Efficient Workshop Heating

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

LOL

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

OCCAM

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

Don't get cut. Hand bag shoulder…..ARMS!

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

I was at one stage looking at hot air heating, it requires a large wooden tray, say 6' x 4' x 6", with a glass or Perspex cover, then enough aluminium soft drink cans to join end to end with their bottoms knocked out of them, get them joined up, put some aluminium foil in the tray, spray the cans black, put them in the tray, at the intake a small fan from a computer can be fitted, put the cover on and aim the thing into the sun, convection should get the air moving, if not the fan will. Don't know, still thinking about it. Ian S C

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by Ian S C on 26/02/2014 09:21:35:

I was at one stage looking at hot air heating, it requires a large wooden tray, say 6' x 4' x 6", with a glass or Perspex cover, then enough aluminium soft drink cans to join end to end with their bottoms knocked out of them, get them joined up, put some aluminium foil in the tray, spray the cans black, put them in the tray, at the intake a small fan from a computer can be fitted, put the cover on and aim the thing into the sun, convection should get the air moving, if not the fan will. Don't know, still thinking about it. Ian S C

Does Perspex work for that ?. Glass (I seem to recall) changes the wavelength of light as it passes through (lengthens it) making it harder for the heat to escape. A heat pipe is cheap and easy to make and conducts heat great distances very quickly. Just cap one end of a copper tube put a wick it from end to end, put a small amount of water in it, pump the air out to create a vacuum and cap the other end, in a theoretically perfect heat pipe (impossible) the heat is conducted at the speed of light. The cold end can be attached to a passive radiator or used to heat water (as in commercial solar heating systems) – I believe just ambient light is enough to get these warm.

** sorry, uninvited advice!

Edited By Russ B on 26/02/2014 10:02:41

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

I like a woodburner but have been cutting wood for so many years it's no longer fun. My link to the net keeps breaking up, understand millions of aliens are coming on a cloud to mine bits ?

[Phil WhitleyParticipant @philwhitley94135]

Just cap one end of a copper tube put a wick it from end to end,

Hi Russ B,

I assume you mean put a wick IN it from end to end? Just interested in the heat pipe theory, and you have also educated me as to what GPGPU Is!! very interesting, and a concept I had not considered, although I am not as involved with the computing world as I used to be!

Phil

[Oompa LumpaParticipant @oompalumpa34302]

We need to lighten up in the UK.

In the US you buy an old (ancient) Huey from a dealer, slap "Experimental" stickers on it and go fly. Try THAT in the UK. Here you can't hire a Hydraulic Lift because of elf n pastry, but you can buy one!

There is a new member on this forum, he has NO experience of machining, he is going to build a scale undercarriage. I wonder how many of you thought "Good luck with that" and how many thought "Go for it" – I am in the latter camp. The man can't possibly fail, he will learn something along the way.

A new – unknown to many – currency format is emerging, whether you like it/understand it or not. It is here and has been for a while. To me it makes perfect sense, I am going to be having a 500w (or thereabouts) night heater in my workshops/sheds so why not drag a few of the computers presently propping a worktop up into daylight and press them into service? I understand the technology, I have the hardware and it is something that would not really exercise my grey matter to accomplish. Just need to buy a couple of cards and get the kit hooked up.

The UK – Great Britain – used to lead the world in innovation. In my humble opinion we are the authors of our own downfall, we are always looking for the easier, softer way. Well that way is not always the most rewarding but when you do succeed in the UK you are "lucky". I am sick of hearing it. Sure, there might be a "right place right time" element. But if you don't get off your backside in the first place……….

I am not saying this is for everyone either, I am just being philosophical today. And trying to remember the spec of a couple of those computers

graham.

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Why don’t the laws of physics apply to heat pipes ?

Michael Williams

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Posted by MICHAEL WILLIAMS on 26/02/2014 12:04:40:
Why don't the laws of physics apply to heat pipes ?

Michael Williams

my bad, I meant speed of SOUND not light LOL

– applying the law of physics, would time not slow down to a full stop for the object as it reaches the speed of light ?!?!?

Edited By Russ B on 26/02/2014 12:16:48

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Don't know but there is something wrong with the laws of physics where light is concerned.

They say it travels at 186,000 miles per second but my old BSA C11G could run over the Lucas main beam at anything over 50 mph – explain that ?

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Hi Russ ,

Yes speed of sound is better !

We won’t labour the point but for others which speed of sound applies ??

As regards using spare capacity in many separated computers need to distinguish between consenting and non consenting usage .

If you wanted to do an actual calculation such as a large scale finite element model you would need means of parcelling up sections of computation , sending them off , processing the sections , getting them back and then reinserting into master computation .

That needs a lot of thought and is one of the reasons I mentioned OCCAM . OCCAM is not a solution but it is thinking in the right direction .

Regards ,

Michael Williams .

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

In the end the easiest way for most of us to heat our shed is to get a plain ordinary job, collect wage after tax and pay for the electricity. I haven't done the actual calculation but I expect it only takes a few hours to earn a years heating. Problem for retired & unemployed of course but if thinking of early retirement it might be worth working and extra 2 months and apothocating the wage for shed heating, then another 2 months for a new lathe and another ………….

I get enough free wood for about 40 days heating one room each year. The cutting moving stacking moving stacking moving again probably costs me £1000 in time. But I do enjoy the evenings in front of the stove reading the forum and watching machines on Youtube. I sort of dream of a little woodburner in my shed but fire risk and dust are a big negative.

[FMESParticipant @fmes]

Russ, may I ask what program you are running that drives both graphics cards to that level?

I run two Gforce GTX690 cards SLI'd and the heat that comes off them at max chat isn't enough to keep my coffee warm, at idle your cards only use about 20 watts.

[Russ BParticipant @russb]

Lofty, idle has no relevance, and a GTX690 has an unsealed cooler, at best about 25% of the heat will exhaust directly to the atmosphere, and it's a 300w card, so 2 of them at full synthetic loads will see 500-600w and bar the slight noise and vibration, that is heat one way or another.

The last dual chip card setup I had similar to yours was 3x 4870×2 and you couldn't hold your hand at the exhaust for more than a few seconds, it would certainly burn.

The program is CGMiner – you'd need to run CudaMiner on your 690's and you'd get around 600-800KH/s for your 600w consumption, – and if you want to give it a general stress test to warm things up OCCT's (PSU test) is great!

Michael, I'd need to know the molecular density and the adiabatic constant for the gas (plus the temperature) to calculate that right? – they should really rename it from "speed of sound" to "speed of molecules in a gas" – I think it makes more sense =)

Edited By Russ B on 26/02/2014 14:48:14

Edited By Russ B on 26/02/2014 14:49:11

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Hi Russ ,

Getting way off topic – I only asked about speed of sound because it’s different in air , steam and the metal of the heat pipe sheathing .

Just to split hairs there are also different propagation modes which give different answers again .

Actually working it out in each case is easy enough or there are tomes of tables available .

Leave it now unless someone has a question .

Regards ,

Michael Williams .

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Well skip got delivered today.

That will last about a week, took the skip back this afternoon, it's only 100 yards up the road and will get same skip back probably Wednesday or Thursday next week.

Looks a lot but it isn't, we have 3 wood stoves and 3 neighbours also pull out the same skip for their fires.

Good thing is there is no prep, people just take what they want and what will fit their fires. there is never anything longer than 3 foot and that will fit into the workshop stove OK as it's a top loader. All kiln dried beech, been 12 years since we have had the flues swept.

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