Boxford lathe gurus…

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Hi, i'm asking for opinions and info from fellow Boxford lathe owners, past and present.

Enclosed pics of the 72 hole dividing disc/wheel and plunger engagement that came fitted to my lathe when i bought it. I have never seen another like it, it's not on Tony's lathe site, but it just looks too factory made and factory finish to be a home shop made jobbie. Note the brass plaque on the headstock "Post Office Research Station London". It's held on directly to the std 1.5" x 8TPI spindle with 3 radial c'sunk screws. Beautifully made of iron. Also the plunger mechanism knurling looks identical to the micrometer bed stop. Lathe is a '69 VSL.

Any opinions and info?

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Sorry about the photography, that is not rust (honest!) on the plunger housing, just oily steel…

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

My guess would be 'not a standard item' but likeley a 'special order'.

Like one could specify a different colour, if prepared to pay the price.

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

No idea but it looks a lovely machine and I agree it has to be a factory made item. Can boxford assist?

[Tractor manParticipant @tractorman]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_Office_Research_Station

Have a butchers here, they did some cutting edge engineering by all accounts. Mick

[Peter LayfieldParticipant @peterlayfield]

Luckie you, I have oftern wondered what the two tapped holes were for in the headstock of my lathe, but now I know

I have never seen this " extra" advertised in the Boxford literature ,But I would find it extremely useful, and would agree with the previous post

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

If it were made by the factory as a special they would just have to get a turner to make the bits etc. What makes anyone think a production factory would have more skilled turners available than a PO research lab. No way.

The way the PO worked back then would have had workshop staff used to a wide variety of work so very skilled and on 'overheads' ie their time was not costed by the job. A production company on the other hand would have invoiced by the half hour making anything special very expensive. The defence industry development sections were like this until the '80s – I could just get something made in house and nobody much bothered about the cost but try and get a supplier to do it and they would come up with the real cost in time and effort+ profit which normally came as quite a shock.

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Posted by Tractor man on 28/01/2017 09:24:06:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_Office_Research_Station

Have a butchers here, they did some cutting edge engineering by all accounts. Mick

Very interesting. Thank you very much.

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Posted by Tractor man on 28/01/2017 09:19:39:
No idea but it looks a lovely machine and I agree it has to be a factory made item. Can boxford assist?

Possibly worth contacting Boxford with the serial number off the bed, again thanx.

[Mark CParticipant @markc]

Whoever machined the front face of the head casting for the locking pin must have some original paint by the look of it. If it was all painted at the same time, it would be a suggestion it was done in the factory I would guess? I might point out none of the machines I have owned have had that flat machined and I have had a number of different types and vintage of Boxford.

Mark

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Mark C,

That is what I guessed at. Machined surface, looks like a steel part that has been milled (a little turned but no casting), and what looks like original paint. The other plates on the machine were screwed and fixed differently, too. So looking like an afterthought to the main item. But the markings on the circumference do not look 'factory' – more like a nanual addition. All clues, but nothing 'concrete'.

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Bit of history about the lathe that i know of since i've owned it.

I got the lathe in around 2000/2001 when i still had my workshop in the UK. It came via a good friend who was emigrating, and came in a part ex deal with a couple of motorcycle basket cases. Complete bikes, part restored, in parts, an iron head Sportster and a T140 Triumph Bonneville. He was a commercial aircraft mechanic working from Norwich airport, and was going to use the lathe at home (his shed and projects had the best of everything, tools, aftermarket parts etc befitting of a certified aircraft technician) prior to him deciding to up sticks from the Norfolk coast and move to southern Spain.

I was'nt that interested in the Boxford, it was part of the deal with the bikes, as i had two Colchesters (a 24" Student, and a 36" Master, both round heads) in the shop, i just put it in the corner, covered it up, and thought one day, maybe tart it up and out it to some shed dweller, or home machine shop enthusiast, or heaven forbid, a model engineer. It was in lovely condition and pretty much fully tooled.

Anyway, 2003 rolls around, i've had enough, decided to shut the shop, sell up, sell the freehold, move abroad, though to NE Thailand. In hindsight, i should of kept one of the Colchesters (love my round head Colchesters), but weight, and lack of cheap converters, inverters, at the time, made me decide to sell the industrial stuff and keep the little Boxford.

The Boxford was 3 phase, again at that time inverters were pretty new and pricey, and converters were outragous money, and did'nt have a great reputation. Being in the trade, i got a machine tool service engineer friend of mine to find and locate the very rare correct 930 rpm, 1.5 hp single phase motor, s/hand, and we fitted it in with a bunch of swearing and skinned knuckles. New belts at the same time. One of my employees knocked up an extended left hand side motor access door (the replacement 1 phase motor was 50% bigger than the original 1 hp 3 phase motor), and also fabbed up a lovely splash guard. All got colour matched at our local powder coaters. Then i got a professional machine tool electrician in who owed me a favour or two (again, handy knowing people in the trade), who completely re wired the whole lathe, to run off a household plug (light and suds, seperate plugs).

The lathe has an imperial gearbox and leadscrew, but both top slide and cross slide feed screws and dials are metric (?).

The lathe came to me with the correct 3 jaw chuck, 4 jaw, faceplate, catchplate, both steadies, Crawford 3C collets (90% complete metric and imperial c/w several duplicates) and all gubbins, all the change gears required to cut all threads, 4 TPI and below and all metric inc the big 100/127 compound gear, correct indexing 4 way toolpost, and all the usual stuff that fits in the headstock and tailstock spindles.

So, i moved out here in 03, and my containers with Boxford followed me out here in 05. Prior to storing the lathe, i purchased a Bison Dickson QCTP from Cromwells. The t slotted cross slide was purchased from the UK since i've been out here, still have the original. All the plastic balls on all the handles have been replaced with brass. ditto, all my machine tools, TS mill, Boxford shaper, Stent T&CG, Taiwan pillar drill, none of them have any plastic on, everything on the end of a handle is brass.

That dividing wheel/disc is useful for spinning the chuck by hand with gears dis engaged, but i have rarely used the dividing hole facility, having an H/V rotab (c/w plates) for the mill and shaper, even though it's handy for 3, 4 and 6 marking out on discs for radial bolts etc whilst still set up in the chuck. Oh, and the (poorly) stamped numbers on the rim, every 6, not original, my handiwork unfortunately.

This lathe has probably seen more work in the last 12 years than in it's previous life. It gets used a LOT, i love it dearly, but on those big jobs, too big for the spindle hole, or some nasty 5" diameter steel, i do miss my round head Colchester…

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Head stock, and indeed the whole lathe is original paint. Only the doors and splash guard are non original Boxford paint.

I do think it's a factory fit.

[James Wilkinson 3Participant @jameswilkinson3]

My hunch would be a factory made item but it is impossible to tell really. It's a beautiful machine tool indeed, WANT

[Speedy Builder5Participant @speedybuilder5]

Has anyone seen anything similar on the Southbend lathes ? That attachment would be ideal for making the Barley sugar twisted brass tubes, but more to the point, perhaps waveguide tubes ?
I suppose another question would be: Why lock the headstock spindle at a specific angle? There must have been another bit of kit that attached to the lathe for milling, drilling or other function. Does it have a slotted cross slide? or other tapped holes on the saddle etc?
BobH

[Brian OldfordParticipant @brianoldford70365]

Could there be a clue in the slightly unusual division number of 72?

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, define "factory made" any decent machine shop should be able to make such a an attachment.

Regards Nick.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Very odd. You would think a well set up shop like the PO Research Station would have milling machines and dividing heads readily available, so why the need for indexing on a lathe? And the lack of slotted cross slide does not look like it was used for attaching a milling head of some sort.

[Chris Evans 6Participant @chrisevans6]

Re original paint questions. In my experience when we took delivery of a new machine all came with a small tin of paint for touching up. This seemed to be a standard thing from all machine tool makers.

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Posted by Speedy Builder5 on 05/02/2017 07:49:29:I suppose another question would be: Why lock the headstock spindle at a specific angle? There must have been another bit of kit that attached to the lathe for milling, drilling or other function. Does it have a slotted cross slide? or other tapped holes on the saddle etc?

BobH

Yes, Boxford did supply a vertical slide for milling as well as a crosslide mounted dividing attachment. No need for a slotted crosslide for those although one was available for boring.

Russell

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Posted by Nicholas Farr on 05/02/2017 08:51:05:

Hi, define "factory made" any decent machine shop should be able to make such a an attachment.

Regards Nick.

"Factory made" means made in the Boxford factory. A non std item to special order. The original question was is this a Boxford made item or aftermarket/home made? I believe it is factory made and fitted.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by Tractor man on 28/01/2017 09:24:06:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_Office_Research_Station

Have a butchers here, they did some cutting edge engineering by all accounts. Mick

Interesting stuff indeed. Some real Heath Robinson machinery there. It looks like a lot of the old mail sorting machines and phone switching gear relied on rows of cam operated switch gear and the like. I wonder if the Boxford headstock indexer was used for setting up long shafts with multiple cams that needed setting to correct phasing? Seems to make more sense than for indexing on a lathe that could be fitted with its own toolpost mounted dividing head etc. Probably we will never know. Those old boys are all long gone I am sure.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by thaiguzzi on 28/01/2017 08:39:04:

Hi, i'm asking for opinions and info from fellow Boxford lathe owners, past and present.

Enclosed pics of the 72 hole dividing disc/wheel and plunger engagement that came fitted to my lathe when i bought it. I have never seen another like it < etc. > Any opinions and info?

.

Now that the Boxford Gurus have had their say … I hope that I might be permitted to comment:

1. To my eyes, there is nothing to definitively indicate whether the sevice was built by Boxford, or by the in-house workshop … The knurling is certainly similar to that on the factory parts, but that is not unexpected; the unfettled number-stamping, however, would surprise me on a 'factory special'.
2. The fact that locking appears to be effected only by the index pin suggests that it was not used for gear-cutting, but more likely for drilling or scribing work.
3. The choice of 72 divisions may relate to something horological, but my guess is that it is for 5° angular increments on a setting-dial or somesuch.
4. A short article [recovered via IOPscience*] describes 'A goniometer for aligning large single crystals prior to cutting' … This is just the sort of device for which such setting-dials might be required.

.

Unless the original delivery document; or a report mentioning its in-house manufacture; turns-up … we shall presumably never know.

MichaelG.

.

[*] the Journal of Scientific Instruments (Journal of Physics E) 1968 Series 2 Volume 1

Diana M Jefkins and R E Hines

Post Office Research Department, Dollis Hill, London

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi MichaelG, thagguzzi has stated that the numbers that have been stamped on were not original and that he did them himself. I agree, only documentation would prove that it was a "factory made part". In my day job, we make parts for various companies, but are badged with their own name on them when supplied to their own customers.

Regards Nick.

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