Which lathe?

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

I would point out there is a classifieds section on this website and in the magazine if youre looking for an honest old machine.

Michael W

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

i am fortunate to have both a near mint M300 and a similar Myford S7. Personally all my fine work is done on the S7 transferring to the M300 when size matters. The rough spindle bore on the M300 has an attraction with multisize collets coming into their own, often preparing lengths of round bar stock for the S7. Swing size is also a consideration, depend upon what you wish to do.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 13:03:52:

Jason mentioned recently that his 280 runs out of steam at circa 9" dia so needs smaller cuts, That's how I read it anyway. Not surprising really but I'd bet he could modify the pulleys if needed. Some one else bought a similar lathe and the low speed range had been reduced to circa 400max, usable but probably a bit irritating to some one who often works at higher rpm's – bigger cuts at larger diameters, other types of cut will just take longer. I think Jason's low speed range tops out at 800.

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It can be stalled if I take more than 0.030" depth of cut so I tend to take about 0.025" but unlike a Myford where you would be reaching for slowest backgear the 280 is happy to run faster so really it take s no more time to machine the part. Slow range is 50-950.

10.5" dia

9.5"

Edited By JasonB on 17/02/2016 15:35:29

[Chris Evans 6Participant @chrisevans6]

The comment about the Colchester Master as a lathe for home use takes a bit of thinking about. A very desirable lathe I have used one for many years when I was at work. The size of the lathe and horsepower requirements need thinking about. Are they not around 7.5 HP ? that is a big VFD to drive one.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

I seem to remember you saying you owned a CVA at one point Jason ? In many ways especially the gap bed model along with it's equipment the dream machine if it's in the condition the manufacturers intended and that's the rub. In some ways they are better than a higher end DSG and also smaller. DSG's look like they get worked to death to me. Personally I feel Jason made a sensible choice for what he does and he does clearly do a lot of it. Way more than many.

When buying machines like the ones mentioned one easy sign of use is the noise the gear head makes. Even with a moderate load the motor will louder and with no load they should be very quite, hardly any noise at all. No clatter. I wish the buyer luck in that respect especially with any Colchester. I have used a quiet Harrison that was pretty good. Bought for a workshop and not used a lot. Just odd jobs. That's the sort of lathe to look for. Boxford VSL's sometime finish up being used like that.

There are some makes about that no one ever mentions – maybe with gear heads it's best to forget the make and concentrate on the noise and hope the home electrics can provide the power. 3kw motor is usually reckoned to be tops for the normal mains sockets. I know from another area that if 13amps is taken for long periods many plugs and socket will have problems, Past that maybe disconnect the cooker or shower or pay the supplier to install 440 3 phase. That can be cheaper than expected sometimes as the phases may be close to the meter.

I wonder what will happen when we all have to go electric with everything especially heating where 20 to 30kw boilers are pretty common.

John

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[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

On motoring forums do people choose between a lotus and a transit without even considering an estate or mpv, then get recommendations for a 7.5 tonner because of the useful tail lift?

John, they will get overspecified woodburners and realise they don't need so much when they try shifting wheelbarrow full of logs every hour.

BTW area3fitter have you thought about the nice dry warm shed to put it in yet?

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

If Gareth wants to look at what is available here might be a start.

**LINK**

Couldn't help linking to one I would go and try and it's in Wales. It also comes with it's kit. There are others on the same site. Usually known for rather high prices but in the areas that have been mentioned I don't think they are too bad now but buyer beware.

John

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[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

John, shame they got the ctr height wrong, thats a Mk3 which is a M250 in colchester colours and only has 5.5" ctr height. Now if it were a late Mk2 with the long gapped bed and 6.5" ctr height it would be worth the trip

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

I'm all right Jack, I mean Jason I'm more or less happy with my 5". I mean boxford.

Lathes co reckon all 2000 are 6 1/2 ".

It's rare to see something like that with all of it bits – except a collets.

Having looked again though I suspect it needs gears to cut all pitches.

John

=

Edited By Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 19:59:56

Edited By Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 20:02:23

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 19:55:40:

Lathes co reckon all 2000 are 6 1/2 ".

 

 

5.7 is nearer 5 1/2" than 6 1/2"

Its only the later Mk2 2000 that have the 6.5"

Edited By JasonB on 17/02/2016 20:06:57

[JonParticipant @jon]

Posted by Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 16:59:19:I wonder what will happen when we all have to go electric with everything especially heating where 20 to 30kw boilers are pretty common. John

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I have enough trouble powering a 7.5KW inverter to power a 2.25KW motor.

Not all L series Harrisons were imperial take the 140 an updated 11".

At last thanks Jason for the videos confirming what no one has ever been able to do unbiased.
Cant do a video comparison an action still will have to do taken around 14 years ago. Although aluminium 6082 facing cut 1/2" one pass 1000rpm, same motor size as WM280. Motor on picky starts to murmer at 3/8" depth of cut facing off, with various steels ie cast that's around 1/4" face off.

The Harrison 140 half the cost of a WM280.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by JasonB on 17/02/2016 20:06:03:

Posted by Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 19:55:40:

Lathes co reckon all 2000 are 6 1/2 ".

 

 

5.7 is nearer 5 1/2" than 6 1/2"

Its only the later Mk2 2000 that have the 6.5"

Edited By JasonB on 17/02/2016 20:06:57

Yes. Should have looked further down the page, It has tapered gib strips on the cross slide so some one may even have kept it properly adjusted.

I should have said 2hp for normal mains sockets. Not sure about 2hp through an inverter.. I did have a Viceroy for a while that had a 2hp single phase motor.

I've taken 0.4" plus off 6" diameter aluminium in one cut on a Taig. I doubt if it could be done with indexed tipped tools though. Main problem eventually was being able to see the lathe and the dustmen spotted the sward and said industrial waste and wouldn't take it away.

John

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Edited By Ajohnw on 17/02/2016 21:10:15

[Gordon AParticipant @gordona]

A consideration not mentioned when choosing a lathe is accessibility to the workshop for transportation.

I know someone who bought a Boxford model A and needed to install it in his cellar down some very awkward steps.

4 strong men and 8 cans of Stella were needed to complete the job!

Gordon.

[Brian JohnParticipant @brianjohn93961]

Do NOT buy an Optimum lathe !

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

Chris , the Master has a 5hp motor,its the larger Triumph that has the 7.5 hp motor,my master runs off a static transwave converter ,its ok but I have a feeling that I am not getting a full 5 hp probably due to the very rural supply and a long way from the meter box. if the lathe speed was kept to below 1200 rpm then a smaller motor say 3 hp would be adequate, The higher hp motors were used to up the speed to 2500 for production turning with carbide, I find that the use of the high speeds is not essential,and I do not want to blow my converter.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Brian John on 18/02/2016 06:04:43:

Do NOT buy an Optimum lathe !

That may not be fair Brian. It seemed to me that one glaring problem caused others – the lead screw mounting. It might be a baby lathe one off, a really bad one and it could also be that the problem doesn't exist on other models.

That's the problem – until some one buys one there is no way of telling.

John

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[JAParticipant @ja]

Posted by Brian John on 18/02/2016 06:04:43:

Do NOT buy an Optimum lathe !

I am sure I should be aware of the Optimum lathe but am not. It does not feature in Tony Griffiths's archives (www.lathe.co.uk). Is it a modern day Adept?

JA

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by JA on 18/02/2016 11:40:13:

Posted by Brian John on 18/02/2016 06:04:43:

Do NOT buy an Optimum lathe !

I am sure I should be aware of the Optimum lathe but am not. It does not feature in Tony Griffiths's archives (www.lathe.co.uk). Is it a modern day Adept?

JA

.

Now justly infamous … based on Brian's experience.

MichaelG.

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

I always like "What Lathe?" threads, it is a useful in exercise in airing ones prejudices. However, until we know what the OP wishes to make, how much space he has, how much money, how much other kit (a Mill .e.g.) – how can we possibly make any judgement? I wouldn't use a Colchester for watchmaking or a Myford for refurbishing a Centurian tank.

I suspect that many people start out, like I did, just wanting a lathe without any real plan as to what I was going to do with it. I started with an old Zyto because that's what came along. At least if you start small it is easier to sell the old lathe and get something which is relevant to whatever home engineering route you choose to take.

Rod

[area3fitterParticipant @area3fitter]

Thanks again everyone for the comments,

in answer to Roderick's post, I have around 3-4k available and interms of what I would like to be doing is just projects I guess and anything that takes my fancy. It will go in my garage which is warm and dry so no problems there.

Taking an earlier comment about WARCO lathes into account, I had a look at their website today and found the lathe that I think is referred to, the GH1236 with DRO for 3k ish.. Also close to it is the GH1322 but the price with DRO pushes it towards the 3.5k area. It appears well specced with a good number of accessories. What are the views on quality though. It is from the far east but a lot of stuff is at the moment.

Would the more experienced folk here recommend a metric or imperial lathe?

thanks

gareth

[JAParticipant @ja]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 18/02/2016 11:52:04:

Posted by JA on 18/02/2016 11:40:13:

Posted by Brian John on 18/02/2016 06:04:43:

Do NOT buy an Optimum lathe !

I am sure I should be aware of the Optimum lathe but am not. It does not feature in Tony Griffiths's archives (www.lathe.co.uk). Is it a modern day Adept?

JA

.

Now justly infamous … based on Brian's experience.

MichaelG.

I should have been aware of the Optimum lathe having followed the thread on Brian's lathe. The one thing I ignored was the make! It was just a Chinese lathe.

JA

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

With a DRO fitted metric/imperial does not come into it quite so much as you can have either at the press of a button. Where the DRO can't help is with screwcutting, if you see yourself more likely to be cutting metric threads then go with a metric lathe which will have a metric leadscrew, if more imperial pitches then go for an imperial machine. But like I have said before I may only screwcut once or twice a yesr so its not an issue for me. Same applied to turning large diameters and a bit of a loss in power on the variable speed machines, I only do a couple of large diameters a year so can live with it.

The far eastern machines in these price brackets are not finished to the same standards as more expensive ones but I have found both my mill and lathe can produce good work even if they are a bit rough around the edges. I (touch wood) have had very little trouble from either machine.

J

[MalcBParticipant @malcb52554]

The choice of Metric vs Imperial:

I was told in 1967 when I served my apprenticeship to start thinking and buying Metric tackle.

WRONG – when I semi retired 3 1/2 years ago we were still working in both metric and imperial alongside of each other. It's been like that all through my engineering life.

The choice really is down to what you intend to do. If you have any contact with USA items or old British stuff them imperial is advantageous. All else will be Metric. The Stuart beam engine I am almost at the end of is all imperial. I have no experience with any other kits available but others on here will advise.

At the moment I only have a metric Boxford which I hope to replace shortly. I personally also like the Warco lathes from all the imports, but I have only had British lathes before. My last lathe when I had the room was a Colchester Master. My choice will more than likely be another ex British machine like the Bantum 2000 or even something like the Boxford 330 toolroom lathe like what's running on EBay at the moment.

I served my time In the toolroom on lathes such as Hardinge HLV, the Monarch 10EE and DSG toolroom lathes.

If you buy a new machine make sure it's one that can cope with both metric and imperial threads if you intend doing any screwcutting.

DRO will sort anything else for you as it's just one button to switch between either. With your budget DRO for me is a MUST HAVE.

[Gray62Participant @gray62]

Posted by area3fitter on 18/02/2016 17:10:24:

Thanks again everyone for the comments,

Taking an earlier comment about WARCO lathes into account, I had a look at their website today and found the lathe that I think is referred to, the GH1236 with DRO for 3k ish.. Also close to it is the GH1322 but the price with DRO pushes it towards the 3.5k area. It appears well specced with a good number of accessories. What are the views on quality though. It is from the far east but a lot of stuff is at the moment.

Would the more experienced folk here recommend a metric or imperial lathe?

I've had a Warco GH1330 (long bed version of the 1322) for about 5 years now and I honestly cannot fault it. There are a few minor criticisms I could raise but these are more to do with the way I work than of the machine itself or a quality issue.

I removed the leadscrew covers as these limit the travel of the carriage especially close to the headstock and make using a faceplate a bit restrictive. I've recently changed the motor for a 3 phase with inverter setup. Although not necessary, it is an improvement having the variable speed as I now change gear ranges less often.

Imperial or metric – it makes no difference other than to what you are used to. Both of my machines are imperial as is the mill but that is just because that is what I am used to. If the lathe has DRO fitted then switching between the two is easy and makes the choice pretty academic.

If you are able to it would be worth getting to Warco's showroom and having a look at the machines in the flesh

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 18/02/2016 12:51:53:

I always like "What Lathe?" threads, it is a useful in exercise in airing ones prejudices. However, until we know what the OP wishes to make, how much space he has, how much money, how much other kit (a Mill .e.g.) – how can we possibly make any judgement? I wouldn't use a Colchester for watchmaking or a Myford for refurbishing a Centurian tank.

I suspect that many people start out, like I did, just wanting a lathe without any real plan as to what I was going to do with it. I started with an old Zyto because that's what came along. At least if you start small it is easier to sell the old lathe and get something which is relevant to whatever home engineering route you choose to take.

Rod

It's funny how that problem often comes along Rod. It sometimes does seem to waking up one day and wanting a lathe. I'd guess you obtained a much better idea of what it's all about and what you need via the Zyto.

John

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