ML7 Hand Crank / Wheel?

[Dr_GMJNParticipant @dr_gmjn]

Posted by bernard towers on 24/02/2021 18:53:38:

Sorry but mine doesn’t WHIP ROUND it disengages itself as soon as you take you hand off

The Hemmingway version doesn’t disengage as far as I can see, and that was what I was going to get, so it’s better than that.

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

The genuine Myford one doesn't disengage either

[Martin DowingParticipant @martindowing58466]

There is a genuine Mayford accessory meant exactly for your envisaged jobs and it it called a crank.

I have bought it direcly in Myford works (Beeston) while factory still existed.

It can be installed easily and tightened by means of split mandrell and tapered cone.

It can also be released easily, all done in seconds.

I am using it with every success and it is really handy for example for setting job in 4 jaw with an aid of clock and it is holding strong enough to tap M12 in steel with no problems.

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

I would recommend unplugging the lathe motor from the power source before using any sort of handle or handwheel in the outside end of the spindle of any lathe. Very unlikely that anyone could get hurt by a handle or handwheel if the power to the lathe is off. Better to be super cautious with this rather than get hurt by a momentary loss of concentration / wrong move, in my opinion.

[Dr_GMJNParticipant @dr_gmjn]

Just to complete the thread – I finally got this done:

I made a split spindle to fit in the lathe shaft, and a brass cone to fit in the end to expand it and lock it in place:

The steering wheel has a location taper, which I tried to replicate. I made the taper separately, and Loctited and through-pinned it to the shaft with brass pins, before machining flush. I also turned a thread on the end of the spigot for the retaining collar – I could have done with a hand crank for that! It took some messing about with to get the threads to work on the collar I'd also threaded, but threading seems to be problematic for a lot of folks, so no surprises there:

Then I needed a locking wheel to pull the cone into the shaft. I thought I go for a wheel spinner/propeller type thing to make it look a bit interesting, and be nice to use. I made one by a combination of milling and turning. I tried to mill to marked-out lines. It kind of worked, but it's a good job it didn't need to fit into anything!

Here are the component parts I made, along with the wheel:

And here it is all assembled:

Fits very easily into the spindle, and it only takes 1/4 turn to lock it solid:

I can easily turn it while messing about at the far end of the tailstock – it works really nicely:

Also found a place to store it – in a block screwed to the inside of my lathe stand:

The wheel itself is un-modified, so if I decide to re-fit it to the car, no problem.

Cheers!

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Try this

[Frank GorseParticipant @frankgorse]

I like Bernard’s version myself,are there any drawings anywhere to save me from making several scrap ones?

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

If you use a mandrel crank, as I do very occasionally (and find it usually slips), the obvious precaution is switching off at the mains.

As a using aid though it's also worth slacking the belt from the countershaft, to reduce the drag given by trying to rotate the motor as well as lathe.

(I've done that to use my Meddings bench-drill as a tapping-device.)

'

(I've a mischievous mental image of a certain car with a small tiller stamped 'Myford', in place of its steering-wheel…)

[Dr_GMJNParticipant @dr_gmjn]

Posted by Nigel Graham 2 on 27/03/2021 22:06:04:

If you use a mandrel crank, as I do very occasionally (and find it usually slips), the obvious precaution is switching off at the mains.

As a using aid though it's also worth slacking the belt from the countershaft, to reduce the drag given by trying to rotate the motor as well as lathe.

(I've done that to use my Meddings bench-drill as a tapping-device.)

'

(I've a mischievous mental image of a certain car with a small tiller stamped 'Myford', in place of its steering-wheel…)

Ha ha no, the car has it’s original wheel fitted at the moment.

My ML7 has a clutch, so there’s no motor drag, just a bit from the belts, but that’s no issue.

Having cobbled together a crank temporarily, I think a wheel is much better solution, at least for threading, for a number of reasons:

1) The part you need to grab hold of to turn (ie the rim) is always in the same place, and is always visible from the front of the lathe.

2) You’re not stretching to get a complete revolution because you can increment the rim round.

3) Your body is naturally closer to the centre of the lathe because there’s no handle projecting away from where you’re working.

4) It’s far better balanced for rapid turning with a finger when reversing the leadscrew.

5) If you accidentally turn the lathe on, theres virtually no vibration due to imbalance.

In addition, a wooden rim, to me, has a much nicer feel than a piece of metal bar. So I’ll be sticking with my version.

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Well Doc i still think it is naff & needs to be on my wall. If my F-type did not have an air bag & a million controls on it i would put it on there. It would look so much nicer.

Steve

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

Ok a steering wheel is better /safer than a handle,a disc of aluminium with a round rim and recessed in the centre,with no holes or spokes would be safer.some larger lathes had 5c collet tubes with a round disc to tighten the collets and these could be safe when operating/rotating under power, I would have thought that care would have to be taken with a steering wheel as this could put a lot of torque on the tap,which can then put too much torque on the tailstock,the Myford tailstock barrel has only a small key to prevent rotation and the jacobs chuck relies on just the morse taper ,damage this taper and the machine is no longer an accurate centre lathe. Larger taps than BA or 1/4 whit can be held in place with a spring loaded centre and held on the flats with a spanner,Every time I use the S7 to tap a small hole I always curse and have to rotate the chuck by hand,a reversing motor would take just as long as the motor has to be switched off ,come to a standstill then started in reverse,The ideal situation would be a pair of clutches on the Myford to give near instant forward /reverse,in olden days when lathes with flat belts had the line shaft overhead,with power off the belt could be grabbed and pulled either up or down to give instant forward /or reverse.

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

A friend of mine has a Boxford with a handwheel fitted behind the chuck! It looks like a standard fitting.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

There are some 5C chucks that have a similar wheel that are popular in the US but you don't see them much over here

[Mike PooleParticipant @mikepoole82104]

The steering wheel brings a bit of fun to the workshop but even my standard pattern handle will slip. I would be concerned about distorting the spindle if I had to tighten the taper lock enough to resist the torque available from such a large wheel. Of course if the purpose is to make life very easy rather than apply huge force then no need to worry.

Mike

[Dr_GMJNParticipant @dr_gmjn]

Posted by Nigel McBurney 1 on 28/03/2021 09:39:53:

Ok a steering wheel is better /safer than a handle,a disc of aluminium with a round rim and recessed in the centre,with no holes or spokes would be safer.some larger lathes had 5c collet tubes with a round disc to tighten the collets and these could be safe when operating/rotating under power, I would have thought that care would have to be taken with a steering wheel as this could put a lot of torque on the tap,which can then put too much torque on the tailstock,the Myford tailstock barrel has only a small key to prevent rotation and the jacobs chuck relies on just the morse taper ,damage this taper and the machine is no longer an accurate centre lathe. Larger taps than BA or 1/4 whit can be held in place with a spring loaded centre and held on the flats with a spanner,Every time I use the S7 to tap a small hole I always curse and have to rotate the chuck by hand,a reversing motor would take just as long as the motor has to be switched off ,come to a standstill then started in reverse,The ideal situation would be a pair of clutches on the Myford to give near instant forward /reverse,in olden days when lathes with flat belts had the line shaft overhead,with power off the belt could be grabbed and pulled either up or down to give instant forward /or reverse.

I’m not sure how I could damage anything by excess torque. I’m using a tailstock die holder with a hand lever to stop rotation. For taps I’m using a spring centre in conjunction with either a hand tap holder (the one with a chuck), or a tap wrench. For very small taps I’m using a pin drill chuck, held so it rotates freely in a tailstock chuck. I put a small bar through to hold it from rotating. ETA I’m only using small taps and dies for model steam engines: 8BA up to M10 kind of size occasionally for other random projects. I’m not wanting or hoping to apply high torques here.

None of the above transfers any torque to the tailstock. There might be more torque, but I think there’s also more control because your hand is always applying load downwards in the same area rather than your arm stretching while moving in a circle.

When hand threading with a tap or die I’m constantly backing off the tool every half turn or so to break the chips, and the wheel is ideal for that.

If I want to reverse the leadscrew when screwcutting (with the saddle engaged), I can just put a finger against a spoke and it spins freely and rapidly backwards with very little effort because there’s no heavy lump of unbalanced handle deal with.

If I accidentally started the lathe with it fitted, to injure myself I’d have to: 1) not notice the wheel was spinning and 2) put my arm through the spokes ie in a motion longitudinal to the lathe axis. I genuinely can’t see any risk of that whatsoever. With an unbalanced handle spinning around there’s a far higher volume where you could get seriously hurt.

I’m not suggesting anyone goes out and buys a steering wheel to make a hand turning device, just that this is what I’ve done with an unused thing I had around, to make something I needed. I’ve seen some people use old bike cranks, but to me they don’t save much machining time and look a bit naff. It cost me nothing to make a shaft for the wheel, and gave me some much needed practice in milling, turning and thread cutting. It works well, and it’s still what I think is a nice display item in the garage – just as it was previously hanging on the wall. At the end of the day, I can unscrew two grub screws and a lock ring and it’s an untouched steering wheel again. That’s really all it is.

Edited By Dr_GMJN on 28/03/2021 11:23:18

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