New (to me) small, old lathe; how to proceed?

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

I've read about model/small engineering, but never owned a lathe.

At a local sale I picked up a "Simat 101" lathe (30.00 GBP which I think is cheap).

[url]http://www.lathes.co.uk/flexy/[/url]

(search down).

Mine doesn't have the countershaft shown, but is otherwise "spot on" to that picture.
In particular, I only have the faceplate, no chuck. I have measured, and the spindle is m14x1.5mm. It appears my chances of finding a cheap chuck for my lathe are slim.

I would welcome advice (or probably links) on:

* fitting a motor or treadle
* finding a chuck OR how to "get stuff done" using faceplates and centres.

BugBear

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

[LambtonParticipant @lambton]

I suggest you invest in a copy of "Using the Small Lathe" by L C Mason. It covers all the basics of buying and using a lathe of the Simat age and type. You will probbly have to machine a chuck back plate to suit the lathe spindle then any suitable diameter chuck can be fitted to this backplate.. If you can only justify buying one chuck always go for a 4 jaw independent chuck..

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

M14 x 1.5 was also used on the early version of the Cowells Lathe; so it's worth keeping a look-out on ebay, etc. [Cowells owners are tending to update the spindles to M14 x 1.0]

Incidentally … it might be worth getting a Spark-Plug tap, in case you want to thread your own backplates, etc.

MichaelG.

[AndyfParticipant @andyf]

That book also covers making a treadle stand – basically, a sewing machine base, with the big pulley operated by the crank weighted up with concrete around the rim for a flywheel effect.

However, as the leadscrew seems to run in a solid nut on the saddle, rather than disengageable half nuts, such a flywheel might make stopping in the right place a bit tricky.

Andy

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Hi Bugbear, welcome to the forum,

I'd love to pick up a small lathe like that as a 'project'

I've heard that a scavenged sewing machine motor can make a perfectly acceptable drive for these smaller lathes. A 100-200 watt DC motor witha driver board of Ebay may well be suitable for such a machine.

Take a look here and scroll down to near the bottom of the page for nfo on your lathe and its history.

Does the 6502 refer to God's Own Microprocessor?

Neil

[nigel jones 5Participant @nigeljones5]

I use an old pedistal drill motor…fast and powerful

[RJWParticipant @rjw]

I use a sewing machine motor and pedal on a watchmaker's lathe, but it's a standby unit I use in France to save lugging a more powerful motor I use here, personally I'd avoid using one on the Simat, it's too heavy!
You'd get away with one for a while if using for short bouts of light duty work, but they certainly don't have enough grunt to run that lathe And cut metal as well, and you certainly won't be able to use the powered leadscrew!
Even on small turnings on a Boley 8mm, sewing machine motors get extremely hot fairly quickly and I'm on my second motor, you'll also get extremely frustrated by the limitations of what you will be able to do with it!

I have a simat 101 here and have just found the manual for it, once I get scans of it done, I'll happily Email a copy to you, I remember someone asking on here about the manual too but don't know where that thread is now!

Just remembered one issue with the Simat you'll need to be wary of, the entire topslide is secured by a single bolt for quite an overhang of metal!
When I got my lathe, I discovered under all the grot and paint that the topslide base had been broken across the bolt hole and badly repaired, i've since welded it and cleaned it up and is ok, but I won't be able to take liberties with it, it's certainly a very weak area to be aware of, so heavy cuts are best avoided if you do end up with a decent powerful motor!

John.

P.S. you got a good deal for 30 quid, well done, I paid around £40 for mine at a local auction a few years ago, I'm also fortunate that my lathe came with a Jacobs tailstock chuck and a 3 jaw SC scroll chuck with reversible jaws, which i also use if pushed on an 8mm adaptor when I need to turn bigger diameter stuff on my Boley,
I keep mulling over getting rid of the Simat, but the powered leadscrew, good solid cast iron bed plus it's capacity always win me over, if I could somehow make the topslide more beefy and adapt it to take a vertical milling unit, I'd probably get rid of my Unimat 3 by choice!

J.

Edited By RJW on 09/04/2013 08:48:06

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

No pictures, didn't happen:

 

   BugBear

Edited By bugbear6502 on 09/04/2013 09:38:47

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

I used a 110W sewing machine motor on my Super Adept lathe for a number of years, but it was not really up to it, and it died a smokey death, I now use a shaded pole motor of 180W. Ian S C

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

Posted by RJW on 09/04/2013 08:33:38:

I have a simat 101 here and have just found the manual for it, once I get scans of it done, I'll happily Email a copy to you, I remember someone asking on here about the manual too but don't know where that thread is now!

That would be VERY much appreciated.

The info pack from Tony@lathes.co.uk is £35 which is more than I paid for the lathe!

BugBear

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

Posted by Lambton on 08/04/2013 17:43:12:

I suggest you invest in a copy of "Using the Small Lathe" by L C Mason. It covers all the basics of buying and using a lathe of the Simat age and type. You will probbly have to machine a chuck back plate to suit the lathe spindle then any suitable diameter chuck can be fitted to this backplate.. If you can only justify buying one chuck always go for a 4 jaw independent chuck..

I already have "The Amateur's workshop" (Ian Bradley) and "The Amateur's Lathe" (Sparey), along with several older books, and a few years worth of 1930's and 1950's MEs.

Should I (still) add the book you recommend?

BugBear

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

Posted by RJW on 09/04/2013 08:33:38:

I use a sewing machine motor and pedal on a watchmaker's lathe, but it's a standby unit I use in France to save lugging a more powerful motor I use here, personally I'd avoid using one on the Simat, it's too heavy!
You'd get away with one for a while if using for short bouts of light duty work, but they certainly don't have enough grunt to run that lathe And cut metal as well, and you certainly won't be able to use the powered leadscrew!
Even on small turnings on a Boley 8mm, sewing machine motors get extremely hot fairly quickly and I'm on my second motor, you'll also get extremely frustrated by the limitations of what you will be able to do with it!

That's a shame – car boots are littered with old electric sewing machine for little money.

BugBear

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

Posted by Stub Mandrel on 08/04/2013 21:02:38:

Does the 6502 refer to God's Own Microprocessor?

Yes – I cut my programming teeth on a Pet 2001.

BugBear

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Posted by bugbear6502 on 09/04/2013 09:48:24:

I already have "The Amateur's workshop" (Ian Bradley) and "The Amateur's Lathe" (Sparey), along with several older books, and a few years worth of 1930's and 1950's MEs.

With those plus help here you should have all the help you need to get started. I cut my teeth on Bradley's book when I bought my first lathe in the mid '70s.

Russell.

[bugbear6502Participant @bugbear6502]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 08/04/2013 17:57:59:

M14 x 1.5 was also used on the early version of the Cowells Lathe; so it's worth keeping a look-out on ebay, etc. [Cowells owners are tending to update the spindles to M14 x 1.0]

Incidentally … it might be worth getting a Spark-Plug tap, in case you want to thread your own backplates, etc.

MichaelG.

http://www.tracytools.com/index.php?route=product/product&keyword=spark&product_id=629

Spark plug appears to be M14 x 1.25, not the Simat's M14 x 1.5

BugBear

[Keith LongParticipant @keithlong89920]

Hi

Try this **LINK** instead.

Keith

[RJWParticipant @rjw]

Bugbear, message sent, I need to get a copy of the manual on my computer anyway, the paper one keeps going walkies ………or as my wife suggests, vapourising into the general chaos!

If you can pick up cheap sewing machine motors, there appears to be a ready market on eBay for them, not surprising considering what dealers charge for them!

John.

[AndyfParticipant @andyf]

The Flexispeed/Simat sems to have evolved into the Perris, which after Brian Perris's death appeared virtually unchanged as the first Cowells. That has evolved into the present day Cowells 90ME, with few changes to the basic unit.

Cowells say that the 90ME is powered by a motor of only 90W output, though I think they may use good quality Parvalux motors. My smaller lathe is a Perris, but I can't work out the ratings plate on its Fracmo induction motor. It says 240V, 1.8A, which works out to 432W. But it also says 1/12 HP, which implies 62W output. Either it's a very lossy motor, or should read 1/2 HP, which equates to around 373W output. That seems more likely, given 432W input..

In parenthesis, if the Simat with an M14x1.5 spindle nose was father to the Perris, it's odd that the latter used 1/2 x 20 UNF. Cowells changed it back to M14x1.5 and later to M14x1.

Andy

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by bugbear6502 on 09/04/2013 11:49:40

Spark plug appears to be M14 x 1.25, not the Simat's M14 x 1.5

BugBear

.

Ooops !

Apologies for my error.

MichaelG.

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Posted by bugbear6502 on 09/04/2013 10:08:55:

Posted by Stub Mandrel on 08/04/2013 21:02:38:

Does the 6502 refer to God's Own Microprocessor?

Yes – I cut my programming teeth on a Pet 2001.

Excellent! – BBC A here, nhow have a B and a Master and I play with AVRs.

Neil

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

Well, there's a coincidence. The very first lathe I ever used was a Simat. It was sitting at the back of the lab where I worked. Scientists weren't supposed to use a lathe, that was a job for a craftsman but my boss had managed to sneak one in on some pretext or another (he was my model engineering mentor). What I was supposed to me doing was testing thick-film micro circuits which was a painfully repetative job that involved jotting down a lot of figures and then doing some calculations. Then we saw a PET 2001 at an electronics exhibition and it had a IEEE 488 interface on it which all the Hewlett Packard test kit had. I managed to get hold of one these and connected it all up and wrote the programmes to record the data automatically and do the calculations. Happy times programing in BASIC, I wrote all sorts of analysis and graphing programs then EXCEL came along and all my skills were superceded

Rod

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Hi Rod,

Where was that? Sounds the sort of thing they would have done at the Pye factory in Exning.

Russell.

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

Russell,

It was an MOD establishment. There was a brief interlude in the late sixties and early seventies when there was a fashion for diversification. My colleagues wrote the book on thick film technology before all that stopped and we were told to get back to developing WMDs.

Rod

[thomas oliver 2Participant @thomasoliver2]

Pubs pump the beer with beer pumps electrically driven. I have two Pultras – one a capstan, both driven directly by these motors, which in fact are made by Stuart Turner. I got these very cheaply at my local boot sale. I cannot make out all the ratings on the label, but the rpm is 2800. This is not too high for a small lathe, and my Pultras are rated for use up to 6000 revs. Some people have been known to run them at 10,000rpm. Try some local boot sales – a lot of pubs are closing down nowadays. Tomol.

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