Greenly’s Halton Tank

[David Bennett 1Participant @davidbennett1]

The Museum at the RAF Base in Buckinghamshire includes the activities of the Engineering Apprentices trained there. Henry Greenly designed a 4-6-4 tank loco for them to test their skills. However the Museum has no information about it apart from some tatty drawings and a few parts.

So I am looking for help to ascertain:

a) Did the apprentices ever complete a loco.

b) If so what happened to it.

c) Where is it now and who has it.

d) Are there any photographs.

I know that other examples have since been built and that one was for sale recently on the internet with photos, but the search is for the original.

Any information would be gratefully received.

David Bennett

[David Bennett 1Participant @davidbennett1]

[julian atkinsParticipant @julianatkins58923]

Hi David,

The original construction of the Halton tank was covered in ME at the time with lots of pics.

The SMLS at BeechHurst Haywards Heath has a particularly fine example, after lots of work, and a considerable improvement on the original Greenly design. I've driven it quite a few times many years ago.

Cheers,

Julian

[Bob YouldonParticipant @bobyouldon45599]

Good evening David and Julian

The SMLS Beechhurst locomotive, "Wharfdale" was presented to the society as a club locomotive in the early fifties; it's had a couple of major overhauls etc and it still earns it's keep regularly on passenger hauling duties, It was certainly built to last and interestingly its still running on the original riveted and soft soldered boiler; It always reminds me of a Great Dane, a great big slobbery thing!

Regards,

Bob

[David Bennett 1Participant @davidbennett1]

Thank you, Julian and Bob.

I did write about my quest to ME Editor Diane quite some weeks ago but no response so far. I will try to find the ME articles mentioned which could provide something for the Museum to display. I am assuming that 'Wharfdale' is not the original.

So my quest goes on.

David Bennett

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

I have a picture of the presentation ceremony that Bob mentions.

It was the first steam engine I ever got to drive back on boxing day in 1984. I seem to remember being bewildered as someone said "The regulator is that big one in the middle!". I won't forget that moment. Happy days.

Edited By Andy Ash on 01/10/2016 00:06:43

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

O.K. So I finally managed to get my OCR software working……

The image above comes from a booklet produced by the SMLS in 1976 charting the first 25 years of the miniature railway at Beech Hurst. To be honest, if you read through it, it's a bit like a who's who of the model engineering hobby. Indeed the inside rear cover is a poem recited by Edgar. T. Westbury at the 1966 Christmas dinner.

From this booklet I have extracted the following excerpt;

"In Chapter 2 the gift of the late Mr. W. M. Hebblethwait's locomotive was mentioned, it is now time to finish the story of this episode.

The locomotive had been under construction for about 10 years and was very nearly complete. As is well known, it is an example of the Henry Greenly design of 1930 which was evolved as a training exercise for the R.A.F. apprentices at the training school at Halton.

What is not so well known is that the builder did not want to incorporate the Greenly valve gear of the original and therefore replaced this with a Walschaerts' gear designed for him by Mr. E. A. Steel, thus this locomotive is a prototype of the improved design. Items requiring completion were the draincocks, injectors, the fitting of nameplates and painting. K. N. Harris designed the name and maker's plates after consultation with Mr. Lionel Woodhead of Brighton, while Harold Lovell took on the task of completing the mechanical items.

It was decided that the locomotive should be entered in the 1958 "M.E." exhibition by Mrs. Hebblethwaite although it would not be painted; a silver medal was awarded, possibly the first time that this had happened posthumously. After a lot of delay in finding someone to paint the engine, with various changes of plan all was at last ready for a steam trial in May 1959.

Work on the locomotive was finally completed during the following winter, the painting finally being done by a member of the Bassett-Lowke staff in his spare time. The formal presentation ceremony was arranged for July 3rd, 1960, Mrs. Hebblethwaite making a special trip down from Yorkshire for the occasion.

Mr. Whittington presided in the unavoidable absence of the President, handing the silver medal to Mrs. Hebblethwaite who in turn formally presented the engine, which was received by Mr. Ayliffe on behalf of the Society. It was then driven round the track by Harold Lovell in procession with Mr. Brown's 4-6-0, "Hank", Arthur Yendell's "Princess Marina" and others.

The doner was also made an Honorary Life Member.

The fine photograph of the engine which hangs in the Restaurant at Beech Hurst was taken by Jim Ewins, a copy also being given to Harold Lovell in recognition for services rendered."

I can't actually find the reference in Chapter 2, otherwise I'd include it. I don't think Mr Gettings could have said much because it's hard to find.

Obviously it's not explicit, but one could read it that Wharfedale is the engine you are looking for. The quoted text is exactly as it is in the book. You must draw your own conclusions. I think it depends if Mr Hebblethwait had anything to do with the RAF.

The photograph referred in the final para, actually adorned the front of the club newsletter, at least for the years Mike Killick was editor. The quality of the picture on the newsletter was poor, but I think the club might have it in archive. I know they had a pretty large throw-out just a few years back and I understand a lot got thrown away.

Sadly the copy at the restaurant has probably gone too. The original house on the Beech Hurst site which eventually got converted into the restaurant, was demolished when Harvester took over. I doubt they kept the picture taken by Jim Ewins.

I am sure you can still see the actual engine if you write to the club. It is my concious choice not to be a member of the society presently. If I were I would do all I could to help you see it for yourself.

Hope it helps.

Edited By Andy Ash on 01/10/2016 01:54:58

Edited By Andy Ash on 01/10/2016 02:06:57

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Diane was up to her eyebrows in MEX a couple of weeks ago, so I suspect your request may have got lost in the chaos, or she may be planning to put it in postbag.

The Halton Tank design is well know and I think it's history has been touched on in later issues as well as teh original series.

As you can see there was a lot more written about Halton than just Greenly's loco, plus there was an Edgar T. Westbury connexion.

Neil

[David Bennett 1Participant @davidbennett1]

Many thanks Neil,

I did realise how busy you all are but maybe I am getting impatient in my old age as I do want to help the RAF museum whilst I can.

I realise also that there was a lot said about the design when put into the public arena but I need to cover only the events relating to the construction by the Apprentices as that is what the Museum needs. Obviously some reference top later events could be made.

I will contact Chris as he suggests.

Thanks,

David Bennett

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

At the Spalding Model Engineering Show, a couple of years ago, there was a very similar model exhibited, on I think, the Leicester Club stand, in Hall 1.

Howard

[Malcolm Smith 8Participant @malcolmsmith8]

Hy Found this forum by accident but I do have a question about the Halton Tank. Has there ever been a list of named model engines compiled with date of manufacture. Also were the names relevant to each other IE wharfedale, Riverside etc?Regards

[Former MemberParticipant @formermember19781]

[This posting has been removed]

[john bennett 1Participant @johnbennett1]

I had one and i know the southampton club had one as well, great big beast of a thing, i had to buy an hydraulic bike lift to move it around. heres a pic of just before i got it.

and heres one of when i nearly finished it.

the back head was a thing to behold,

sometimes im sorry i got rid of it,but when i can throw my maisie in the car easily and even my maxitrak opal with a little grunt i dont miss it.

[Malcolm Smith 8Participant @malcolmsmith8]

Hy There is one called "Taurus" on youtube . So that makes for in existance. Any more avilable? Regards

[john bennett 1Participant @johnbennett1]

Simon at the steam workshop has one for sale on his page.

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