Drummond loop type pitman

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

Hi to everyone,

Can anyone help me with fitting a loop type pitman to a Drummond treadle please? I have asked on the Drummond forum and got no reply.

This is a picture of the treadle on an M type, taken from Tony Griffith's site,

This is the pitman that I have got:

If I bolt this on tight to the flywheel then it locks up, if loose then it will flop from end to end.

My question is; how do I fit it on please? My scroll bed and M Type pitmans are round topped so have a bush and a bearing respectively which just fit on over the flywheel pin:

Many thanks in anticipation.

Andy

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

How does it fit on?

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

An early example of HSE. If your foot gets under the treadle while it is still spinning you don't get crushed toes. I expect it is supposed to bolt through a 'top hat' sleeve to maintain the free movement. Mine is dissassembled in boxes underneath stuff etc at the moment so can't be more helpful.

Congratulations on having more than one treadle machine. Next week when the fuel runs out you will still be turning and keeping warm (for future & non UK readers there is a blizzard on and they are talking about the gas running out) I intend to set up a 'no electric' shed one day.

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

Hi Bazyle,

Thank you for the swift response. The problem with the top hat idea is that the flywheel pin is nearly the same diameter as the hole…on all three treadles and that spans 1908 to 1927. It could be very thin I suppose…

It is handy to be able to get your toe under the treadle to back it up a bit to get to the forward stroke.

I had an idea about being ready for the apocalypse but didn't think it was going to happen so soon! (We don't have gas so not a problem for us!)

Andy

Edited By AndyB on 23/03/2013 12:12:35

Edited By AndyB on 23/03/2013 12:16:29

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Very long time since I looked at anything like that but my recollection is that the pin was a nice sliding fit in and just a touch longer than the thickness of the pitman link. Large washer under the head of the bolt stopped things falling off but the difference between pin length and pitman thickness presumably stopped things binding up. So far as I know it all worked but my involvement was simply rooting through stores to find a suitable bolt and washer to replace the originals which had gone AWOL.

To save trying to thin the pitman down I guess a stepped, double diameter, washer could be made with the inner part a bit under pin diameter and deep enough to create clearance between the larger, retaining, part and the link. That would not to interfere with sliding.

Clive

[NobbyParticipant @nobby]

HI
On My Drummond & Exe lathe as Andy said toe under pedal Or in my case you can turn the flywheel
Back or forwards as requierd by hand . I was going to take a photo of the Drummond pedal link but it was too cold down there at the moment
Nobby

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Thank you for teaching me a new word 'pitman'.

I wonder what the origin is? Did Mr Pitman invent it or is there a tenuous connectuion with coalmining?

Neil

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Is it something Mr Pitman developed for when he was SHORTHANDED ? ( Sorry!)

N

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

Hello chaps, and thanks for the ideas.

I am sorry to say that both the Oxford and Longman dictionaries have pitman as a North American word for a connecting rod. Nothing against our cousins across the pond, but it would have been nice to have an English word for something created, in the land in which it was created, at the height of the Industrial Revolution.

There does not seem to be a root word from which it derives so we can be grateful that we don't have to call it something extraordinary that takes 10 minutes to say.

Maybe American miners broke their legs often so had to wear a sort of caliper for support… and then used part of that caliper to spin the treadle lathe in their time off…and used another part for measuring their work

Andy

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

'Pitman' comes from the timber mill. The log was place across a trench (pit) and sawn into planks with one man above (topman) and the pitman below pulling the saw down which was the working stroke. It was recognised as one of the worst jobs (unhealthiest) of the pre industrialised society and probably originated in England sometime before America was invented.

When sawmills were automated the power stroke would be delivered by a 'pitman'.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Probably related to the Pitman arm used on old cars – pre rack and pinion – to convert the rotary motion of the steering box into linear motion to turn the wheel linkages?

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

Pitman ,a very old word, long before cars etc. The con-rod on horse drawn mowers was a pitman, made of hickory on the best , so must have been from America. When the wooden pitman was replaced by steel the new ones broke, mostly because of strange bending loads.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

The way to fit the Pitman would be the loose way that you mention, this way means thatas you peddle the power is on the down stroke, and if you stop peddling the treadle can stop while the flywheel still rotates, its a simple freewheel system. The woodn pitman on the Daisy Reaper, and other horse drawn mowers was/ is the best choise, because if you use the steel one there's no end of damage that will happen further down the mechanisim. Go round a lot of farm sheds near here in Canterbury, and you will find spares hanging on nails, and the odd broken one too, even though the mower has long gone, although a good number have been restored. Ian S C

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Interesting historical note there Ian. When you are gone who will recognise these and save them being chucked into scrap.

As I pointed out the term pitman predated cars and mowers but is still relatively recent despite saws being several milenia old. I think the term must have come along with the production of cheap iron tipped spades in the eighteenth century.. Prior to that nobody ever dug a hole unless they really had to, eg for mining so plank sawing is recorded as being carried out by raising the log on trestles. Later, especially in the colonies with limitted manpower on settlers farms it became easier for a couple of men to dig a pit and roll the log onto it rather than bodily lift it onto a raised structure.

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

Thanks chaps,

Your idea sounds good Ian, I will just have to follow Nobby's example and turn the flywheel by hand to get to the forward stroke.

It has been too cold, and I have been too short of time to experiment, but I will let you know at the weekend how it all pans out. I am a bit nervous of the possibility of the continuous clonking that might happen.

Andy

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Andy,

The one in your second picture appears to be pivoted in the middle, presumably to give the same 'safety' effect. I can't see why they couldn't just use a bit of rope

Anyone here remember treadle sewing machines? My Dad got my Mum an electric one to replace her treadle one, and she made him get her a manual conversion kit – a geared handle that engaged the flywheel!

Neil

[AndyBParticipant @andyb47186]

Hi Neil,

They are all rigid in the same way that the loop one is; a steel strap bolted to an iron casting. But thanks for the thought.

Andy

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