Grayson Lathe refurb

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi All,

Thought I would post how this is coming along, here is the before pic:

Finally got around to stripping it all down and found not too much wrong with it, the ways are really very good with no signs of any major wear, most of the rust is powdery and superficial.

The bullwheel has a large chip in the hub and its grubscrew was badly damaged and had to be drilled out; i then made an alloy mandrel which was made a just 'no go' into the wheel and popped into the freezer, wheel was put in the oven (missus was out shopping!), and the two then went together perfectly.

Turned down a shoulder to allow an alloy collar to be fitted which itself was then turned down; into themill to drill and tap 5mm for a new cap screw. While it was in the madrel i greased th mandrel wall and filled the damaged area with JB Weld, not too succesfully!

Will have to make new locating spring loaded stud and knob for the bull wheel into the pulley cluster as old one is a bit mangled.

Thoroughly cleaned all parts and gegreased with acetone then repaint in Myford RAL 7011 grey.

The other repair to be done is a small idelr gear that is missing a tooth in the exact position of the gear locating pin. The last time I had one of these Brian Wood very kindly made me a new one but thistime I am going to have a go at making a small brass insert and try silver soldering it in place. (first go at thios so fingers crossed!). Will then file it to shape by hand.

(to be continued…)

Cheers, Martin

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

[Joseph Noci 1Participant @josephnoci1]

looks great Martin.

I really enjoy doing these kinds of refurbs – great pleasure in seeing the Grace of Old appear out of a pile of rusty stuff…

Did an Albs 2S shaper earlier this year and that was very rewarding. You seem to be enjoying it!

If only some of this Old Iron could relate a life's story…

Joe

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

I'm not an expert in the matter but can you really silver solder to cast iron? I assume the gears are CI.

Perhaps somebody could comment.

Murray

[Ian Skeldon 2Participant @ianskeldon2]

Good point Muzzer, IIRC when I wuz a lad (long, long time ago) we were told in most instances think of CI as hard wearing but brittle and easy to break, you can take away as much as you like but you can't put anything back.

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Muzzer, perhaps I should say braze? If so I probably don’t have the right flux (HT5) or rods, can you pls advise what I need?

Joe, you are very kind, yes I do enjoy bring tools back from the dead, it has turned into a fun little business for retirement.

Cheers, Martin

[Jim NicParticipant @jimnic]

Cast iron can be silver soldered, I've done it successfully. I consulted Keith from Cup Alloys at a Midlands show a few years ago and was advised to prepare the cast iron by heating to red heat to burn off any oil contaminants then clean the item thoroughly and silver solder as normal. I used HT5 flux.

Jim

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

Martin – The Grayson was my first lathe back in the eighties. It was worn out but I pulled all the stops out on a refurb carried out on "someone else's" machinery which entailed making a new headstock spindle, remachining cross slide/ top slide and fitting new gibs. Remade cross slide acme screw thread and nut (made, hardened and ground an acme tap in HSS for the bronze nut) Re-machined tailstock and made and fitted new spindle. Final job was to skim the bed.

Was a lovely little lathe when finished and I was very sad when I had to sell it to help finance the divorce which followed.

But life moves on and I am pleased that I have now got a bigger one

Rik

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Jim – thanks for the info. I'd sort of surmised that CI is a bit of a sod to braze / weld / etc. Sounds as if the prep and flux are key.

Murray

[Jon CameronParticipant @joncameron26580]

I'l be watching this with interest.

I have a myford ML4 that could do with a full refurb, but it's doing ok for me at the moment, it's made me some bits and some money too which has helped ease the purchase of it with the missus.

I look forward to the updates. 😀

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi All,

Got the back gear locking pin made so put the spindle back together along with the back gear cluster.

Also started to fit the cross slide but have somehow mislaid the gib strip! I had it in my hand yesterday and so far have spent an hour looking for the bloody thing then came indoors in disgust!

Tailstock is now back on:

I will probably have a go at the small gear repair tomorrow and have another look for the gib strip which I will doubtless find 5 minutes after I have made a new one…..

Cheers, Martin

[Eric ArthrellParticipant @ericarthrell78468]

I have welded cast iron with ENC1 2.5 99% nickel rods ​and my oxford oil cooled ac welder. to repair gears on my Murad

It might be worth getting a scrap gear and having a practice "another string to your bow" and if its a scrap gear it won't matter if you naff it up.

Don't pre heat, weld in short bursts of no more than 1/2" put gun down quickly after each weld and peen rapidly with a ball payne hammer to relieve stress. then go again until built up. It worked for me I practiced on a scrap gear first when confident moved on to a 48 tooth gear, two teeth broken welded it as per above left it to air cool on forge bed machined up next day. "try on scrap gear first"

Eric

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi Eric,

Sadly I do not have a welder other than a cheap mig unit which I am rubbish at using so will go with the brazed idea but will practise on an old wheel first.Cheers, Martin

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Martin,

I have never tried cast iron welding but I have found that Sifbronze using the correct matching flux works well and makes good joints in cast iron. On a larger job I reduce the heat after jointing and keep the component hot to relieve stress built up, even to the point of letting it cool down slowly in the domestic oven from 250 degrees C. My wife is very forgiving in these matters; I am indeed fortunate..

It does need high temperatures and the main problem you will face will be to get the bronze to flow well without freezing if the job isn't hot enough. It is though a forgiving process and you can work over previous layers and fuse in fresh layers to build up a missing thickness.

Regards Brian

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi Brian

Many thanks for the advice. I will order some SIF rod & flux later today from CUP.

Would you make the small insert part from steel or bronze or just fill with bronze and recut from there?

The missing tooth is right above ( and into) a small drilled hole on the gear that takes a locating/drive pin. I can fill this in and drill another elsewhere.

Martin

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Hello Martin,

I meant to say earlier that you are making a nice job of this rescue, it looked very unpromising when you bought it

I would make the insert in steel and give it a generous and snug length of footing into the receiving gear. It should then hold position while you flood braze metal round it

Regards Brian

[Mick HenshallParticipant @mickhenshall99321]

Nice job Martin

Mick

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

Hi

New to the forum, so apologies if this has been posted before. Im presently using an old Grayson which I am in the process of trying to smarten up however I cant seem to get the main spindle out of the casing. This is due to the rear gear (which drives the 2 tumbler gears) being held fast on the shaft. Am I assuming correctly that it screws off just like the collet? I don't want to force it or break any of its teeth? Thanks

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

This is the driven gear. It appeara to have a little notch which i assume is to knock it round to thread it off?

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi Aitken, I am pretty sorethat this one is on a woodruff key.The spindle is removed from this end towards the headstock spindle, Have you freed off the pullies and bull gear grub screws?

Bit late now but will check mine in the morning and post then.

Cheers,

Martin

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

Thanks for the reply Martin. I did have a thought it was maybe on a small key but ijust couldnt make out if it did or not. Just to clarify it knocks through from the rear towards the front after everything attached to it such as bullwheel has screws removed?

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi All,

Had a go at the small gear that had a broken tooth; cut a small piece off of an old plane cutter and wedged it in positon with lots of new No5 flux made with meths which set solid holding the piece in position; dropped a couple of small pieces of brazing rod either side then heated with my oxy acetylene torch (first time I have ever used it!). Here is the result ready for some work with needle files. Will probably let the final buyer do this as my eyesight is not really up to it.

Pretty much done now so just a final clean up all round then ready to go.

Aitken, Correct about the spindle, do make sure that the bull wheel and pully cluster are really free, mine had a small burr on the spindle which was a bit of a problem, came from the graunched bullwheel locking grub screw. Also protect the lH spindle end and be gentle when tapping it out.

Cheers and Happy New Year to All!

Martin

[Aitken CouperParticipant @aitkencouper85254]

Thanks Martin

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