by Ady1 on 09/11/2022 19:46:58:

Ho Hum

Energy firms remotely switching people to prepay meters

**LINK**

Excuse me, but could someone explain how it is possible to change a normal smart meter into a prepayment meter. The smart meter I have happily installed has no way that it can accept any input to add credit. I smell a bit of fake news here.

Peter

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Oven Man on 09/11/2022 21:34:28:

Posted by Ady1 on 09/11/2022 19:46:58:

Ho Hum

Energy firms remotely switching people to prepay meters

**LINK**

Excuse me, but could someone explain how it is possible to change a normal smart meter into a prepayment meter. The smart meter I have happily installed has no way that it can accept any input to add credit. I smell a bit of fake news here.

Peter

You pre-pay via an app or by phone apparently – no need to bung a 50p in the slot.

Robin.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

This appears to be a recent explanation: **LINK**

https://www.uswitch.com/gas-electricity/guides/prepayment-meters/

MichaelG.

[Oven ManParticipant @ovenman]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/11/2022 21:44:39:

This appears to be a recent explanation: **LINK**

https://www.uswitch.com/gas-electricity/guides/prepayment-meters/

MichaelG.

Thanks for that Michael. I can understand that a prepayment meter can be changed to a credit meter as described in the link but I don't see how a standard credit meter can be changed to a prepayment meter.

Having thought a bit more about it, I guess it can be done online. You pay by card and they apply the credit to your account. Maybe that's how it works, does anybody know?

Peter

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Oven Man on 09/11/2022 21:55:04:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/11/2022 21:44:39:

This appears to be a recent explanation: **LINK**

https://www.uswitch.com/gas-electricity/guides/prepayment-meters/

MichaelG.

Thanks for that Michael. I can understand that a prepayment meter can be changed to a credit meter as described in the link but I don't see how a standard credit meter can be changed to a prepayment meter.

Having thought a bit more about it, I guess it can be done online. You pay by card and they apply the credit to your account. Maybe that's how it works, does anybody know?

Peter

Yes, that's basically the way it works – see **LINK** for example.

Robin.

[JellyParticipant @jelly]

Posted by Oven Man on 09/11/2022 21:55:04:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/11/2022 21:44:39:

This appears to be a recent explanation: **LINK**

https://www.uswitch.com/gas-electricity/guides/prepayment-meters/

MichaelG.

Thanks for that Michael. I can understand that a prepayment meter can be changed to a credit meter as described in the link but I don't see how a standard credit meter can be changed to a prepayment meter.

Having thought a bit more about it, I guess it can be done online. You pay by card and they apply the credit to your account. Maybe that's how it works, does anybody know?

Peter

I believe you have hit the nail on the head.

You can also take a card issued by the electricity supplier to a shop with a "PayPoint" kiosk and pay cash, if you're not online.

 

Either way, if you're unaware of the change until your power cuts out, it does seem like a rather unwelcome surprise, executed with the sort of infuriatingly indifferent cruelty that only a large faceless organisation can achieve.

Edited By Jelly on 09/11/2022 22:09:40

[Oven ManParticipant @ovenman]

Thank you Robin and Jelly. Yes of course, it's the same way as my PAYG mobile phone top up works.

Peter

[Robin GrahamParticipant @robingraham42208]

Posted by Maurice Taylor on 09/11/2022 20:28:11:

Hi **LINK**

Have a look at the above link.

Maurice

 

That's interesting Maurice. Since looking at your link I've tried, and so far failed, to find out how exactly Smart Energy GB is funded.

Their advertising is, to say the least, tendentious. Although they are a 'not for profit' organisation and, according to their own account, they exist purely to educate the public, they don't discuss potential downsides for the consumer. I don't believe for a moment that they aren't driven by the profit motive at some level. Nowt wrong with that, but more transparency would be welcome.

There's some good stuff about policy/history on the Government website .

Robin

Edited By Robin Graham on 09/11/2022 22:35:50

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Robin

The following link indicates Government backed which I take means funded.

**LINK**

Emgee

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

Posted by Robin Graham on 09/11/2022 20:26:20:

If you need to replace your old-style meter because it’s unsafe, you might not be able to refuse a smart meter. This is because not many old-style meters are made now – your supplier might not have any in stock.

It depends who your supplier is, Robin:

https://www.bes.co.uk/natural-gas-lpg/gas/meter/

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