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  • #811594
    Steve355
    Participant
      @steve355

      Hi

      I recently picked up a very cheap and probably not very cheerful Chinese DRO on AliExpress. I’m aware of its poor quality and limitations etc etc. However I have a little old Zyto lathe, and it has very small and poor scales on its axes – so I thought nothing ventured, nothing gained and it is do cheap that if it doesn’t work then I haven’t lost much. If it works I can make more accurate knobs and bushings etc than I currently do, which would be great.

      The reviews and installation videos I’ve seen usually seem to have problems with the magnetic scale – not that it isn’t accurate (although it isn’t very) but jumping problems, thought to be caused by magnetic interference or magnetic damage to the scale.

      So what I’m hoping to get here is any thoughts or advice.

      1) It unexpectedly came with an adhesive-backed metallic strip alongside the expected magnetic scale. (See picture). No mention of this in the “instructions”. I wonder if this is to go beneath the scale to provide some kind of magnetic interference insulation?

      2) For the Z axis I can see how to attach the sensor to the carriage using the far side gib grub screws. Obviously if I want to adjust the gibs I’d need to take it off, but not a big deal. I’d can 3d print a bracket (very easy but it might wobble) or make one out of aluminium (also easy). Pros and cons?

      3) I’m not clear yet how I’ll attach it for the X axis. Let’s get one working for now.

       

      IMG_5609IMG_5610

       

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      #811599
      Wink Hackman
      Participant
        @winkhackman25989

        I think the strip is stainless steel and designed to go on top of the magnetic scale to stop it collecting swarf.  The DRO I have came with aluminium U channel and rubber seals which hold the metal strip in place. I would make the mounting bracket from aluminium rather than plastic.

        #811654
        Diogenes
        Participant
          @diogenes

          Probably best not to attach the bracket via the gib screws – honestly it will be a PITA, there are times when you will surely need to ‘snug them up a bit’ in the middle of some critical or unwieldy job, and the other issue will be that securing the bracket will probably upset the gib setting as you do it.

          It is absolutely ‘allowed’ to drill and tap a couple of small holes to allow fixing of measuring devices to a machine.

          If fixing into a casting (which is unlikely to be flat) you can use ali. washers filed to a wedge shape or stand-offs to keep things square.

          If freehand drilling, a steel block accurately drilled-through with the same bit and used as a guide will help keep holes perpendicular.

          #811669
          Steve355
          Participant
            @steve355

            Wink – thanks for the tip, I’ve now seen that setup online. Your comment makes sense, I’ll resin print a “track” to put the mag strip in and top off with the stainless strip.

            Diogenes – I would agree, but 1) it’s effectively an antique and I’m loathe to drill random holes in it. And 2) I’m not at all convinced that this DRO will be a permanent fixture. The lathe is about 90 years old. The DRO probably won’t last more than a few years, if it works at all.

            #811933
            Steve355
            Participant
              @steve355

              A certain amount of success so far… only done the long axis, but perhaps that’s all I want, the cross-axis is much easier to measure with a micrometer.

              From the front, it can’t be seen at all.
              From the back, it’s attached to the lathe bed with various types of tape, and to the carriage by adding a couple of nuts to some gib screws.

              3d printed bracket at eye height.
              Terrible instructions, not much thought put into UX. But it seems to work.

              IMG_5611IMG_5613
              IMG_5612

              #811980
              Steve355
              Participant
                @steve355

                I have a question about lathe DROs, having never used one before.

                I get the longwise axis, that makes sense.

                On the crosswise axis, one obviously needs to zero the tool at the centre of the lathe axis – not particularly easy to do with significant accuracy, but a careful facing operation might do it, or using a dead centre in the tailstock.

                But that’s obviously only relevant to the tool that is being centred. As soon as the tool post is adjusted in any way, the centering is invalidated.

                I can also imagine skimming the workpiece, taking a micrometer reading, and then using that. But again it suffers from the fact that any adjustment invalidates the zeroing.

                The DRO has a feature that can double the reading, obviously intended to convert a radius into a diameter. But I’m struggling to see the great usefulness of a DRO on the cross-axis of a lathe, given the amount of re-zeroing required.

                Hopefully I can be educated.

                #811993
                SillyOldDuffer
                Moderator
                  @sillyoldduffer

                  DRO on a milling machine is a no-brainer because there are 3 axes, all working from different reference points over longish distances.   Human error is much reduced, including backlash compensation.

                  I haven’t bothered to fit a DRO on my lathe because the way of working is different.

                  • I measure distance along the bed and hold it by setting a stop, or by working to a line reference. The dial is mostly for rough positioning, though it’s not the law!    I often go slightly over, make that the reference, and trim accurately to size from the other end – whatever works best.   When accuracy really matters, better than about ±0.025, I use a caliper, template or micrometer rather than the dials.
                  • Likewise, turning to a diameter isn’t done relative to the axis.  Instead I skim round work to ensure it’s true, then measure from the cleaned up surface as a reference.  To get to 20.00mm, I might rough to about 20.2, then come down to target via 20.1, 20.05, 20.02 etc.   I don’t measure 20.1 accurately, I take much more care at 20.02.   I prefer to compare and fit rather than to  measure absolutely, but needs must – caliper or micrometer when the dial isn’t good enough accurate.   Whilst a DRO on my lathe would undoubtedly be convenient, it’s far from essential.

                  Ten years ago I fitted a really basic DRO to my mill just to get a feel for it.   Cheap and cheerful, and if it worked out, I intended to upgrade.   Pesky thing refuses to die,  so I’m stuck with it!

                  Dave

                  #811995
                  JasonB
                  Moderator
                    @jasonb

                    I manage OK without a DRO on the lathe but there are times when one could be handy for keeping track of numbers such as when I’m doing a more organic shape and want to rough that out with a series of co-ordinate cuts. When you can have upto 50 sets of numbers on a bit of paper the DRO would help with that.

                    Setting the cross slide handwheel or DRO to a measured diameter is no different time wise but if you then need to turn several concentric diameters then again a DRO would keep track of things a bit better particularly if you are not working in the units that the handwheel is callibrated in.

                    #812015
                    bernard towers
                    Participant
                      @bernardtowers37738

                      I converted my Sherline mill about a year ago using scales and displays from Arc but found batt consumption troublesome so fitted dummy wired 2032s and plugged into a wall wart with 4 usb outlets and so far so good.IMG_3952

                      #812032
                      Andy Stopford
                      Participant
                        @andystopford50521

                        Another time DROs are useful on a lathe is for screwcutting – even if you’ve zeroed the cross slide dial, the DRO will tell you whether you’ve gone back to the right zero (not necessary of course if you’re using the angled top slide method, but on my lathe that’s a pain to set up, and the top slide handwheel tends to foul the cross slide one).

                        I only have the simple display, with zero and metric/imperial buttons, but I’d like to get a proper one with multiple zeros, etc.

                        #812044
                        Steve355
                        Participant
                          @steve355

                          I see, so basically, there isn’t any magic, if a tool is changed, or adjusted then re-zeroing is required.

                          I thought perhaps, that there might be some trick, but it seems not, fair enough. I guess it’s like any tool change on the CNC, it needs to be zeroed.

                          So for now I probably will just stick with the long axis.

                          The reason I got the DRO was I was struggling to get my parts to be accurate in the length dimension. I was actually trying to find a long travel dial gauge, but it turned out the DRO was half the price.

                          #812086
                          Nealeb
                          Participant
                            @nealeb

                            I do use a DRO on a lathe, mainly because my second-hand machine came with one. I found it so useful that when one of the read heads failed, I replaced the whole setup with a more modern system. This has settings for multiple tools. So, each tool in use is set up against T1, T2, etc, on the DRO, and as long as you remember to switch settings on the DRO when you change tools, it works fine. However, it does depend on having either a QC toolpost or good indexing four-way toolpost (according to taste – that’s another “get the popcorn in” discussion…) so that tools go back accurately on each change. I seldom have the need to swivel the toolpost. In practice, I don’t use this function very much but it can be quite useful for repetitive jobs that need a tool change or two.

                            #812088
                            duncan webster 1
                            Participant
                              @duncanwebster1
                              On Steve355 Said:

                              I have a question about lathe DROs, having never used one before.

                              I get the longwise axis, that makes sense.

                              On the crosswise axis, one obviously needs to zero the tool at the centre of the lathe axis – not particularly easy to do with significant accuracy, but a careful facing operation might do it, or using a dead centre in the tailstock.

                              But that’s obviously only relevant to the tool that is being centred. As soon as the tool post is adjusted in any way, the centering is invalidated.

                              I can also imagine skimming the workpiece, taking a micrometer reading, and then using that. But again it suffers from the fact that any adjustment invalidates the zeroing.

                              The DRO has a feature that can double the reading, obviously intended to convert a radius into a diameter. But I’m struggling to see the great usefulness of a DRO on the cross-axis of a lathe, given the amount of re-zeroing required.

                              Hopefully I can be educated.

                              You zero the x axis by taking a skim, measure the diameter with a mic and set to that value. You can have several different tools set up in memory, so switching between tools it adjusts itself. Doing this using the Chinglish instructions is ‘interesting’, a good subject for a MEW article. DRO is more useful on mill, but I wouldn’t be without mine on the lathe.

                              #812095
                              Steve355
                              Participant
                                @steve355

                                “Chinglish” is very kind. I think the feature you mention is P27 or P28!

                                You dial P25 for reservations, and P20 restores the factory premises, destroyed during the Great Leap Forward.

                                IMG_5614

                                 

                                #812119
                                Wink Hackman
                                Participant
                                  @winkhackman25989

                                  I find the DRO really useful on the lathe crosslide. Set it to read diameter, do a skim to get the workpiece round, then measure the diameter with calipers or micrometer. Enter that value into the DRO and then turn the workpiece very accurately to the required size.  I don’t generally need to change tooling because a CCGT insert does facing and turning. But if I did need to use another tool – let’s say I wanted to machine a 1mm deep groove using a form tool – I would just touch off on the diameter, zero the DRO, then machine to -2mm diameter.

                                  #812144
                                  dk0
                                  Participant
                                    @dk0

                                    Regarding a low-cost DRO, why don’t we consider an App that uses the high-resolution of iPhone cameras and, with the help of a special marker placed on the carriage of a lathe (x-z), displays the dimensions on the phone screen. Something similar from Acu-Rite already exists for iPad, but it still requires expensive optical scales and WiFi. Do you think this is possible? Or does it already exist?

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