Question on gas bottles

[RainbowsParticipant @rainbows]

If I buy a calor gas bottle off ebay and take it to a calor gas dealer will they refill it or do I need proof I am the person who originally rented it from calor?

[RainbowsParticipant @rainbows]

[NJHParticipant @njh]

I understand that gas bottles are only rented so it is reasonable to expect that they may well want evidence of your contract before offering a refill.

Norman

[Bob RodgersonParticipant @bobrodgerson97362]

I would think you will be OK. I bought a 27KG bottle way back in 1981 and have the original receipt from Calor somewhere but in the last thirty odd years I have never been asked for proof of ownership.

Oxygen and Acetylene bottles are somewhat different and I wouldn't even think about attempting to buy a bottle from someone off EBay.

[Ex contributorParticipant @mgnbuk]

Other suppliers of bottled LPG are available – before I fitted a refillable bottle to my motorhome I used to get Flogas bottled propane from a local plant hire shop – half the price of Calor, no rental agreement & no need to take an empty bottle in to take a full bottle out.

May be an option worth investigating in your locality ?

Nigel B

[Mark P.Participant @markp]

I have 3 Calor gas cylinders 2 47kg and a 6 kg all given to me,Calor exchange them with no question.
Mark P.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Talking of gas, what's the best option for argon and argon mix these days in the UK?

IIRC, the cartel that is BOC, Air Liquide and Air Products (who owns who these days?) have the market pretty well stitched up, so you have to hire their bottles at industrial prices – either that or pay through the nose for hobby-sized bottles from one of the smaller outfits. I see that Air Liquide do "rent free" small bottles but presumably at hellish prices with filthy big deposits.

In Canada / US you can buy your own bottles or acquire one for a modest deposit and just nip along to get them refilled as and when. Much simpler and cheaper.

Murray

[Gray62Participant @gray62]

Murray, there are several suppliers of 'rent free' bottles, I've used adams gas in the past for argon mix, you pay a deposit but get it back in full if you return the bottle, refills are not too badly priced. I've recently switched to gasuk for my argon and argon mix as they will supply the larger bottles whereas adams will only supply large bottle to trade users and with tig I get through more gas nowadays as it is my mainstay for welding. The only thing to watch out for with GasUK is they reduce the amount you get back on the deposit over extended time periods so read the small print carefully if you are not a volume user.

[Harry WilkesParticipant @harrywilkes58467]

In theory you only need a receipt if you are surrendering the cylinder and want your deposit returned, that said I dought if they even bother with that these days as so many people just scrap the unwanted cylinders.

H

[SteambuffParticipant @steambuff]

I purchased a second hand Calor bottle (empty) and I have had no problems having it filled (exchanged) – No questions were asked.

Dave

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

Posted by Harry Wilkes on 25/05/2016 21:01:16:

so many people just scrap the unwanted cylinders.

H

Or turn them into small woodburners for the workshop…..

[SpurryParticipant @spurry]

Posted by Muzzer on 25/05/2016 20:41:10:

Talking of gas, what's the best option for argon and argon mix these days in the UK? Murray

I get on quite well with these cylinders without rental.HTH

Pete

**LINK**

[Mike PooleParticipant @mikepoole82104]

A useful point to know is that they will exchange butane for propane and vice versa, check on calor site for which sizes exchange. I have never bought a bottle but refill or exchange is no problem.

Mike

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, you shouldn't have any trouble exchanging an empty one for a full one, but as Harry Wilkes has pointed out, that if you no longer need it and return it to a Calor agent, you will not get a refunded deposit without proof of paying one in the first instance.

Regards Nick.

[FatgadgiParticipant @fatgadgi]

Hey Murray

Like Graeme, I use Adams Gas for my pure argon.

You pay a deposit for the bottle the first time, then just for the gas. Sizes versus prices are on the net, but the saving is because there is no rental charge.

Only problem with them is that the stockists are spread thinly and it's best to ring before travelling as not all og them have the full range.

I also have a BOC account and occasionally I have used Argon from them (when I've been caught short) on short term rental, which doesn't work out too expensive if you return it quickly.

AND …. to get back on track, I have never been asked for Calor proof, it's just exchanged without question.

Cheers – Will

[Marcus BowmanParticipant @marcusbowman28936]

Or there's Hobby Weld, who sell bottles and gas. One payment for the bottle, then you just pay for the refill each time. Argon; Argon-CO2 mix; oxygen; etc. Lots of stockists.

Marcus

[Marcus BowmanParticipant @marcusbowman28936]

Calor bottles are paid for by a deposit, but the amount you get back reduces sharply as time goes on. After 3 years there is no residual return value. No problem filling any Calor bottle though. I've never been asked for ID or proof of purchase.

Marcus

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

Before buying a bottle off e bay or a boot sale check the the price of a refill,the small bottles are really expensive to refill,the gas per kilo gets cheaper as the bottle size increases. Flogas is a bit cheaper than Calor but not so many outlets, though the number of calor outlets is getting smaller in our area as the rural village shops still keep closing.Calour outlets are supposed to exchange bottles of the same size,though our village shop (now closed) would exchange for a different size. Apart from a blow lamp I use propane as fuel for my two Gardner hot tube gas engines,and sometimes the bottle gets to about half full and the engine stops,change bottles and away it goes again, this has happened a few times so I always take two bottles to a show, I switched from calor to flogas and had no problems.I spoken to a couple of dealers over the years and they had trouble with come customers gas powered fork lifts,half full and they will not start until bottle changed and some very new gas cookers can play up. I do wonder if the bottles are checked and drained of any condensate before refilling,because loads of bottles are left unused very often with the valve left open out in the weather and unwanted ,then end up on ebay or similar sale.The bottles that won't fire up an engine are no problem when used for a blow lamp.

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

Posted by Muzzer on 25/05/2016 20:41:10:

Talking of gas, what's the best option for argon and argon mix these days in the UK?

IIRC, the cartel that is BOC, Air Liquide and Air Products (who owns who these days?) have the market pretty well stitched up, so you have to hire their bottles at industrial prices – either that or pay through the nose for hobby-sized bottles from one of the smaller outfits. I see that Air Liquide do "rent free" small bottles but presumably at hellish prices with filthy big deposits.

In Canada / US you can buy your own bottles or acquire one for a modest deposit and just nip along to get them refilled as and when. Much simpler and cheaper.

Murray

Hi Murray,

I've been using Ray Nash for pure argon – I had to buy a bottle from him, which he refills when required. Very fast and cost effective service. I just place the empty bottle in the wooden box he supplied and send it off. I'm just a satisfied customer.

He can be contacted at:

Green Lane Cottage, Coombe, St.Austell, Cornwall, PL26 7LP. Tel: 01726 882615, email: ray@coombe999.freeserve.co.uk

[pgk pgkParticipant @pgkpgk17461]

Local scrappy has loads of bottles – different sizes and brands rattling about – you can bid him down on to less than a tenner. However local 'Budget' supplier is happy to provide new customers with a rent free bottle he puts down as a customer switching from a different brand. I understand calor owns budget just as a cheaper subsidiary??

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Spurry on 25/05/2016 21:13:24:

Posted by Muzzer on 25/05/2016 20:41:10:

Talking of gas, what's the best option for argon and argon mix these days in the UK? Murray

I get on quite well with these cylinders without rental.HTH

Pete

**LINK**

Spurry

How much was the initial deposit / purchase cost? It has a fancy pressure and flow regulator which can't come cheap. And how much is a refill / what size bottle are you using?

Murray

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Ryval (new to me) sell the 10 litre (BOC "X" size) pure argon for £40, £50 deposit, £20 shipping (next day) and £12 vat. The 5% CO2 mix for MIG/MAG is £5 cheaper.

Gas-uk.co.uk charge £35 for the same 10 litre size pure argon, plus £50 deposit, £10 delivery and £9 vat. However, they do a nice big 30 litre bottle for £60, £120 deposit, £26 delivery and £17 vat. Much better deal. Cylinder collection is £12 unless you live near St Helens.

As pointed out, Gas-uk gobble your deposit which skews the numbers:

(a) for “SuperMaxx” and “Balloon Gas” Cylinders only: (i) if you return the Cylinder to us within [six] months, we will refund [100%] of the Deposit; and (ii) if you return the Cylinder within [12] months, we will refund [50%] of the Deposit; and, after [12] months, you must return the Cylinder to us in any event and we will not refund the Deposit.

(b) for all other Cylinders: (i) if you return the Cylinder to us within [12] months, we will refund [100%] of the Deposit; (ii) if within [12 to 18] months, [80%] of the Deposit; (iii) if within [18 to 24] months, [50%] of the Deposit; (iv) if within [24 to 36] months, [30%] of the Deposit; and if you return the Cylinder after [36] months, we will not refund the Deposit.

Murray

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