Windows 10 forced upgrade

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Semi tracking – looking where people go and identifying them has had major improvements in recent years. One way was a unique string of cookies, now browsers offer persistent storage for the types that did that. It'll probably evolve even further over time. All down to browsers and nothing to do with the OS but that could do a much better job of it.

Email's have a problem if people open them in full html. They just access a directory on some server that is unique to that particular email. If the directory has been accessed they know it's been read or at least opened. Spammers make a lot of use of this as well. The usual trick is to load an image from the remote server or if a paypal etc spoof load images from paypal or who ever.

John

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Edited By Ajohnw on 18/05/2016 00:15:29

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

My 2cents

One of my pooters tried to force me to "upgrade" Win 8.1 to 10 but the other has never bothered me

The difference seems to be my browser(Firefox 27.01) I don't ever get nagged with it, when I used Internet Explorer it was a nightmare trying to stop it upgrading

[Bernard WrightParticipant @bernardwright25932]

Does anyone use SpyBotS&D (Search & Destroy), and its sister AntiBeacon?

Bernard

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Posted by Vic on 17/05/2016 20:06:59

I've seen dozens of documents not display properly even within the same company just because they were using a different version of word or using an unavailable font. I kept telling the bosses not to send customers word documents and eventually the penny dropped and they started sending PDF files, problem solved. You do however need a proper PDF generator like Acrobat not some Mickey Mouse "PDF printer".

I've actually found that, of the free ones, CutePDF does a pretty good job. It used to be the default pdf printer for most folk at work before I retired.

[VicParticipant @vic]

its worth pointing out that Microsoft have never been keen on the PDF format so have never really supported it. Apple in contrast have had it built into their OS for many years. Although 80% of desktops where I used to work were Windows machines PDF generation was always done on one of the Macs. Adobe InDesign files were exported to PDF with Acrobat and MS office documents were exported with the Mac OS. PDF has been an accepted and widely used standard in the print industry for many years but even as a home user I've had no problems exporting OpenOffice documents to PDF with the Mac OS. I'm glad you've found a solution that works for you peak4.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by peak4 on 18/05/2016 01:22:11:

Posted by Vic on 17/05/2016 20:06:59

I've seen dozens of documents not display properly even within the same company just because they were using a different version of word or using an unavailable font. I kept telling the bosses not to send customers word documents and eventually the penny dropped and they started sending PDF files, problem solved. You do however need a proper PDF generator like Acrobat not some Mickey Mouse "PDF printer".

I've actually found that, of the free ones, CutePDF does a pretty good job. It used to be the default pdf printer for most folk at work before I retired.

Must admit I can't see any problems with using something that generates a pdf via print, It's a logical place to put it as many apps do print. Also as surprising as it might seem pdf's are vaguely related to a printer language anyway. Ripped off from Unix a long time ago.

Personally I would much rather print a djvu but as my printed pdf's are generally fairly small it doesn't matter that much anyway as there is no need to search them.

John

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[ANDY CAWLEYParticipant @andycawley24921]

Just over a week ago W10 forced its way onto my computer two days before I went on a three week holiday. Needless to say there were all sorts of problems associated with the normally simple tasks that I carry out on my computer. I wasted several hours trying to do stuff that normally takes minutes and even then I did not manage to do all the stuff that was needed before I went on holiday. I use Office 365 and surprisingly that seemed to be the root of my problems that and copying files to different locations. My nephew, bless him, who usually helps me out in extemis, said " Bring the box round to me, go on holiday and when you get back it will be fixed. "

Phew! Arn't I jammy.

OK so Microsoft need an updated system for various reasons and I was going to up grade at a time of my choosing but what makes me really angry is that they arrogantly steal my precious time at a most inconvenient moment.

GRRRR,😡😩

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Some one once did some sums on how much time MS have wasted world wide in total – no idea where it is now or how accurate but the number was enormous. It does keep support people in a job though.

John

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Edited By Ajohnw on 18/05/2016 10:51:36

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

I've heard that starting some time in July the Win10 upgrades will incur a charge of something like £90, so if you are considering upgrading then a free forced upgrade could be a mixed blessing.

[Harry WilkesParticipant @harrywilkes58467]

Posted by Gary Wooding on 18/05/2016 10:50:31:

I've heard that starting some time in July the Win10 upgrades will incur a charge of something like £90, so if you are considering upgrading then a free forced upgrade could be a mixed blessing.

Gary your quite right about a charge being introduced link

H

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Posted by John Haine on 17/05/2016 12:06:03:

Duncan, I managed to avoid this free "upgrade", and have found a utility that can be had for free here that stops Win7 from downloading and running the updates. They want you to change because they want to stop supporting Win7 in terms of security patches etc at some point. (And there may be more nefarious reasons too.)

Just repeating myself in an attempt to stop this discussion meandering on. Download this free utility, install it, and you won't be bothered.

[SandgrounderParticipant @sandgrounder]

Posted by John Haine on 18/05/2016 11:03:02:

Posted by John Haine on 17/05/2016 12:06:03:

They want you to change because they want to stop supporting Win7 in terms of security patches etc at some point. (And there may be more nefarious reasons too.)

Windows 7 mainstream support stopped last year but extended support will go on to 2020.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Given that GWX _control_panel.exe currently provides the solution to the WIn_10 problem

… May I be permitted a slight digression ?

I have two Samsung laptops, both running [?] 'Win_7 Ultimate'

Both are currently struggling to communicate with the Windows Update service:

Typically; it takes hours or days to check for updates, and even longer to download them.

Both machines currently have about 40 updates listed, but not downloadable.

I have been running 'Resource Monitor' to see what [little] is happening … The 'Network' graph is auto-scaling to 10 Kbps, and typical values are 2-5 … To all practical purposes, this is near-zero.

The performance is similar whether I am using WiFi or the Cat5 cable … and the problem ONLY occurs when using Windows Update or Microsoft Update [I have tried both, and have run all the 'fixes' I can find] … normal internet usage is fine.

Any advice, please ?

MichaelG.

.

P.S. … For preference, I use my Macs & iPad,

but I do need to retain a Win_7 environment.

[opochkaParticipant @opochka]

I have set my computers to ….. Do not download updates…Do not check for downloads and updates.

I have not been bothered by Microsoft so far ……

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 18/05/2016 12:36:35:

Given that GWX _control_panel.exe currently provides the solution to the WIn_10 problem

… May I be permitted a slight digression ?

I have two Samsung laptops, both running [?] 'Win_7 Ultimate'

Both are currently struggling to communicate with the Windows Update service:

Typically; it takes hours or days to check for updates, and even longer to download them.

Any advice, please ?

MichaelG.

.

P.S. … For preference, I use my Macs & iPad,

but I do need to retain a Win_7 environment.

Have you thought about running Windows 7 on your Mac? I've read that in some cases Windows runs faster on a Mac than natively on a PC. Just a thought.

The printer language you're thinking of Ajohn is Postcript which is built into the Mac OS. Apart from Windows all the other popular operating systems seem to be UNIX based. Mac OSX, IOS, Andriod, Linux etc.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Vic on 18/05/2016 14:25:54:

Have you thought about running Windows 7 on your Mac? I've read that in some cases Windows runs faster on a Mac than natively on a PC. Just a thought.

.

Vic,

Thanks for the thought, but … after my last experience of installing a Microsoft product onto the Mac, I swore I would never contemplate doing it again.

This is not the place to dicuss the gory details, but it was a lesson to me.

MichaelG.

.

P.S. … Strangely enough; the Win_7 machine had a burst of activity this afternnoon, and suddenly downloaded and installed 31 updates. Although no-one has advised me as to what might be wrong; it seems that the mere act of asking the question on this forum has improved things …. which is rather Spooky

[Martin 100Participant @martin100]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 18/05/2016 12:36:35:

Given that GWX _control_panel.exe currently provides the solution to the WIn_10 problem

… May I be permitted a slight digression ?

I have two Samsung laptops, both running [?] 'Win_7 Ultimate'

Both are currently struggling to communicate with the Windows Update service:

Typically; it takes hours or days to check for updates, and even longer to download them.

Given they are both laptops I'd be tempted to alter the power saving / power down settings, cable it to the net and let it download and install 'everything' it wishes (with the Win 10 exclusions checked in GWX)

I mention this on the basis of similar problems I've had with IBM/Lenovo laptops and Samsung Netbooks in the past when a big backlog has occurred after a few weeks offline or with updates disabled.

Unless you are totally offline then disabling all windows updates 'forever' is the guaranteed route to big problems in the future. The security patches are there for a very good reason.

I know from experience many years ago with a security hole on Windows 2000, the time it took to download a service pack of about 80-100MB over a 64kbps link, was actually less than the time for the machine to be infected by a random attack. That was with a brand new windows 2000 installation, from a sealed CD with no subsequent user activity whatsoever, just an internet connection downloading the service pack from Microsofts own FTP site.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Martin 100 on 18/05/2016 17:08:41:

Given they are both laptops I'd be tempted to alter the power saving / power down settings, cable it to the net and let it download and install 'everything' it wishes (with the Win 10 exclusions checked in GWX)

.

Thanks for that, Martin

I sat for several hours yesterday, with the laptop on my knee and the Cat5 cable plugged-in … watching what was [not] happening.

Given the timing of your mesage, it may be that you haven't seen the P.S. on my reply to Vic.

As if by magic, suddenly it all worked as it should … I can only assume that he Micro$oft server suddenly decided it was my turn !!

MichaelG.

[VicParticipant @vic]

As MS are apparently using p2p they were probably waiting for your next door neighbor to turn on his PC!

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Vic on 18/05/2016 18:56:20:

As MS are apparently using p2p they were probably waiting for your next door neighbor to turn on his PC!

.

… Might be some truth in that

PC_1 completed its updates, so [fired with new-found enthusiasm] I tried PC_2, which has just sat there all evening, and downloaded zilch.

MichaelG.

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 18/05/2016 17:02:11:

 

…..it seems that the mere act of asking the question on this forum has improved things …. which is rather Spooky

 

 

Spooky action at a distance. It seems you've become entangled with Microsoft. Scary!

Edited By Bandersnatch on 18/05/2016 22:26:22

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Posted by Gary Wooding on 18/05/2016 10:50:31:

I've heard that starting some time in July the Win10 upgrades will incur a charge of something like £90, so if you are considering upgrading then a free forced upgrade could be a mixed blessing.

I can't remember the complete details (it's the second thing to go) but it seems to me when I wandered off the straight and narrow a while back and fooled around with the Win-10 free upgrade, one of the options was to download the files for a completely fresh install. This I did because I wanted to try it out by installing it on a completely separate machine rather than risking my (reasonably satisfactory) Win-8.1 installation.

[ I did that but canned it when I realised that I'd have to go through months of figuring out where they put things this time and tweaking Microsoft's prohibitively "cautious" security settings to get back to some semblance control of my machine. That news of Microsoft's default privacy excesses was leaking out at the time didn't help either. ]

Because of this, I believe I have (somewhere) the fresh install files saved which presumably means I don't have to pay at a later date if I have a change of heart. Perhaps someone else remembers the details of this better than I. It may also be that the full install files were only available to Windows-8 users (but I don't know).

Then again, my memory really is atrocious these days so I could have imagined the whole thing or be remembering the Windows-8 upgrade.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Unless you are totally offline then disabling all windows updates 'forever' is the guaranteed route to big problems in the future.

Well it must be a long way in the future

I stopped everything upgrading from 2005

XP pro rules!

[OuBallieParticipant @ouballie]

Anyone wanting to make absolutely sure MS does not force W10 on you, get:

Never10 from GRC.com

Geoff – My days of MS grief ended in 2007/8, hip hip ^*% hooray!

[Nick HughesParticipant @nickhughes97026]

Posted by Steve Withnell on 17/05/2016 19:39:07:

I updated our machines to Windows 10 + the installed version of Office. It all works very well and I have to say well done. However. The Windows 10 updates are heavy duty – the biggest was 5GB+ and you have to take them. These GB sized 'updates' look like every other month.

You cannot un-install Internet Explorer. You can disable it, but it still gets the mandatory updates and grabs a 5MB cache from somewhere.

I've already related that my Dad's 'free' broadband is now £10 a month because the W10 updates alone, breach his usage cap twice a quarter.

Another sneaky trick is that the updates try to avoid using the MS servers. So you can get your update from my machine on a P2P basis (not now you can't – switched that off that 'feature' off). On the plus side, if the update has hit my laptop, other machines on the local network don't need to download updates across the broadband connection.

At least MS promise not to read the content of your eMails (well they did last year…).

Steve

 

Hi Steve,

Have a look in W10 Settings – Network & internet – WiFi – Advanced Options. There is an option for Metered Connection that may help your father.

Nick.

Edited By Nick Hughes on 22/05/2016 11:48:19

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