The UK Space Program (Its not NASA, its NONO)

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Looks like a large pile of scrap to me, but what do I know

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Black Arrow: UK space rocket returns home from Australia

The UK's only rocket to successfully launch a satellite into orbit is to be unveiled in Scotland after a 10,000-mile journey back home.

The Black Arrow projectile had lain at its crash landing site in the South Australian outback for 48 years.

Over time it was damaged by extreme weather and vandalism before space technology firm Skyrora stepped in.

The historic rocket is set to go on display in Penicuik, Midlothian, later this month.

Daniel Smith, director at Skyrora, said: "This is quite feasibly the most important artefact linked to the UK's space history.

"While our engineers have been working on our own launches, our STEM ambassadors have been arranging all of this in the background."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46938858

Edited By Ady1 on 22/01/2019 11:52:44

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Defnitely a tearoom subject at the moment

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Posted by Ady1 on 22/01/2019 11:52:20:

Daniel Smith, director at Skyrora, said: "This is quite feasibly the most important artefact linked to the UK's space history.

That's like saying the pizza delivery van is the most important culinary achievement in UK food history.
The UK has for a long time and still does build satellites – they just don't leave them lying around at ground level. The only bits left are the development models etc and funnily enough I was just looking yesterday at the thermal model of the Intelsat V beacon assembly – a lump of aluminium that has been in my 'useful bits' box for 40 years.

[Andy CarruthersParticipant @andycarruthers33275]

A monument to the only country to establish a space launch capability then give it up

Shockingly bad decision along with cancelling TSR2

[Tim ChambersParticipant @timchambers76147]

Funny how the Americans withdrew their offer to launch satellites for us just after it was cancelled.

Edited By Tim Chambers on 22/01/2019 14:37:40

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Just the same as the US climbed in with M-D F4 Phantom and the 111 swing wing when the then UK "government" cancelled TSR2.

[Phil WhitleyParticipant @philwhitley94135]

It all started when Werner von Braun was "invited" to live and work in America!

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

On the plus side, at least Wilson kept us out of Vietnam

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

It looks like SpaceX were not the first to land a launcher on its tail, although it seems they have finessed the art a bit.

N.

[Andy CarruthersParticipant @andycarruthers33275]

Practice makes perfect

I have to hand it to Elon Musk, totally inspiring engineering achievements

Such a shame we (in the UK) innovate, develop then discard technology, let's hope SABRE https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SABRE_(rocket_engine) doesnt go the same way

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Sadly, the Brits seem to be good innovators, but for some reason lack the sense to develop and exploit the invention, and either give it away (Gas Turbines etc) or we allow industrial espionage to make us pay royalties for using our own inventions.

Maybe someone thinks that it makes economic sense, that way;. I don't, but am only an Engineer.

If Britain had been paid royalties on all the inventions that we have given to the world, WE would own Europe, not the other way round!

Howard

[vintage engineerParticipant @vintageengineer]

Blame the politicians! They have always cocked anything that makes a profit!

Posted by Howard Lewis on 23/01/2019 15:12:42:

Sadly, the Brits seem to be good innovators, but for some reason lack the sense to develop and exploit the invention, and either give it away (Gas Turbines etc) or we allow industrial espionage to make us pay royalties for using our own inventions.

Maybe someone thinks that it makes economic sense, that way;. I don't, but am only an Engineer.

If Britain had been paid royalties on all the inventions that we have given to the world, WE would own Europe, not the other way round!

Howard

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Howard, one of the reasons that British companies often failed to follow through with their innovations was sometimes down to poor management lacking the necessary foresight and more importantly letting accountants run engineering companies, they are too preoccupied with balance sheets and fail to see that taking risks can pay off.

Dave W

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Should manufacturers make things, then make people believe that they need it, or should industry hang around waiting for someone to ask for an item to be made. Take aviation, Douglas built the DC-3, and got the airlines to buy it, starting with TWA, meanwhile in the UK the airlines produced their ideas, and industry built them, very small numbers, and no sales to other airlines, such aircraft as the Handley Page H.P. 42, 8 built, Armstrong Whitworth A.W. 15 Atlanta, 8 built, and similar things happened after the war with the likes of the VC-10, and Trident, all left behind by the Boeing 707, 737, and 747.

With the first order for the DC-2 with TWA Douglas lost 1/4 of a million $ because the quoted price was on the smaller DC-1, but TWA came back with modifications that added up to a new design, but Douglas knew it would win in the long run.

Sometimes caution is best overlooked in industry, sometimes you have to innovate, perhaps if Sinclare (spelling?) had been around to invent his electric car now, he might have got it up and running.

Ian S C

[RMAParticipant @rma]

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but the UK does have a space program, well indirectly. It's in India and we pump millions into their economy via foreign aid! Can't afford to do things here!

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

British Leyland summed up "British Management" for me, shocking

Then foreign car management arrives and cranks out huge numbers of decent cars year after year after year with the same workforce

If there's a war we get it together and use sensible common sense people, very organised

But If it's peacetime… well look at the muppet show trying to run things at the moment

It's in the genes, you can't dodge darwinism

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Blue Streak => Black Knight => Black Arrow

… Some of this used to be secret, but Wikipedia has a good set of pages now.

MichaelG.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Ian, one reason that the British aviation industry failed dismally with selling transport aircraft post the Second World War was there was an agreement during the war that America would concentrate resources on designing and building transport aircraft whereas the UK would focus on fighter and bomber aircraft. There was an expectation that post war the countries would co-operate with each other on the way forward with aviation development, but that didn’t happen, the US refused to co-operate technically. This attitude prevailed with the future development of nuclear weapons, British scientists were prevented from acquiring any of the data gathered during the development of the Bomb, even though their contribution had been critical to its success. The UK government realised that the only way they could sit at the table with the other major players was to go it alone and develop their own bomb, this proved to be excruciatingly expensive and as the country was already on its knees financially and virtually bankrupted the country. As a consequence there was virtually no finance available for aviation development and with the Americans deciding to not co-operate, and in fact aggressively marketing their own subsidised aircraft designs, British aerospace companies struggled to finance their products but despite this handicap came up with brilliant designs, Comet and VC10 where just two examples. There were problems with sales due to cost, British aircraft usually cost more than their American counterparts, this was due in some respects to the fact that British Aerospace companies built their products using apprentice trained labour, the Americans favoured using semi skilled operatives who were trained to carry out basic functions, these operatives had no concept of what consequences deviation from the original specification could produce. I worked as a Non Destructive Test Technician on Hercules and Phantom aircraft plotting a multitude of defects(related to poor manufacturing practices) in order that repairs could be carried out.

I was in the Air Force at the time that the TSR2 was undergoing trials, it was for its time an outstanding aircraft but not without teething problems which would have been overcome during its prototype development. Probably the major reason for its cancellation was finance, the government were desperately short of money, a product of the austerity brought about by the Second World War. Subsequently it was decided to go with the F111 which was deemed to be cheaper, thankfully we cancelled that and it never came into service with RAF although the Royal Australian Air Force had to put up with it.

Dave W

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Drifting off into politics again.

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