New to brazing and soldering during lockdown?

[shaun meakin 1Participant @shaunmeakin1]

During these times of isolation and lockdown we are being encouraged to learn a new skill, be that a foreign language or, say, juggling (??). From the number of starter pack orders we have received lately it looks like several are taking up brazing, whether that be a new model engineer or hobbyist. Great news I feel. We at CuP Alloys have always tried to develop new ideas to support the hobbyist, whether it be attending exhibitions, having special offers like last week or just offering good, old fashioned advice. We have therefore looked at packages for those wanting to try brazing. We now have on the website http://www.cupalloys.co.uk an EF Starter Package consisting of the EF Starter Pack with the Brazing Handbook by Keith Hale priced £30, a saving of over £4 if bought separately. We are also considering other packages, eg Starter Package 2 an EF Starter Package plus a Sievertt 2197 Professional Torch Kit. Or Starter Package 3 as Starter Package 2 but with a brazing hearth and frame. If these are of interest or if you require any advice or recommendations please do not hesitate to contact us on 01623 707955.

[shaun meakin 1Participant @shaunmeakin1]

[Jon CameronParticipant @joncameron26580]

Hi

I have a lot of steel components that will need brazing together for my traction engine build, (the boiler is done already by previous owner). So I would be interested in learning more of a starter kit where I can braze steel together, be it with silver solder or other brazing rods. Plus the right size nozzle for heating steel, from what i've read and learned steel needs to be nearly red heat to take solder, that takes a lot of heating, and insulation, or a bronze rod, (might be brass but you guys would know) can be used at a lower heating temperature but at greater expense per rod.

Anyhow i'm rambling.

Regards

Jon

Jon

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Jon, have a laugh at xynudu’s latest video – trying to melt some braze(?) with a reeeally hot flame, but not enough heat. Bang good will love him for pointing out the shortfalls of their cheap trash (for an application such as that).

[IanTParticipant @iant]

You don't mention how large your traction engine steel parts are Jon – but I imagine they might be fairly large.

However, you have things a bit muddled with regards to brazing materials. Silver brazing can be done at a lower temperature than SIF bronzing (e.g. Brass) but SIF bronze rod is very much cheaper than Silver Solder. For larger steel components, some form of welding may be more suitable though.

Regards,

IanT

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Posted by not done it yet on 14/05/2020 12:15:01:

Jon, have a laugh at xynudu’s latest video – trying to melt some braze(?) with a reeeally hot flame, but not enough heat. Bang good will love him for pointing out the shortfalls of their cheap trash (for an application such as that).

Well NDIY holding the parts in a large vice and pliers (both excellent heat sinks) really didn't help him too much either…but still the wrong tool for that job.

IanT

Edited By IanT on 14/05/2020 12:34:41

[David George 1Participant @davidgeorge1]

Hi I found these insulation plates on a jewelry web site and found them excellent to hold the heat for silver soldering https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/square-soldering-boards no connection but you can make a decent large hearth with them. I bought all three sizes.

[Jon CameronParticipant @joncameron26580]

Posted by not done it yet on 14/05/2020 12:15:01:

Jon, have a laugh at xynudu’s latest video – trying to melt some braze(?) with a reeeally hot flame, but not enough heat. Bang good will love him for pointing out the shortfalls of their cheap trash (for an application such as that).

I'll have to go see that one. Have you per chance a link to the video?

Ian I am aware that holding steel parts in larger steel parts isn't really a good idea for brazing, as the heat is sapped away.

The parts I want to braze are for a 2" traction engine, there 3mm thick at most.

[Ian WelfordParticipant @ianwelford58739]

Can I just say a very big thank you for the speed of delivery and help on the phone ordering my brazing hearth. I have plenty of rods etc from your good selves , last Doncaster show but having bodged about needed a hearth.

Stay safe

Ian

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Well I have SIF bronzed 3mm steel Jon – but then I don't build 1/6th scale models that are about 3ft long, 2ft tall and weigh about 150 lbs! (I can pick mine up – albeit some need both hands!)

So much depends on the size of the work you are considering and I know very little about the detail of traction engines and what might need fabrication. With the right kit you can braze most things but that kit can come at a cost.

We go around this subject here every now and then and different folk have different opinions – most likely because they are trying to do different things. This was discussed again (most recently) here:

ME Forum – Brazing Torch

Have a read through this and see if it helps at least point you in a general direction.

Regards,

IanT

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

I can vouch for CuP Alloy's service – having just bought a hearth, book and silver-solder from them.

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by not done it yet on 14/05/2020 12:15:01:

Jon, have a laugh at xynudu’s latest video – trying to melt some braze(?) with a reeeally hot flame, but not enough heat. Bang good will love him for pointing out the shortfalls of their cheap trash (for an application such as that).

Now, with info from a jeweller, this device is transformed heat-wise. Using ethanol/acetone in the bubbler adds a huge amount of fuel to the flame, allowing easier brazing – and likely sufficient heat to do the job he was attempting.

Question now arises as to whether bubbling propane through such a mixture would add capability to a smaller burner?

Both ethanol and acetone contain oxygen within the molecule to help with combustion. Perhaps we should be rather careful on the safety, but any discussion might help some get more out of their kit – and be safe.

Latest xynudu vid on subject

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