Knurling tool operation

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Have just ordered a knurling tool of the clamp type – I wish to use it to finish some parts of the Hemingway/Thomas height gauge.

I have never used a knurling tool before so some suggestions for lathe speeds and whether to do it under power (at present I assume this is correct)

The parts are about 1 1/8" mild steel and 5/8" brass.

Thanks for any help.

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

[OuBallieParticipant @ouballie]

Nick,

Experiment on a scrap piece first as you may need to adjust my method.

My technique using Hemingway kit I made is as follows, with lathe running:

1) Wind Cross-slide forward until knurls are centred over workpiece, then turn the screw until they make light contact and just start revolving,

2) Wind Cross-slide back,

3) Give the adjusting screw 1/8-1/4 turn

4) Slowly move Cross-slide forward forcing the knurls onto the work until centred, then another 1/4-1/2 turn

I find that this method ensured the knurls are in sync and produce perfect knurls as evident:

Geoff – Recovered from the Stent procedure, and complications, I had end July

[Brian HParticipant @brianh50089]

I find that you need a slow speed on the lathe such as lowest backgear and, if you can, flood with coolant to wash away any chips that would otherwise be crushed back into the knurl.

Brian

[Andy CarruthersParticipant @andycarruthers33275]

Top tip from Hopper – lightly dress the knurled part with a file to remove any sharp peaks

[VicParticipant @vic]

I’m waiting for the Chinese to start making these:

**LINK**

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by Vic on 22/11/2019 22:15:49:

I’m waiting for the Chinese to start making these:

**LINK**

Is there any reason to believe they are not made in China?

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

NDY

Does say "Made in Germany" on each tool?

Cheers, Martin

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by Martin King 2 on 23/11/2019 09:18:05:

NDY

Does say "Made in Germany" on each tool?

Cheers, Martin

Thanks. I only hunted though the printed matter. Didn’t try to read the small print on the small pics!

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

Have a look at the price

Roy

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Vic on 22/11/2019 22:15:49:

I’m waiting for the Chinese to start making these:

**LINK**

You can get yours on order Vic, plenty about from not only China but Taiwan and India too

[peak4Participant @peak4]

I'd pondered on making one of these , to Gadgetbuilder's design some time ago, but never got round to it, and then a house move got in the way.

Bill

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

I have ordinary bump knurls, a Brauer hand squeezed 3 wheel "nutcracker", and a Marclo professional clamp type knurling tools. Sometimes tempted to make a DIY cut knurl tool too just to see how well they work.

Rule 1 seems too be use good quality sharp knurls. The knurls do wear, especially if you show them obdurate material. Best to assume the ones on a used "bargain" are shot and that the ones included with an economy device aren't up to scratch. Dunno what were in the Marclo when I got it but a bit of stainless steel put a nice flat on one. Knurling stainless can be iffy due to work hardening but I'm pretty sure the wheels weren't OEM quality. Got replacements from Zoro which seem good, acceptable price and quick delivery.

The Marlco has a hand lever to apply knurling pressure after the basic knurls just kissing the work setting has been made using the screw. Makes the whole process much more controllable as compared to relying on screw feed. Whether via cross slide for bump tool or via the adjuster of the basic clamp type. The nutcracker looks rather lightly built and a bit cheap but works unreasonably well on the more ordinary range of materials. It will do silver steel if you insist but thats being unkind. I'm convinced that the control and feel from hand squeezing or a hand lever makes the difference.

Much internet talk about getting the work size right so the knurls fit round equispaced, gear tooth style. Waste of effort in my view. Unless the job is small and the knurls coarse the difference between dead right diameter and worst possible case is small, a few thou usually. In practice knurling is a combination of cutting and displacement so things soon shave to fit if displacement alone isn't enough. Hence the desirability of coolant to wash away the thin shavings.

If you need the OD dead to size perhaps calculating the start diameter is desirable but I just have at it. Even coarse knurls on a nominal 3/8" diameter shaft went just fine with the nutcracker.

The Marclo is very heftily built. Much stouter than the common DIY clamp designs but can still deflect a little if you get careless. I'm inclined to believe that stoutness is important for easy, reliable results and that the usual DIY proportions are inadequate for anything much over an inch diameter. Being a bit on the light side doesn't stop the DIY breed from working but it just makes it harder as more care its needed.

Clive

[Nick Clarke 3Participant @nickclarke3]

Thanks guys

Nick

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Posted by Clive Foster on 23/11/2019 11:06:40:

……………

Much internet talk about getting the work size right so the knurls fit round equispaced, gear tooth style. Waste of effort in my view. Unless the job is small and the knurls coarse the difference between dead right diameter and worst possible case is small, a few thou usually. In practice knurling is a combination of cutting and displacement so things soon shave to fit if displacement alone isn't enough. Hence the desirability of coolant to wash away the thin shavings.

…………………

Clive

 

I watched this video last night before you posted your reply.

The presenter makes the same point very well, if in a rather long winded fashion. Fast Forward might be of use to the viewers

Bill

Edited By peak4 on 23/11/2019 14:43:47

[robjon44Participant @robjon44]

Hi all, indeed the cut knurling tools on Mr Cutwells site are indeed works of art ( or tool pornography ), the secret being that the shafts that the knurls attached to are geared together at the other end inside the head of the unit to prevent mismatches of the pattern. Used them a lot on CNC lathes, to make them cut of course the wheels have a substantial angle into the front face, probably 10 degrees or more which produces a stream of fine chippings & gives an excellent form & finish on the product meant to be seen, clutch alignment tools for BMW motorcycles as an example, in shedloads. The single wheel ones are for straight knurling & work in exactly the same way, I have an example in front of me, a wheelstud & the knurl on it to be pressed into a wheelhub has a mirror finish, again made in thousands. However I did test that one out on a manual lathe out of curiosity & it performed flawlessly, therefore if you could acquire such a wheel or modify an ordinary hardened steel one on a T&C grinder? Finally I have in my Private Collection a 3 wheel version of this type of cut knurler that can definitely be used on a manual machine, it features 3 longitudinal arms with knurls on the ends & knurled ring on the body to wind in or out to the required size, so skim a bar end to size, establish knurl size then let it rip on the job in hand, I've been castigated many times on here for using industrial sized tooling, however in my working lifetime there have been many opportunities to acquire such items at little or no cost which in a home workshop environment would likely last forever

BobH

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

For a long time, I agonised over the n"gear ratio" between the knurl wheel and the workpiece. Should ,it be an exact integer? In the end gave up, and seem to produce the desired result.

As an Apprentice was told to apply a 0.010" D O C, but do it by "guess and by God".

I know when I have overdone when the knurls shear off from the workpiece, and i have to start again.

As usual, almost the last operation!

I often knurl under power feed. If the first pass does not produce a deep enough knurl a second pass with a deeper setting engages the knurling wheels with e first cut, like meshing two gears.

Clamp type tools impose far less strain on the bearings of the lathe than a tool being forced into one side of the work.

There are tools available which truly cut a knurl, whereas the ones that we use mix forming and cutting the metal.

Applying coolant is a definite benefit, but not with a brush! The bristles get caught and that can spoil the work! DON'T ask.

Howard

[Simon BarrParticipant @simonbarr48213]

Posted by OuBallie on 22/11/2019 18:32:06:

Nick,

Experiment on a scrap piece first as you may need to adjust my method.

My technique using Hemingway kit I made is as follows, with lathe running:

Hi Nick. I'm not sure your knurling tool is assembled as per the drawings, or maybe you need it that way to fit your lathe. I have just completed one of the hemmingway kits today that I got for Christmas.

Mine looks like this and I'm very pleased with how it performs. I can now move on to the rotary table kit I got at the same time

Regards,

Simon

[egaParticipant @ega]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 24/11/2019 15:31:45:…

As usual, almost the last operation!

…

No doubt this is sometimes unavoidable but I always try to get the knurling done first; that way, if the knurl is unsatisfactory, there is less to scrap.

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

There was a design in MEW for a cut knurling tool.

Regards Ian.

[OuBallieParticipant @ouballie]

Simon,

Made mine to the drawing but then wasn’t at proper height, hence having to fit the tool post mount lower, or a woopsie, but I no longer remember🤗

Geoff.

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

good to see you here posting again Geoff!

[Simon BarrParticipant @simonbarr48213]

Posted by OuBallie on 25/01/2021 13:34:22:

Simon,

Made mine to the drawing but then wasn’t at proper height, hence having to fit the tool post mount lower, or a woopsie, but I no longer remember🤗

Geoff.

Geoff, as long as it works it makes no difference does it. My memory does that to me sometimes too, more frequently these days

Simon

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Geoff I often think about the hereafter.

"What am I here after?"

Howard

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