Chinese lever dti

[LynneParticipant @lynne]

[LynneParticipant @lynne]

There was a recent posting giving details of a lever type dti on ebay for £7. I cannot track down the posting, neither can I find the listing on ebay. I would appreciate some help. Thanks . Regards Lynne

[VicParticipant @vic]

This might be worth a read before you buy a DTI.

**LINK**

[James AParticipant @jamesalford67616]

I made the original post. I shall post the details of the gauge tomorrow morning.

[VicParticipant @vic]

This might be worth a read before you buy a DTI.

**LINK**

"China If you're buying indicators made in China, you're scraping the bottom of the barrel. You can't get any worse. Some years ago we were hired to evaluate these indicators for MSC who wanted to know if they were worth importing. Apparently they didn't listen to our advise. Now, of course, they’re making a killing selling these. Dovetails didn't fit and brand new .0001" indicators wouldn't calibrate. It turned out that dovetails didn't accept anyone else's attachments because they were oversized. Pass on these and order some Take-Out instead (but skip the chicken feet). Available in catalogs everywhere but don’t expect to find any spare parts"

 

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

I bought a couple of indicators from china but have now learned the hard way, I replaced my cheap plunger indicator for a Baty certificated indicator from MSC. Pin was very sticky on the old one.

I still have a lever indicator from china but its okay, It seems to go wacky if you try to measuring along anything more than a few inches.

Michael W

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

I've had one of those little lever type dial gauges, (mis)labelled  "Mitutoyo" for a couple of years and it seems to work OK. Probably wouldn't use it in a metrology lab but for moderate home use it seems to "do a turn". They seem to be all over Fleabay. Not sure if any are better than others though. Probably much of a muchness.

Like the posted link to LongIslandGauge above, the only fault I have found is the dovetails are diecast rather than machined and the diecast holder that clamps onto them broke early on but the steel fitting on the magnetic base clamps on to it just fine. The little magnetic base, about one inch square with the one knob that tightens all joints via hydraulics has worked well for me too. At the price, can't complain at all.

Edited By Hopper on 26/05/2017 01:28:52

[brian NYEParticipant @briannye52349]

have been looking at buying a bench drill/mill for some time some say cog drive wines belt is better will probably have to be china which though any recomendatations from experience

[James AParticipant @jamesalford67616]

This is the gauge that I bought. 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/262905527010?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

No doubt there are better makes for more money. However, as I am not likely to be using it greatly, I suspect that it will last for a bit. At this price, I would not be even considering repairing it if it were to break. I imagine any spares, were they available, would be too dear to make it worthwhile. I have yet to use it as I am waiting for the stand that I ordered from a different supplier to arrive.

James.

 

Edited By James Alford on 26/05/2017 07:12:52

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

I suppose a lot depends what you are using it for if you are just looking for needle movement when clocking something in the lathe then it does not really need to be callibrated. If you have the need to measure things with it then that may or may not be an issue. My one from Ketan no doubt via China works OK but like most things made to a price you pay for what you get and the very cheap imports are possibly not as good.

[David ColwillParticipant @davidcolwill19261]

What do you expect for £7.00!. I splashed out £9.00 for my Mitutogo and while not perfect it does work and should I ever bash it into a rotating chuck I am unlikely to shed many tears.

David.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Vic on 25/05/2017 22:22:10:

This might be worth a read before you buy a DTI.

**LINK**

"China If you're buying indicators made in China, you're scraping the bottom of the barrel. You can't get any worse. Some years ago we were hired to evaluate these indicators for MSC who wanted to know if they were worth importing. Apparently they didn't listen to our advise. Now, of course, they’re making a killing selling these. Dovetails didn't fit and brand new .0001" indicators wouldn't calibrate. It turned out that dovetails didn't accept anyone else's attachments because they were oversized. Pass on these and order some Take-Out instead (but skip the chicken feet). Available in catalogs everywhere but don’t expect to find any spare parts"

 

Long Island Indicator has it in for a lot of people/brands, not just Chinese ones:

"Mitutoyo new models, completely redesigned in 2017, are manufactured in Japan. Some models are available with optically scannable serial numbers on the dial face. … Because of their often low list price, these are best considered "throw-away" indicators."

"Starrett (USA) would like us to believe that they are products of the USA. Recently released models 3808 and 3809 do not claim to be made in USA and rumor has it that these are of Chinese origin. Models 708 and 709 are "American Made". We have found these to be surprisingly accurate. Construction-wise, none of the Starrett test indicators are in the same league as their European made counterparts. "

"Fowler once relied heavily on English imports such as Verdict indicators. These were about as good as English weather."

Neil

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 26/05/2017 13:42:58

 

Long Island Indicator has it in for a lot of people/brands, not just Chinese ones:

"Mitutoyo new models, completely redesigned in 2017, are manufactured in Japan. Some models are available with optically scannable serial numbers on the dial face. … Because of their often low list price, these are best considered "throw-away" indicators."

Neil

Yeah I was a little suspicious of that remark simply because I worked for an engineering works that had all mitutoyo measuring equipment calibrated every year, I don't see how they could be a throw away if they economically considered it worth it to get a firm to come and maintain them.

I also have a mitutoyo caliper that gets used on everything and the jaws are still like a razor in sharpness. The battery magically never seems to run out, despite the fact I always forget to switch it off, and the absolute reading is a good feature. The plastic holder for the knurled thumbwheel broke, you can buy a replacement but I don't consider it beyond repair.

Having said that, you can't complain if a £5 measuring instrument breaks, I've always said, that measuring is one of the few things that's worth investment. Because you're always limited by what you can measure.

I think Long Island Indicators definitely refer to "English import" with a sense of cheapness and snobbery and perhaps too big for their own boots.

American settlers were also a bit of an "English import" too!

The fact that they put "Swiss Precision Tool Repairs, Sales & Spare Parts​" on their home page, leads one to suspect they have already reached their conclusion on their analysis, they also happen to think that the swiss are the best,

"well gee, Scoob, that's a bit of a coincidence"

Michael W

Edited By Michael-w on 26/05/2017 15:13:12

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Within China, there are good, bad and ugly factories making DTIs, along with other measuring instruments.

The really good factories which make world class DTIs have a waiting list within China for local consumption. They are not really interested in serving the international market, and their agents have to pay up front deposits of USD50,000+, for goods being delivered six to eight months later. ARC has a relationship with such a factory, via one of our reputable buying agents. We tried to get into this factory for many years on our own, without success… due to our low buying power. However, one day in a conversation with this particular buying agent, the subject of this factory came up… and within two days, we were in the factory with JS drinking rice wine. It was a case of who you know.

In this world class factory, one could buy the best – at a serious high price, or the cheapest (but not so cheap in comparison to the majority available from elsewhere). ARC does not buy the best from them, because we would simply not be able to sell them and make a profit, nor do we buy the cheapest from them. The quality we buy from them is of a good standard – in our opinion, and they are consistent. Complaints are rare, with extremely low failure rate, so we are happy.

JS and I have also visited the cheaper factories which make DTIs. The cheaper factories are not that bad, and they serve a purpose. They too can make 'a better product', but they are commissioned by world buyers to serve a specific low price requirement, which represents the majority of their business.

Ketan at ARC.

[LynneParticipant @lynne]

Thank you all for your helpful responses. Now its make my mind up time. Regards Lynne

[egaParticipant @ega]

Vic:

Thanks for the interesting link although I'm somewhat depressed by the "verdict" on my own DTIs.

I had a conversation with the Verdict rep at an exhibition many years ago and was impressed by the complimentary elephant's feet they sent me as a result. My first lever clock of this brand did fail but I liked it well enough in use to replace it with another of the same or similar type ["Supertest 2"].

Edited By ega on 26/05/2017 17:30:06

[egaParticipant @ega]

As a result of reading posts here I looked at the earlier Recommended Dial Indicators thread where the last post [and "last word"] by Michael Gilligan referred to the Starrett Indicator No 564.

FWIW, this is not a DTI, having no dial, but it is of the very small and useful kind of instrument favoured by Martin Cleeve. The "Universal Junior" Indicator, to give it its full name, is described in Starrett's 1979 catalogue but I don't know if it is still available.

Incidentally, the owner of the 564 was Andrew Moyes 1 and he posted an intriguing picture of a two-tone Myford.

Edited By ega on 26/05/2017 18:20:57

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by ega on 26/05/2017 18:14:38:

As a result of reading posts here I looked at the earlier Recommended Dial Indicators thread where the last post [and "last word"] by Michael Gilligan referred to the Starrett Indicator No 564.

FWIW, this is not a DTI, having no dial [ … ]

.

ega,

Perhaps I'm being paranoid, but that reads like a bit of a dig at me

To avoid any misunderstanding, I will quote the full text of the post to which you refer:

[quote]

Posted by Andrew Moyes 1 on 03/02/2015 18:37:31:

… I would not recommend a dial test indicator but one like this…

I'd be interested to hear the views of others.

.

Andrew,

My view … It's an excellent, and robust, little device.

Personally, though; I prefer the similarly proportioned worm-geared Dial version that also has the pear-shaped tip.

[which is what I recommended in my first response on this thread]

MichaelG.

[/quote]

.

I fail to see why you felt the need to add your FWIW "clarification"

MichaelG.

[VicParticipant @vic]

Calibration isn't really an issue for home users but what is an issue with cheap DTI's is, is the the hand on the dial stuck or is it really just showing zero movement?

[egaParticipant @ega]

Michael Gilligan:

No dig at you or anyone else was intended. I referred to your post and that of Andrew Moyles 1 simply to give the context and allow anyone interested to go back and look at them.

This present thread is about cheap DTIs and it seemed worth drawing attention to this type of indicator as a possible alternative. In looking up the description of the 564 I was struck by the, perhaps rather trivial, point that I thought worth mentioning "FWIW".

Moving on, my impression is that in these affluent times the "Junior" indicator has fallen out of use and I would be interested to know whether my view is shared by others.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by ega on 27/05/2017 00:43:06:

Michael Gilligan:

No dig at you or anyone else was intended. I referred to your post and that of Andrew Moyles 1 simply to give the context and allow anyone interested to go back and look at them.

.

Thanks … Evidently a misinterpretation on my part.

Yes, I agree … the simple lever inicator is a useful device.

MichaelG.

[Neil LickfoldParticipant @neillickfold44316]

The best lever indicators are the ones with a very low N force stylis. The ones that require a higher force are not that good when it comes to long DTI stands etc. I have not had any luck with a Chinese lever type DTI but that was like over 20 years ago now. Anything can be made anywhere if the quality control is good enough. When things are made to a price point, that is when quality is sacrificed every time. I use lever DTI the most. I use plunger DTI's the least. I use the lever type as a comparator mainly and very rarely as an actual measure of distance or thickness.

The last thing you need is something that is not reliable and not repeatable. So much time is lost from non repeating instruments, or ones that are not reliable.

Neil

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