Recommend a mid- range vice please

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

My Vertex VJ-400 jaws are 4" wide and nominal 1 1/2" – 40 mm high which I find a very acceptable compromise. Even though most of my work is 12" to the foot scale most jobs need a parallel underneath to get the cut plane above the jaws and a goodly proportion of the remainder don't actually need the full depth. I suspect that the shallower jaws on the DH-1 will in practice be perfectly adequate for model components.

Looks to be fairly easy to make special jaws for the DH-1 should you have a difficult or overlarge component to handle. Although jaws specially machined for the job are popularly considered an "only affordable by industry" thing we home shop types would probably benefit by making more use of such things. Despite the "waste" of material. I know I'll spend silly time on a difficult set up 'cos I'm too tight to waste that "too good to use" lump of metal thats been hanging around for 20+ years!

But I'm the guy who went out and got another bit same size for a job that never happened! And I still can't bring myself to use either.

Hafta say I'm almost glad that the DH-1 and the two varieties of versatile / angle-lock clone vices weren't around when I was shopping for mine. Choosing which would have been a major league headache. At the time the VJ-400 was the only affordable alternative to the common style of vice which all suffer from a rather restricted opening unless very large. Typically ordinary vice capacity is more or less square with opening similar to jaw width which always seemed too restrictive for the wide variety of work we do.

On balance I still think the VJ-400 is the best one and only vice option. But how much of that is due to my way of working being adapted to what I have along with an (understandable) desire to support my particular choice I know not. Whatever its clearly a close call. Although I'm unconvinced of the validity of the Kurt angle lock system when applied to premium vice it makes a lot of sense at the economy end as a way of maintaining performance with the wider tolerances needed to hit a usefully lower price. If I wasn't wedded to mine I'd probably go for the Arc SG version of the versatile vice as it seems better engineered than the other style. But I'd miss the swivel base. Swivel bases are a real Marmite feature love (I do) or hate.

One easily overlooked potential issue with the versatile vices is that the full length open channel makes it harder to use a Vee block on its side to adequately hold round work vertical. Something I do quite often as the VJ-400 has a ledge in front of the fixed jaw that is just the right size for my second best Vee blocks. Of course the open channel does provide more room to drop a taller job down through the jaws into the body of the vice. I need block to cover the ledge for that.

Clive.

[John ReeseParticipant @johnreese12848]

I have used numerous vises over the years. Early on they were all the type with the screw in line with the moveable jaw. I had constant problems getting my work seated against the bed of the vise due to the movable jaw lifting. In the 1970s I bought my first Kurt vise. I never have problems with jaw lift since that purchase. I have two Kurt clones on my Bridgeport clone and a "screwless" grinding vise on my RF45.

I encourage everyone buying a vise to look at the Kurt clones or the "screwless" grinding vises.

[Ross Lloyd 1Participant @rosslloyd1]

Posted by John Hinkley on 23/06/2018 08:13:18:

Ross,

Up withe lark and I've taken a couple of pictures …..

John

 

Hi John

Wow thanks so much for taking those shots for me! Do you need to make a special clamping arrangement or will bog standard vice strap clamps [I might be using an americanism there, if so please don't beat me with a rolled up union jack  ] do the job just as well? EDIT: Do you know if its possible to fit a swivel?

 

Edited By Ross Lloyd 1 on 25/06/2018 00:36:55

[Ross Lloyd 1Participant @rosslloyd1]

Posted by John Reese on 24/06/2018 01:36:33:

I have used numerous vises over the years. Early on they were all the type with the screw in line with the moveable jaw. I had constant problems getting my work seated against the bed of the vise due to the movable jaw lifting. In the 1970s I bought my first Kurt vise. I never have problems with jaw lift since that purchase. I have two Kurt clones on my Bridgeport clone and a "screwless" grinding vise on my RF45.

I encourage everyone buying a vise to look at the Kurt clones or the "screwless" grinding vises.

I do like the look of that design, hopefully I can find an affordable one.

Thanks!

[Ross Lloyd 1Participant @rosslloyd1]

Posted by Clive Foster on 23/06/2018 11:24:17:

One easily overlooked potential issue with the versatile vices is that the full length open channel makes it harder to use a Vee block on its side to adequately hold round work vertical. Something I do quite often as the VJ-400 has a ledge in front of the fixed jaw that is just the right size for my second best Vee blocks. Of course the open channel does provide more room to drop a taller job down through the jaws into the body of the vice. I need block to cover the ledge for that.

Clive.

Thank you for the comprehensive advice, and thats a great point about the vee blocks, The choice is bewildering Too much choice is a good problem to have though

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Is one vise ever the optimum? From all the previous comments it would appear there is no single vise that is ideal for everyone.

A vise which ‘does everything’ likely does none perfectly.

Compromise is clearly necessary, after considering the typical usage pattern.

[Neil LickfoldParticipant @neillickfold44316]

The kurt type or clones of the Kurt vice is the best way to go. The biggest advantage is the mechanism that pulls the sliding jaw down as it closes. The best part is not needing to tap down the part in the jaws. There is another American brand that have another system that is new, is is even better again, by the Chick work holding company. http://www.chickworkholding.com/

These are too new I think for their to be knock offs yet. My Kurt clone is mad in Taiwan, and I am very very happy with it. After seeing the Chick vises at the Emex show in Auckland, I am going to make my own version of their quick change Jaw mechanism. My 4 inch version has jaws that are 110 mm wide. This is the one I bought a few months ago. After using it for a only a short time, would not want anything else.

It is a time saver as well. You don't waste time tapping down the work piece etc etc. And the handle only needs a light load on it t clamp things very tight. The little mound around is good as it will catch any fluids etc as well.

Just my penny's worth. Neil L

[Anonymous]

No point in looking at genuine Kurt vices; they don't do one small enough. They seem to have dropped the smallest vice in their range. It's been replaced by a similar model number, but with a 6.5" opening rather than 4". That'll be big! I've got one of their 8.8" opening vices and it's about as big as you'd want even on a Bridgeport.

Personally I wouldn't even contemplate a swivel base. On the very rare occasions I've needed to mill at a specific angle (once or twice in more than 10 years) I just swivel the whole vice and indicate against angle blocks.

Andrew

[Author]

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