How to remove Record Vice handles?

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How to remove Record Vice handles?

This topic has 24 replies, 14 voices, and was last updated 10 October 2017 at 15:01 by Mike E..

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6 October 2017 at 17:14 #320286
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
I now have two Record vices which have S shaped tightening bars! Not, I hasten to add, of my doing.

I am puzzled as to how these handles have been assembled. I assume at least one of the end caps must have been screwed or pressed on. It would be much easier to straighten these handles if I could remove them.

So how is this done please?

Andrew.
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6 October 2017 at 17:14 #18684
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
6 October 2017 at 17:23 #320289
mechman48
Participant
@mechman48
Hacksaw one of the end caps off…. straighten, then re thread & fit new end cap

George.
6 October 2017 at 17:27 #320293
ega
Participant
@ega
"Hacksaw", etc: I have done the same myself.

I think there is a video somewhere showing how Record vices are/were made and seem to recollect that the blobs on the handle are formed from the bar (the Woden equivalent was done differently, I think)

Edited By ega on 06/10/2017 17:28:13
6 October 2017 at 17:51 #320297
ega
Participant
@ega
Extract from The Workbench Book by Scott Landis:

"The handle is secured by cold-forging both ends"
6 October 2017 at 19:26 #320313
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
Now that sounds interesting! No wonder I have never been able to get the damn things off! I might just as well make up new handles, rather than bothering with straightening the old ones out!

Thanks both,

Andrew.
6 October 2017 at 20:49 #320330
Mike Poole
Participant
@mikepoole82104
I used a spare socket set T bar as a tommy bar on my Rapidor saw vice that had lost its tommy bar. They are very tough being chrome vanadium.

Mike
7 October 2017 at 16:30 #320417
Neil Wyatt
Moderator
@neilwyatt
Goldamnit, it's a feature so you can tighten it up without bashing your knuckles!

It isn't a genuine Record if the handle is straight

Neil
7 October 2017 at 16:38 #320418
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
Hello Neil,!

You could be right! I just wanted to smarten the vices up and give them a lick of paint. They work much better after you paint them!

Andrew.
7 October 2017 at 19:05 #320436
An Other
Participant
@another21905
Andrew – making new handles seemes to be the way to go, but it would be worth checking on the material that the handles are made from. I have an old 'no-name' bench vice, and also bent the handle. ('extended' it with a lenght of steel tube – not the brightest idea I've had ). When I cut it off, it was hard steel – took a lot of work. I suppose they must be some sort of hardened steel, because it would be very easy to bend a soft iron or steel handle – maybe Mike Poole has the right idea fro a new one – modify a chrome vanadium socket set bar.
7 October 2017 at 19:40 #320440
Frances IoM
Participant
@francesiom58905
I have an old Record No 3 – only problem Is I can’t remove the somewhat worn jaws – any ideas as the screws seem ‘rusted’ into the outer jaws and being slot rather worried about damaging them – tried penetrating oil but it doesn’t seem to penetrate
7 October 2017 at 20:06 #320441
Mike
Participant
@mike89748
Frances, the thread is coarse – maybe 1/4 Whit but I can't remember. I got mine out over 20 years ago with a punch applied near the edge, and a big hammer. Replacements were easily made from bright mild steel.
7 October 2017 at 20:16 #320443
Mike E.
Participant
@mikee-85511
Consider using an arbor press to straighten it using V-blocks on either side of the high spots.
7 October 2017 at 22:05 #320450
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
I don't yet have an arbour press. I was going to heat it up with an oxyacetylene flame and then persuade it to straighten with a little brute force. I suppose I could do that by leaving the handles in situ. Save the bother of getting them out.

Andrew.
8 October 2017 at 00:22 #320457
charadam
Participant
@charadam
Posted by Frances IoM on 07/10/2017 19:40:37:
I have an old Record No 3 – only problem Is I can't remove the somewhat worn jaws – any ideas as the screws seem 'rusted' into the outer jaws and being slot rather worried about damaging them – tried penetrating oil but it doesn't seem to penetrate

Frances, I had the same problem.

I sacrificed a boot-sale screwdriver, cut 50mm off the business end and welded a hex nut on the cut end.

Then used the vice as a press to seat the blade in the screw kerf.

Apply spanner to nut and Robert's your father's brother.

Edited By charadam on 08/10/2017 00:23:17
8 October 2017 at 00:25 #320458
not done it yet
Participant
@notdoneityet
Save the bother of getting them out.

They will likely bend much easier after you knock out the temper! So maybe not a long term solution?
8 October 2017 at 09:31 #320473
ega
Participant
@ega
Posted by Mike on 07/10/2017 20:06:18:

Frances, the thread is coarse – maybe 1/4 Whit but I can't remember. I got mine out over 20 years ago with a punch applied near the edge, and a big hammer. Replacements were easily made from bright mild steel.

The screws on my Record no 4 are 5/16" BSW.

I long ago replaced the slotted head screws with hex recess screws and took the opportunity to drill the replacements axially to allow the rapid location of jaw liners in various materials.
8 October 2017 at 10:34 #320484
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
Yes, just after I wrote the bit about Oxy-acetylene it dawned on me that it would probably ruin the temper of the bar!

Now how do I straighten them without taking them out and no arbour press? OK looks like another project. Build an arbour press!

This model engineering has a lot to answer for. Maybe I just take Neil's advice and leave them as they are, battle honours and all that.

Thanks again,

Andrew.
8 October 2017 at 11:38 #320489
Gordon W
Participant
@gordonw
Just grind the lump off the end to get out. then bend straight in a big vice. A bit of suitable pipe welded or pinned will stop it coming out again. The slightly shortened handle will stop you bending it again.
8 October 2017 at 12:25 #320494
Andrew Tinsley
Participant
@andrewtinsley63637
Hello Gordon,

Thanks for that. In my own defence, the handles were bent when I got them. I suppose I could use one vice to straighten out the other handle of the other and vice versa (excuse the unintended pun!). Might even be able to do this, without removing the handles!

I shall give it a try and report back.

Andrew.
8 October 2017 at 13:31 #320515
Frances IoM
Participant
@francesiom58905
Charadam
you must frequent high quality boot sales – I tried a stubby screwdriver between jaws using a molegrip to turn – the stubby just bent the blade and wrecked the screw head!
Thus tried the hammer + punch and got one screw out, but the rest required grinding out the countersunk head with a dremel tool after which with jaw removed could cut a slot in the exposed screw and remove it – 2hours later can confirm the screw on an old Record No 3 is a 1/4″ BSW (a smaller modern chinese ‘Record’ vice used UNC screws).
8 October 2017 at 14:07 #320524
Bazyle
Participant
@bazyle
Trying to bend a hardened bar that thick in a vice is the sort of treatment that breaks them (the vice). I think you need to be outside with just the handle still in the screw and that still in the movable jaw. Make sure you are working on something solid like bits of paving slab you don't mind breaking, not the patio nor a nice brick wall. Use scraps of 1/8 mild steel sheet to avoid scraping the metal on the stone, hit with 2lb hammer. If you are strong enough to control a bigger hammer you can probably bend it by hand. the biggest problem is holding it all in place between blows.
8 October 2017 at 15:08 #320540
not done it yet
Participant
@notdoneityet
Build a forge, employ a large swage bock and then harden and re-temper? Or take it to the local smithy and get him/her to do it!

Beware of cheap socket extension bars – I have twisted them, before now, with just a 1/2" drive torque wrench.

Edited By not done it yet on 08/10/2017 15:09:42
9 October 2017 at 13:27 #320708
OuBallie
Participant
@ouballie
Make the handle sticky as I've done to all of my vices.

Just don't leave the handle pointing upwards than walk past with a partly unzipped jumper

Geoff – Austin body attached to the Rotisserie/Tilter at last
10 October 2017 at 15:01 #320873
Mike E.
Participant
@mikee-85511
Posted by OuBallie on 09/10/2017 13:27:20:

Make the handle sticky as I've done to all of my vices.

That's a great Idea !
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