Which slideway oil is best?

[EtheAv8rParticipant @etheav8r]

As a beginner with a new first lathe on order I find this discussion a bit disturbing.   I should have thought that the oil and grease to be used for the daily lubrication and maintenance of the lathe would be a simple and general standard, not something that warrents such lack of general specification and speculation.

 

I am greatly surprised that 3-in-1 oil would not be suitable and find the suggestion that it would be abbrasive to be a great surprise.  I understand the issue of additives in car oils, but did not think they would be detramental.  How about the ‘straight’ aviation olis used for running-in new or overhauled engines then, as these do not containe the harmfull addatives?

 

Or should I just get 5 litres of Rocol Ultraglide X5 and be done with it?  I have a few litres of ‘straight’ 80 and 100 oils avaliable, but will have to fork out nearly £40 for the Rocol Ultraglide X5.

 

And what grease to use for the greasing points?  The Wabeco manual clearly shows the daily oiling and greasing points, but nowhere is there any guidance on specification.

[Chris TriceParticipant @christrice43267]

Myford sell a number of oils specifically for different machinery applications and they openly tell you what oils they recommend in each case in the instruction manuals and on their website. Other dealers have equivalent oils and do the same. Afterall, they should know which oil is the best for the purpose. You can phone them and ask for their recommendation. Assuming any oil is OK is a bit like assuming that any oil will suit your car, and in the same way, a less than ideal oil is better than no oil at all.  However it’s prudent to use the right stuff if you want it to operate at it’s best for as long as possible. No need to panic but best not to work your lathe too hard until you get the right oil. The most obvious point where correct lubrication is important is the spindle since that has the most chance of siezing and doing serious damage purely because it’s the part of the lathe that works the hardest.

Edited By Chris Trice on 27/12/2010 18:37:19

[Sandy MortonParticipant @sandymorton10620]

I used 3 in 1 for about 40 years on cycles without any problems.  I also used various types of grease for bearings but the best lubricant I ever had was Superspray Lube and it worked just fine on the lathe and the mill too.

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

I don’t seem to have problesm with neatcut – after all, in machines with spray lubrication the slideways get drenched uin cutting oil or suds.

 

Going back to 3-in-1, if I recall correctly it is castor oil based and tends to degrade by oxidisation and become thick and gummy.

 

Neil

[chris stephensParticipant @chrisstephens63393]

Would not an E-mail to Wabeco asking for recommendations be a sensible idea? Or perhaps a phone call to the importers.

chriStephens 

 

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

My ML7 gets the Myford recommended lubricants, as far as I’m concerned our machines cost good money and we spend plenty on, materials, tools etc.

So why cost cut on lubricants or mess about with different grades?

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Hi,

 

I can understand the comments about motor, specifically engine, oil not being good for the lathe, but this what I have been using for the last 16 years.

 

Now, my lathe manual quotes “A68 – ISO 3498 or analogous grease with middle viscosity” for oiling points such as leadscrews/ thrust bearings etc.Searching on the internet, all I have been able to find so far is that ISO 3498 has been superceded, and no reference at all to A68.

 

So, is there anyone who perhaps knows from the above what I should be using. I have to say that the word “grease” is obviously wrong as grease to me is a thickish substance which I cannot get into the oil holes.

 

The same instructions state the use of “ISO FLEX NBU15” or “Arconel L74” for the headstock bearings and other grease points. Castrol some time ago said that their LM grease is the same as the ISO Flex NBU 15.

 

Regards,

 

Peter G. Shaw

[Chris TriceParticipant @christrice43267]

Myford Speed 10’s headstock (ballrace) bearings use LM grease. It’s also recommended for the backgears and feedscrews. Everything else Shell Vitrea 27 or Esso Nuto H32.

 

Super 7, Esso Nuto H32 for everything except for feedscrews, leadscrews, back gears and rack which can be (and I quote) “by any good motor oil of SAE30 specification” or Rocol MTS1000/ Castrol LM Grease.

 

I use the Nuto H32. Not sure I’d use grease on the slides or leadscrew if only because swarf would stick to it like a good’un but SAE30 not a problem.

[John Reid 1Participant @johnreid1]

I have always used Mobil Vactra No 2 for the slideways on my lathes and Bridgeport.

John R

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

I have today found a firm – Hallett Oils – which will supply smallish quantities of various types of oil, eg their SL68 which is a slideway oil equivalent to Shell Tonna TX68 & Esso Febris K68. Expensive, mind you, at  £10.22 for 2 litre, plus P&P of  £7.22.

Why did I buy? Three reasons really: one, to beat the VAT rise (and yes I know I shouldn’t allow the tax tail to wag the dog); two, the only other place I found selling it by the litre was RDG which as far as I can see would have been more expensive by £8; and three, I didn’t want to buy the alternative of 5litres which I don’t think I would ever use. (Actually, it is probably doubtful that I will use all of the 2 litres, but who knows?)

The point is that I have been using the dregs of motor oil, ie what’s left after doing an oil change, and really, I can’t even say what it is, never mind the grade. So after reading the above, I’ve now changed. Oh well, back to cleaning the lathe yet again!

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

[Anonymous]

I can recommend Hallett Oils too. I’ve been using their oils and coolant for several years. I tend to buy the 5 litre cans, as they’re a bit cheaper per litre. Last time round the loop with them, discussing a slideway oil for a CNC milling machine with Turcite ways, they recommended their ‘Slideway68D’, which presumably is similar to their SL68. I’ve been very happy with it. Now that I’ve nearly finished my 1 litre can I shall buy a 5 litre can from them, plus some more coolant. The coolant (Biokool14) lasts well and doesn’t seem to go off. At least it doesn’t seem to smell, even although it may be in the sump for up to a year.

 

Regards,

 

Andrew

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Hi Peter,

 

I just read another posting on gearbox oils and it was said that motor oil was not recommended as it contained detergents.  These apparently keep particles in suspension so that they can be removed by a filter.  Now that would be undesirable in a lathe gearbox where you need particles to fall out of suspension, but is it really that important for slideways?

 

I’ve used the dregs of motor oil on my slideways like you for many years and not noticed any really deleterious effects, what am I doing wrong?  I’d like to hear comments on this so please shoot me down.

 

Terry

[RJKflyerParticipant @rjkflyer]

Rocol slideway gets my vote – contains a rust inhibitor too, which is good if your equipment is in e.g. an unheated garage/shed.

 

http://www.rocol.com/corp/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=404&Itemid=413 

[blowlampParticipant @blowlamp]

I can see no real downside to using any typical low viscosity modern day engine oil. It’s designed for use in hot and cold extremes, where condensation exists and under other very arduous working conditions.

The talk of its unsuitabiliy is a little overstated in my opinion and seems to be based on the theoretical problems of it containing detergents which will hold particles in suspension – but why is that a problem and why would it be better for the swarf to remain in contact with the ways? It could be seen as academic anyway, given the likely film thickness.

By the same token, if you’ve got that much swarf floating around the headstock, then surely you’d be better off cleaning it out before filling with oil. I also doubt that much dirt will stay ‘on the bottom’ – detergent oil or not, with all the rotating components in there. After all, my wifes juicer/blender doesn’t leave much down there once it’s running at full pelt.

 

Martin.

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Well folks, I don’t know anything at all about oils, but reading what has been written above does all make sense to me, especially as I’ve known since my Beetle owning days about detergent oils. Which suggested to me that I really should change.

 

I’d already found about the headstock grease from Castrol many years ago, but perhaps rather naively thought that motor oil would do elsewhere, but when I found I could buy small quantities from Hallets I decided that hang the cost, I’ll do it. It does mean though that even though I’ve just done a major clean and relube with motor oil, I perhaps should consider doing it again but with the correct stuff this time.

 

One thing I won’t be changing is my use of Rocal Slideway spray lubricant for the cross-slide and the top-slide, reason being that I’ve got the stuff and it certainly makes them better. I won’t be doing it for the saddle/bed slideway because I keep cleaning the bed etc, and hence wiping anything off, but in anycase, there is an oil hole which allows oil to get onto the bed underneath the saddle from whence it appears to be spread around by the plastic wipers at each edge of the saddle. Therefore it’s easy to reapply an oil for the bed/saddle, but there is no such device for the other slides, hence the Rocol stuff should last considerably longer.

 

I should point out that in my case I do not have any oil bath places – it all relies on a drop here, a drop there, a drop elsewhere etc – a sort of total loss system which in turn does suggest that Martin (Blowlamp) may well have a good point in my case.

 

Anyway, I’ve done it now, so I’ll have to stick (a-hem) with it. And the old motor oil will be used for the garden shears etc,  anything else which just needs a covering of protective oil – bars of bright steel for example, and on hacksaw blades and drill bits when cutting through steel – anything not too important and for which total loss is irrelevant.

 

Regards,

 

Peter G. Shaw

 

 

 

 

[WALLACEParticipant @wallace]

Stuff from Chronos works for me – I squirts it into the odd oil nipples on my lathe as well and it seems to work ok (not for the geared head though  – that uses some synthetic gear oil I had left over from a car gearbox oil change).

 

I did try some slideway oil on my bike chain once as I thought it might last longer – but only once as all the dirt and grit from the road appeared to want to stick to it !

 

I am quite liberal with the soluble oil on my lathe – this does tend to keep things clean – any swarf etc doesn’t stick to the bed. The trick is to dry out the felt bits on the saddle with kitchen towle etc after using as these are the bits that will cause rust stains on the bed. I’ve also removed the metal covers for them as well.

 

Best thing for a geared head machine I would have thought would be to stick a magnet in it somewhere to pick up any odd bits of metal floating around in the oil.

 

But I agree with Blowlamp – the amount of loading on a lathe is minimal compaired to say a car engine. The average car gearbox transmits 100hp for hours on end – the loading and wear on a hand operated lathe saddle must be very low in comparison – just so long as it’s kep clean !!  

 

w.

Edited By WALLACE on 31/12/2010 14:24:00

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Hi Wallace,

 

You mentioned bike chains and that reminds me that there are modern PTFE lubricants which won’t allow dirt and grit to stick on exposed gears and chains.  Would not such dry lubricants work on slideways?

 

Terry

[JonParticipant @jon]

For the one lathe i have Harrison highly recommends a 68 hydraulic fluid for almost everything inc the 3 gearboxes and slides.

http://www.smithandallan.com/prodpage.aspx?id=2462

Now that works out way cheaper than any respectable car oil.

 

Lifted from their bay site.

• Excellent oxidation stability and resistance to ageing. • Good viscosity-temperature behaviour. • Good EP properties and thus protection against wear. • Excellent corrosion protection. • Good air separation properties and low foaming. • Good demulsifying properties. • Favourable behaviour with sealing materials

 

So slideways wise should be ok for coolant, worth a look at.

[WALLACEParticipant @wallace]

Hi Terry – that’s an idea -I use the GT stuff on my bike and it certainly doesn’t attract dirst like the aforementioned  slideway lubricant did.

 

But it’s not cheap and I’m dead mean !

 

W.  

[EddieParticipant @eddie]

Hi All

I am Using Chainsaw chain and bar oil.

it is designed not to fly of at highspeed and has good lubricating properties, if it does not fly ot at high speed it will not fall of at slow speed.

Simple way to protect the way by keeping them clean during the turning process;

cover the ways with kitchen paper towels, also easy cleaning later. Take the paper towel and all swarf and scraps stick to paper, coolant runoff into driptray.

Eddie

[DoddyParticipant @doddy]

I use “clingfilm” the stuff she wraps her lunch up in! to keep beds and slides clean. Its quick and easy to clean up and stays in place. Great for keeping the muck out when milling with a 3 jaw on the rotary table

Talking of which – do you lubricate or not your lathe chuck?

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Yes, after cleaning out any swarf, use on the slots and scroll.  Pratt Burnerd recommend “their” lubricant which is a klingy moly grease.  It works OK

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Hi,

 

Just in case anyone hasn’t received a letter…

 

This morning I received a letter from Halletts Oils Ltd to the effect that they have been acquired by Caldo Oils Ltd of St. Helens.

 

It seems that Caldo will be continuing the Hallett operation, including the name and ‘phone numbers, but after the transition period, the personnel will change.

 

Regards,

 

Peter G. Shaw

[Gordon AParticipant @gordona]

Hi Peter,

 

A little bit of extra information on Hallett Oils.

 

Richard Hallett is retiring and has passed the business on to Caldo Oils; although he will remain in a consultative role for a few months to assist the transfer.

 

Hopefully the products and prices will remain.!

 

Regards,

Gordon A.

[Martin WParticipant @martinw]

Hi

 

I use Mobil Vactra No2 on my Chester lathe and it seems to work very well. Bought mine from ebay in 250 ml bottles at a very reasonable price. The top and cross slide lead screws are liberally coated with Castrol MS grease. Everything seems smooth and there is never any sign of the dreaded iron oxide forming even in an unheated workshop. The oil seems to form a stable coating that doesn’t dry out or go patchy, well satisfied with the results

 

Cheers

 

Martin

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