Armstrong gun

[Eric CoxParticipant @ericcox50497]

Armstrong 7 inch muzzle loading gun

A nice turning exercise with a bot of woodwork thrown in

[Eric CoxParticipant @ericcox50497]

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Black powder or nitro?

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

That's a fine-lookin' piece . Are there drawings available or did you scale it off yourself?

[Brian HParticipant @brianh50089]

Very nice model. I think these type of subjects are suitable for beginners and experienced alike, they make a nice decorative item.

Brian

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

I'm really hoping that is 7" bore, and not barrel length

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Brian Hutchings on 16/10/2017 11:32:45:

Very nice model. I think these type of subjects are suitable for beginners and experienced alike, they make a nice decorative item.

Brian

Brian

Decorative? Hell, a cannon needs to be shot!!

[Eric CoxParticipant @ericcox50497]

It was built from plans I found on t'internet. It was originally published in The World of Model Engineering a now defunct magazine. The barrel is just "doable" on a mini lathe with 80mm chuck and fixed steady.

The barrel length is 4 13/16"

Edited By Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 11:41:38

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Eric

My Boxford is 13×40, you are starting to give me bad upscaling ideas .

Nice work by the way

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Nice model and beautiful presentation.

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 11:39:28:

It was built from plans I found on t'internet. It was originally published in The World of Model Engineering a now defunct magazine. The barrel is just "doable" on a mini lathe with 80mm chuck and fixed steady.

The barrel length is 4 13/16"

Edited By Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 11:41:38

Thank you for that – found 'em, printed 'em, an' that's a near-future project for me!

Edited By Mick B1 on 16/10/2017 13:27:58

[Eric CoxParticipant @ericcox50497]

The plans can be found here,

model-engineer.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/documents/wome-4-pt2.pdf

 

Edited By Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 14:26:53

Edited By Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 14:27:13

Edited By Eric Cox on 16/10/2017 14:40:22

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

link doesn't work for me, something to do with server error.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by duncan webster on 16/10/2017 15:20:11:

link doesn't work for me, something to do with server error.

Typo – it's http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/documents/wome-4-pt2.pdf or click here

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Excellent. If I extend the bore down to the touch hole does it need a licence?

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Duncan — Yes to the license it becomes a section 2 [FAC] firearm if the touch hole is driled through so it would be possible to charge prime and fire the gun/cannon.

John

Edited By JohnF on 16/10/2017 18:48:24

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by duncan webster on 16/10/2017 18:28:38:

Excellent. If I extend the bore down to the touch hole does it need a licence?

I think it would, though as usual nothing is ever easy. The Home Office Guidance (my bold) says:

2.3 ‘Firearm’ means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged. This includes any prohibited weapon, whether it is such a lethal weapon or not, any component part (see Chapter 13) of such a lethal or prohibited weapon, and any accessory to any such weapon designed or adapted to diminish the noise or flash caused by firing the weapon.

2.4 ‘Lethality’ is not defined in legislation, but the Firearms Consultative Committee in its Eleventh Annual Report and the Law Commission in its report of 16 December 2015 recommended that any barrelled weapon with a muzzle energy of 1 joule or more should be considered lethally barrelled. However, this is a complex issue and, although case law exists (Moore v Gooderham (1960), only a court can decide whether a particular weapon is capable of causing a lethal injury and would therefore be considered a firearm for the purposes of the Acts. Providers of forensic science services will be able to advise in any case where ‘lethality’ is likely to be an issue.

The Crown vs Model artillery might make for an interesting court case. Although a model cannon could be 'lethal' within the meaning of the act and well in excess of 1 Joule, it's obviously not designed for that purpose nor is it a practical weapon. It wouldn't be easy to injure someone deliberately with one, though I suppose a nasty accident is always possible.

I'm afraid criminals, terrorists, fools and too many deranged legitimate gun owners have spoilt things for everybody. Mind you, I doubt the police would be interested in a model cannon decoratively posed on a mantelpiece. Firing the same in a town centre would probably get you introduced to an armed response unit, a psychiatrist, unsympathetic judge and a prison cell.

Dave

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by duncan webster on 16/10/2017 18:28:38:

Excellent. If I extend the bore down to the touch hole does it need a licence?

Yes, and the most likely problem would be the 'good reason' requirement for the grant of a Firearm Certificate. For non-game/vermin shooting, this effectively requires membership of a Home Office Approved club, and I've never heard of any such doing model cannon shooting as a discipline.

[Brian HParticipant @brianh50089]

Everything said previously sounds accurate to me but what is the position with signal cannons, of the type used by yacht clubs to signal the start of a race and what about blank firers as used by re-enactors?

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Mick B1 on 16/10/2017 19:47:40:

Posted by duncan webster on 16/10/2017 18:28:38:

Excellent. If I extend the bore down to the touch hole does it need a licence?

Yes, and the most likely problem would be the 'good reason' requirement for the grant of a Firearm Certificate. For non-game/vermin shooting, this effectively requires membership of a Home Office Approved club, and I've never heard of any such doing model cannon shooting as a discipline.

Oh they do, they do! I know someone that shoots one.

**LINK**

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by JohnF on 16/10/2017 18:47:57:

Duncan — Yes to the license it becomes a section 2 [FAC] firearm if the touch hole is driled through so it would be possible to charge prime and fire the gun/cannon.

John

Edited By JohnF on 16/10/2017 18:48:24

It is only Section 2 of the Firearms Act 1968 if the barrel is longer than 24". Less than that, and it is Section 1 and on a firearms licence, not a shotgun certificate.

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Posted by David Standing 1 on 16/10/2017 20:06:08:

Posted by JohnF on 16/10/2017 18:47:57:

Duncan — Yes to the license it becomes a section 2 [FAC] firearm if the touch hole is driled through so it would be possible to charge prime and fire the gun/cannon.

John

Edited By JohnF on 16/10/2017 18:48:24

 

It is only Section 2 of the Firearms Act 1968 if the barrel is longer than 24". Less than that, and it is Section 1 and on a firearms licence, not a shotgun certificate.

Yes Dave quite correct — slip of the pen — it does say FAC  !!

 

Edited By JohnF on 16/10/2017 20:18:15

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Brian Hutchings on 16/10/2017 19:55:37:

Everything said previously sounds accurate to me but what is the position with signal cannons, of the type used by yacht clubs to signal the start of a race and what about blank firers as used by re-enactors?

Starting cannons are no different to any other cannon, and thus come under Section 1 of the Firearms Act 1968, so need a firearm certificate.

Blank firers are legal, providing they are obtained and used per the provisions of the Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

(Legal) starting pistols are made so they cannot fire a projectile or be converted to do so.

[Nick HulmeParticipant @nickhulme30114]

Posted by Mick B1 on 16/10/2017 19:47:40: and I've never heard of any such doing model cannon shooting as a discipline.

But they do

It's a black powder muzzle loader of the relevant calibre but it must be proofed in order to be shot on a club range 😀

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